Religion and Ethics Forum
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Keith Maitland on August 22, 2015, 04:52:33 AM
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The Pollyanna Principal is the tendency for individuals to remember previous pleasure as being much more significant than previous pain.
For example, I can remember getting a good score on a test that happened three months ago, but it is difficult for me to be able to visualize the headache I had a day ago.
Suffering seems to be a much more potent feeling than pleasure, except when it comes to memory.
It is my own personal theory that since we base so much of our decisions and lives on memories, and we tend to focus much more intensely on the pleasurable aspects of our past, that this gives us a kind of motivation to keep going, to expect the future will also be like this.
This stems from a general observation that I've had concerning how people evaluate their lives; most people think their lives are alright, and I've been wondering why this is the case and why they don't realize their lives aren't as great as they think they are. I'm wondering if Pollyanneanism is some kind of drug that masks reality and allows people to be happy, considering substantial scientific research has shown that people who think this way take longer to realize negative things in their lives, and "overestimate" the positive.
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You want people to feel negative about their lives?!
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You want people to feel negative about their lives?!
In which paragraph did Keith state this, please?
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You want people to feel negative about their lives?!
In which paragraph did Keith state this, please?
"...most people think their lives are alright, and I've been wondering why this is the case and why they don't realize their lives aren't as great as they think they are".
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You want people to feel negative about their lives?!
In which paragraph did Keith state this, please?
"...most people think their lives are alright, and I've been wondering why this is the case and why they don't realize their lives aren't as great as they think they are".
That's not a statement of Keith's wanting people to feel negative about their lives though is it, as you wrote?
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I am not in a mood to argue pointlessly with you ...Shaker. Do it on your own.
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I always felt guilty that my most vivid memories from my childhood were of bad things, until I realised that as a parent it was imperative that I remembered how this stuff felt in order not to allow my children to go through the same thing.
Obviously having kids means you really have to keep going. But I've had a lot of grim stuff in the past decade and I don't feel particularly Pollyanna-ish about any of it. But from it I've learned what matters and what doesn't - above all that freedom is beyond price - and although circumstances mean I'm not quite where I want to be yet I've realised that the journey is as important as arriving - if we ever do.
Something else that having kids has brought home to me is that they naturally have a huge passion for life, a zest for adventure and an optimism that things will be good. I cant remember ever feeling like that but they are good to be around to get those feelings back.
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Aside from being a parent it's the small things that make life beautiful. Keith and I have discussed this before, but as far as I'm concerned as long as there are clouds to gaze at, trees above me, the smell of freshly cut hay in the breeze and a furry companion by my side, the world's ok.
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The Pollyanna Principal is the tendency for individuals to remember previous pleasure as being much more significant than previous pain.
That's surely to do with the purpose of pain i.e. that it is a homeostatic mechanism there to tell us that we are not in a state of stability.
That's why occasions of utter euphoria are also hard to recreate in the memory.
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I think one has to try to put one's life in perspective. On the whole I think I have had a very fortunate one compared to many. True the religious element of my childhood didn't do me any favours, but in other ways it wasn't a bad one. I grew up on a wonderful island and had much more freedom to explore and do my own thing than most kids today. I was extremely fond of my maternal grandmother who moved from the UK to an apartment in our home in 1952, before returning to the UK not long before I moved there in 1969, when I married. Grancie's apartment was my refuge when I was in the deep proverbial with my parents, as was often the case; I did the craziest things, often putting my life in danger! (Not much has changed in that respect! ::) )
I have been married for 46 years and have wonderful children and grandchildren. Yes it is sad my husband has been brain damaged for nearly nine years, but that is life.
I hope I have some good years left, before my kids finally decide on the cliff they threaten to chuck me off when I get too senile! ;D ;D ;D
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Surely , given we are subjective beings, how we think our lives are is how they are? The problem with trying to apply a layer of objectivity, as Keith supposed he is doing, is that it is merely his subjectivity that he is using to evaluate other people's lives on scales which remain subjective.
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NS, it's all just a story. The question is what meaning do we give to the story. Sometimes the best option may be to have no meaning at all - clouds, Sky, grass, dog have no meaning, but perhaps they also provide all the meaning we need.
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Meaning - of the ultimate rather than proximate kind anyway - seems like a prison to me, a cage to be held captive in.
Fortunately there's absolutely no indication that there are any ultimate meanings to be had.
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Suffering seems to be a much more potent feeling than pleasure, except when it comes to memory.
If that is the case, perhaps it is because of a tendency of people to want to repeat what causes pleasure and so it becomes reinforced as a memory trace. Whereas pain (unless it leads to pleasure) tends to be avoided and perhaps more easily suppressed unless it is highly traumatic, in which case the remembered pain finds other outlets as in post traumatic stress disorders.
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Meaning - of the ultimate rather than proximate kind anyway - seems like a prison to me, a cage to be held captive in.
Fortunately there's absolutely no indication that there are any ultimate meanings to be had.
For me life having 'meaning' means having a valid reason to get out of bed. Nothing more.
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Yes ekim, we repeat those things that give us pleasure and try to avoid those that cause anxiety or pain. That includes rehearsing and reinforcing any lessons learned through memory. At a very simplistic level at least - we probably need a slightly more sophisticated theory to compare the fun of being on a roller coaster ride with the pain of falling off a bike. Or drug or gambling addictions, schadenfreude, music.
We may have evolved to be this way, our real "selves" being unimportant. As far as nature is concerned we exist for the benefit, continued existence in some form, of the group - more than for individuals. This could support Keiths view that the true nature of reality is hidden from us: Optimism is better than pessimism for reproducing the species, though individually pessimists live longer as they are better at avoiding risks.
Also may explain aspects of religion - the expectation of happiness being possible even after death.
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As ever it is a time to quote the great philosopher Angel ' When nothing you do matters, all that matters is what you do'
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Meaning - of the ultimate rather than proximate kind anyway - seems like a prison to me, a cage to be held captive in.
Fortunately there's absolutely no indication that there are any ultimate meanings to be had.
For me life having 'meaning' means having a valid reason to get out of bed. Nothing more.
I'm not disagreeing. But there are the ultimate, one-size-fits-all meanings that religions (especially theistic and especially especially monotheistic religions) purport to provide (falsely, AFAIC) and then there are the proximate meanings - subjective; individual; temporary - by which other people live their lives (the only ones as I see it).
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As ever it is a time to quote the great philosopher Angel ' When nothing you do matters, all that matters is what you do'
Hadn't encountered that before, but I like it :)
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If a robot is programmed to collect bananas I think we can all agree that collecting bananas will be seem meaningful to it (?).
If the robot understands that it is designed for banana collection, is banana collection still meaningful?
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Because the robot then understands that its meaning is imposed from the outside, you mean?
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Meaning - of the ultimate rather than proximate kind anyway - seems like a prison to me, a cage to be held captive in.
Fortunately there's absolutely no indication that there are any ultimate meanings to be had.
For me life having 'meaning' means having a valid reason to get out of bed. Nothing more.
I'm not disagreeing. But there are the ultimate, one-size-fits-all meanings that religions (especially theistic and especially especially monotheistic religions) purport to provide (falsely, AFAIC) and then there are the proximate meanings - subjective; individual; temporary - by which other people live their lives (the only ones as I see it).
That's their problem.
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Alas it isn't just their problem, because history shows that when people become so utterly, rigidly, unshakeably convinced of the absolute rightness of their meaning, be it Catholicism, fascism, Stalinism or similar, they tend to want to impose that meaning on others.
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Because the robot then understands that its meaning is imposed from the outside, you mean?
Yes, or it somehow evolved to collect bananas.
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Because the robot then understands that its meaning is imposed from the outside, you mean?
Yes, or it somehow evolved to collect bananas.
If the robot is able to develop sufficient intelligence it could come to know that it evolved.
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Sue, but after that does collecting bananas have any meaning? I don't think it can.
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Sue, but after that does collecting bananas have any meaning? I don't think it can.
As I am wont to say, ultimate meaning? No. But I think those who chase such things are chasing shadows. Proximate meaning, sure.
Camus famously concluded The Myth of Sisyphus by saying that we should think of Sisyphus as happy if his endless rolling of the massive rock up the hill, then trudging down to the bottom to roll it up the hill all over again, can be imbued with meaning for Sisyphus, not anybody else observing him. If Sisyphus can find a meaning in it for himself, then it has meaning to that extent. I agree.
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Alas it isn't just their problem, because history shows that when people become so utterly, rigidly, unshakeably convinced of the absolute rightness of their meaning, be it Catholicism, fascism, Stalinism or similar, they tend to want to impose that meaning on others.
Frankl decided he was free from Naziism and anti-semitism from within a concentration camp. I might not have his resolve of character but I've fought so hard to be free, I'm not about to let others take my right to choose away from me, and right now I choose not to give a jack about the stupidity of those who think they have all the answers.
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Quite!
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The value is remembering how hurtful events in life are so one is more aware of the suffering that is out there. It will happen again and again and again.
But, it seems like it won't be so bad due to the Pollyanna Principle.
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You've been reading David Benatar - am I right, Keith?
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Can we get any justification why one subjective evaluation is more correct than another subjective evaluation from Keith?
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The Pollyanna Principal is the tendency for individuals to remember previous pleasure as being much more significant than previous pain.
This seems broadly right to me, and it operates on many levels. I always remember my rugby master at school telling us that the body forgets pain; if it were not the case, boxers wouldn't box, women would never have a second child. We are masters at self deception, we tend to think we are better looking than we really are; we think we are better drivers than we really are. We develop multifarious ways to avoid facing up to unpallatable realities. We organise news bulletins to finish with sport and weather, so that no matter how awful the news, the final word is always on something light, the sugar after the pill, and the world is alright again.
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Hardly. News and weather are relatively trivial. Especially England cricket. Something would be very wrong with news that opened with them.
I have been in extreme physical pain that drove me almost insane - literally, it was this that tipped the balance with my anxiety and landed me in hospital. I only wish that I could forget how that felt; instead I'm now hypersensitive to pain and have to talk myself down every time I get so much as a sore throat. I can't even begin to explain how annoying it is.
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The value is remembering how hurtful events in life are so one is more aware of the suffering that is out there. It will happen again and again and again.
But, it seems like it won't be so bad due to the Pollyanna Principle.
Another way of looking at it is that physical pain demonstrates the boundaries of our physical body. It is quite likely that we all have different pain thresholds ranging from the highly sensitive to insensitive. Some people attempt to challenge their pain threshold by indulging in painful pursuits etc.
As regards 'mental' pain or fear, it is likely that the more you dwell upon it the more you will experience it, just as the more you chase after pleasure the more you are likely to experience it. Both tend to take you away from experiencing the present as the former seems to be past oriented and the latter future oriented. I don't know what the Pollyanna Principle is but perhaps it is associated with focusing more upon what is present rather than what is absent.
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Yes, that makes sense. The thing with news media for example is that there's usually very little featured on it that we have any control over. We can either worry about it or let it go, and I suspect our ability to do that depends on our past experiences of trauma and loss - I know it is for me.
But neither the past experience nor imagined fearful future are here now. What is present is me, loved ones, sofa, TV. That isn't Pollyanna-ish, just reality, but if we live too much in the past or future we lose the magic of the extraordinary ordinary going on around us.
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Yes, that makes sense. The thing with news media for example is that there's usually very little featured on it that we have any control over. We can either worry about it or let it go, and I suspect our ability to do that depends on our past experiences of trauma and loss - I know it is for me.
But neither the past experience nor imagined fearful future are here now. What is present is me, loved ones, sofa, TV. That isn't Pollyanna-ish, just reality, but if we live too much in the past or future we lose the magic of the extraordinary ordinary going on around us.
Yes, it's as if the mass media is dedicated to creating an addiction to misery and cameras are almost compelled to linger until people can't hold back their tears. It was a bit different during the last war, when there was just cinema and radio. The broadcasts were more focused upon optimism, morale boosting and happy endings. Nowadays they seem to be playing the 'Ain't it awful' game.
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Yes, that makes sense. The thing with news media for example is that there's usually very little featured on it that we have any control over. We can either worry about it or let it go, and I suspect our ability to do that depends on our past experiences of trauma and loss - I know it is for me.
But neither the past experience nor imagined fearful future are here now. What is present is me, loved ones, sofa, TV. That isn't Pollyanna-ish, just reality, but if we live too much in the past or future we lose the magic of the extraordinary ordinary going on around us.
Yes, it's as if the mass media is dedicated to creating an addiction to misery and cameras are almost compelled to linger until people can't hold back their tears. It was a bit different during the last war, when there was just cinema and radio. The broadcasts were more focused upon optimism, morale boosting and happy endings. Nowadays they seem to be playing the 'Ain't it awful' game.
They are addicted to getting viewers. For whatever reason the more extreme the reporting, the more they get. The story is always the worst case scenario. Perhaps it is because viewers are no longer so adept at telling fact from Hollywood fiction.
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::)
Some people are never happy unless they can find something to be miserable about"
What's worse is they have to keep justifying it.
::)
Some time ago I had some radiotherapy treatment which at the time destroyed my ability to taste anything except for bitterness. I found myself gravitating towards foods with bitterness in them, no matter how subtle, because that was better than tasting nothing. I sometimes wonder if there is a psychological equivalent i.e. it's better to feel bitterness or misery or emotional pain in one's life than feel nothing and such people gravitate towards it.
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::)
Some people are never happy unless they can find something to be miserable about"
What's worse is they have to keep justifying it.
::)
Some time ago I had some radiotherapy treatment which at the time destroyed my ability to taste anything except for bitterness. I found myself gravitating towards foods with bitterness in them, no matter how subtle, because that was better than tasting nothing. I sometimes wonder if there is a psychological equivalent i.e. it's better to feel bitterness or misery or emotional pain in one's life than feel nothing and such people gravitate towards it.
Yes...I think so. The human ego craves sense experience and emotional content. If positive is not available then..... negative will do.
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::)
Some people are never happy unless they can find something to be miserable about"
What's worse is they have to keep justifying it.
::)
Some time ago I had some radiotherapy treatment which at the time destroyed my ability to taste anything except for bitterness. I found myself gravitating towards foods with bitterness in them, no matter how subtle, because that was better than tasting nothing. I sometimes wonder if there is a psychological equivalent i.e. it's better to feel bitterness or misery or emotional pain in one's life than feel nothing and such people gravitate towards it.
Yes...I think so. The human ego craves sense experience and emotional content. If positive is not available then..... negative will do.
This is one of the cornerstones of transactional analysis - we seek 'strokes' through our transactions with others and the world in general and if we can't get pleasurable ones then we will seek negative ones as better than nothing. It's why we tend to unconsciously repeat negative patterns in relationships (personal, work, family) until we notice and can decide to do things differently.
There is also a theory that we become more inclined to negative ideas about life and the future because we are getting closer to life's end and it is less painful if we think we are leaving something that isn't as good as when we arrived.
I'm not sure I link depression with the kind of pessimism that is associated with revelling in negative views of news and the future. Quite a lot of people seem to really enjoy the misery, especially if it isn't theirs. There's a trend in a certain kind of magazine aimed at women that always feature horrific real life stories of rape or child bereavement on the front cover and it baffles me completely. And of course child abuse memoirs have become extremely popular. :-\
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Adam Phillips, who knows a thing or two, once wrote an article in which he stated that you just have to accept the fact that some people enjoy being miserable and can't really function unless they are - happiness, to them, is like buying a set of socket spanners for your granny; something they didn't ask for and really don't know what to do with.
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Adam Phillips, who knows a thing or two, once wrote an article in which he stated that you just have to accept the fact that some people enjoy being miserable and can't really function unless they are - happiness, to them, is like buying a set of socket spanners for your granny; something they didn't ask for and really don't know what to do with.
Hey some grannies might be pleased to have a set of socket spanners! ;D
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One might as well try everything whilst there's a chance? What's wrong with misery?
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::)
Some people are never happy unless they can find something to be miserable about"
What's worse is they have to keep justifying it.
::)
Some time ago I had some radiotherapy treatment which at the time destroyed my ability to taste anything except for bitterness. I found myself gravitating towards foods with bitterness in them, no matter how subtle, because that was better than tasting nothing. I sometimes wonder if there is a psychological equivalent i.e. it's better to feel bitterness or misery or emotional pain in one's life than feel nothing and such people gravitate towards it.
Yes...I think so. The human ego craves sense experience and emotional content. If positive is not available then..... negative will do.
This fixation and addiction to sense experience is what is regarded as 'sin'. The more the fixation the more the possibility of excessive indulgence.
The idea of salvation is to free oneself from this need for sensory experience.
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Be very careful if you try and do an honourable thing like befriending a miserable person. Most often they're crafty and will try and make you as miserable as they are.
"People talk about the courage of condemned men walking to the place of execution: sometimes it needs as much courage to walk with any kind of bearing towards another persons habitual misery." Graham Greene
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I'm not sure 'crafty' is quite the right word, but I think some habitually pessimistic and unhappy people find a kind of perverse reassurance in persuading others to see things as they do.
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They can be crafty, very crafty. Their aim is to get you as miserable as they and you are the clueless one and wind up miserable after every visit with them. They know exactly what they are doing. Don't sell them short Rhi.
Crafty-clever at getting the results you want. That's a perfect description for many of them Rhi.
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They can be crafty, very crafty. Their aim is to get you as miserable as they and you are the clueless one and wind up miserable after every visit with them. They know exactly what they are doing. Don't sell them short Rhi.
Crafty-clever at getting the results you want. That's a perfect description for many of them Rhi.
Their aim is to feel better. The fact that they do this by putting a burden on you to be their support mechanism isn't intentional or malicious, despite the deleterious effects it can have.
Yes, you need to be careful, and you need to share that burden with others if you can, but to ascribe malice to their intentions is hardly a charitable view of people already in a bad situation.
O.
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For interest's sake, how do we gauge or just KNOW what happiness exactly is ?!?!!?
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No doubt whatever it is, it is bound to be only an illusion anyway!
If you can make yourself happy by making others miserable, can you make others happy by being miserable? Keith always manages to cheer me up :) A bit like listening to Lou Reed and the early Velvets.
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For interest's sake, how do we gauge or just KNOW what happiness exactly is ?!?!!?
Perhaps 'happiness' is that which satisfies a desire, and 'joy' is that which satisfies all desires and the individual becomes desire-less.
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Isn't that the same as being dead?
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Isn't that the same as being dead?
No, it is more like having life more abundantly, being fulfilled and expressing that joy from within .... outwardly, rather than seeking pleasure from outside and bringing it in as temporary happiness.
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Outrider,
Obviously you didn't get that I am talking about those that love their misery, not those that want relief. Ever hear about misery loving company?
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Isn't that the same as being dead?
The only thing that is like being dead is sleep. The only difference is that you wake up after sleep where as after death.....
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The problem with these kinds of threads and ideas is that two people can go through similar experiences and view the events differently depending on their character and disposition. It is this and how one feels within one's mind that sets the tone of things.
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True enough, hence NS's unanswered questions to Keith about the validity of comparing subjective judgments.
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True enough, hence NS's unanswered questions to Keith about the validity of comparing subjective judgments.
People want answers from Keith? There's a wish that wont be granted!!!
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Can we experience happiness if we don't have its 'opposite'???
ie Would there be black if there wasn't white ???
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That's why heaven cannot exist.
Robbed of all context, it becomes a meaningless place
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Heaven has LOTS of context, no ????
In many way the opposite of earth ?!!??
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Can we experience happiness if we don't have its 'opposite'???
ie Would there be black if there wasn't white ???
From the Tao Te Ching
When beauty is defined, ugliness is born;
When goodness is evaluated, evil is there to oppose it;
Being and Existence generate each other;
Heavy and light weigh each other;
Long and short define each other;
High and low are relative to each other;
Past and future flow into each other.
Therefore the Wise act from inner stillness ,
Teach without explanations,
Are available to all and reject none,
Produce results but lay claim to nothing,
Seek no credit, and on completion are not attached to the outcome,
Through non attachment they maintain oneness.
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Marvellous answer.
PERFECT !!!!
Thanks !!
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Outrider,
Obviously you didn't get that I am talking about those that love their misery, not those that want relief. Ever hear about misery loving company?
I've heard the aphorism, yes. I still don't presume any malice - it may well be the effect, but that doesn't mean it was the intention.
O.
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Can we experience happiness if we don't have its 'opposite'???
ie Would there be black if there wasn't white ???
In paganism too (at least the kind I follow) we accept that dark is needed alongside light for balance. Life has its dark times as an inevitability and there are deities and myths that guide us through - if you take the famous myth of Persephone as an example, yes, she has to enter the darkness of the underworld, but it is to emerge renewed and stronger.
And the dark isn't to be feared. It isn't true that suffering doesn't happen in the light - it can and does - but the dark can be a refuge from the harshness of the light - we sleep better in the dark - and it is a place of dreaming and imagination.
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Outrider,
Obviously you didn't get that I am talking about those that love their misery, not those that want relief. Ever hear about misery loving company?
I've heard the aphorism, yes. I still don't presume any malice - it may well be the effect, but that doesn't mean it was the intention.
O.
There are some people who seem to revel in misery. Years ago when I was in my teens I lived near a high rise and an acquaintance of mine met with unbearable tragedy when living there - her toddler son fell from the window and died. I was in the local newspaper shop when another woman from the same block of flats came in waving the local newspaper. 'I knew it!' she said gleefully. 'She pushed him out! Look it says here, police are investigating!' I've never quite got over the enjoyment she took in thinking that this poor woman had murdered her little boy. (He'd fallen from an open window next to a kitchen worktop when she went to answer the door).
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Can we experience happiness if we don't have its 'opposite'???
ie Would there be black if there wasn't white ???
From the Tao Te Ching
When beauty is defined, ugliness is born;
When goodness is evaluated, evil is there to oppose it;
Being and Existence generate each other;
Heavy and light weigh each other;
Long and short define each other;
High and low are relative to each other;
Past and future flow into each other.
Therefore the Wise act from inner stillness ,
Teach without explanations,
Are available to all and reject none,
Produce results but lay claim to nothing,
Seek no credit, and on completion are not attached to the outcome,
Through non attachment they maintain oneness.
So true love is true hate?
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The stronger you feel for someone the more their moods can affect you !!
Remember how we sometimes say,' oh I don't give a ++++ about him/her so nothing they do bothers you in any way???
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Can we experience happiness if we don't have its 'opposite'???
ie Would there be black if there wasn't white ???
From the Tao Te Ching
When beauty is defined, ugliness is born;
When goodness is evaluated, evil is there to oppose it;
Being and Existence generate each other;
Heavy and light weigh each other;
Long and short define each other;
High and low are relative to each other;
Past and future flow into each other.
Therefore the Wise act from inner stillness ,
Teach without explanations,
Are available to all and reject none,
Produce results but lay claim to nothing,
Seek no credit, and on completion are not attached to the outcome,
Through non attachment they maintain oneness.
So true love is true hate?
I think that part of the idea expressed in the TTC is that the mind produces relative concepts e.g. if there is good then there is evil, if there is beauty then there is ugliness, if there is love there is hate. The 'Wise' transcend this mind forged duality through inner stillness, to a point of balance and harmony and act/not act from there.
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I think that part of the idea expressed in the TTC is that the mind produces relative concepts e.g. if there is good then there is evil, if there is beauty then there is ugliness, if there is love there is hate. The 'Wise' transcend this mind forged duality through inner stillness, to a point of balance and harmony and act/not act from there.
Except that the idea of balance doesn't inextricably remove the idea of duality, it just advocates against extremism.
The way to avoid falling into a modal duality is work on exercises like antonyms: bravery is the opposite of both cowardice and wisdom, depending on the context. There are no dualities, all behaviours are a delicate path between multiple influences.
O.
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I think that part of the idea expressed in the TTC is that the mind produces relative concepts e.g. if there is good then there is evil, if there is beauty then there is ugliness, if there is love there is hate. The 'Wise' transcend this mind forged duality through inner stillness, to a point of balance and harmony and act/not act from there.
Except that the idea of balance doesn't inextricably remove the idea of duality, it just advocates against extremism.
The way to avoid falling into a modal duality is work on exercises like antonyms: bravery is the opposite of both cowardice and wisdom, depending on the context. There are no dualities, all behaviours are a delicate path between multiple influences.
O.
I don't think the Taoist verse attempts to remove the idea of duality but more to act/not act more spontaneously and consciously in harmony with any prevailing forces. I believe Taoism has an element of duality within it as expressed by the Taichitu symbol of Yin and Yang. Rather than seeing them as opposing forces and being judgemental about them, it sees them as complementary. I doubt whether it would advocate 'antonym exercises' as Taoism tends towards stilling the mind rather than agitating it, but if it works for some, why not.
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Can we experience happiness if we don't have its 'opposite'???
ie Would there be black if there wasn't white ???
From the Tao Te Ching
When beauty is defined, ugliness is born;
When goodness is evaluated, evil is there to oppose it;
Being and Existence generate each other;
Heavy and light weigh each other;
Long and short define each other;
High and low are relative to each other;
Past and future flow into each other.
Therefore the Wise act from inner stillness ,
Teach without explanations,
Are available to all and reject none,
Produce results but lay claim to nothing,
Seek no credit, and on completion are not attached to the outcome,
Through non attachment they maintain oneness.
So true love is true hate?
I think that part of the idea expressed in the TTC is that the mind produces relative concepts e.g. if there is good then there is evil, if there is beauty then there is ugliness, if there is love there is hate. The 'Wise' transcend this mind forged duality through inner stillness, to a point of balance and harmony and act/not act from there.
In creating something a polarization is also created. So if love is created then also not-love is also formed by the judgement of what love is. If something doesn't fit into that criteria of love then it is not-love i.e. what we generally call hate. To transcend this case one has to embrace both but this takes a lot of effort and energy.