Religion and Ethics Forum
Religion and Ethics Discussion => Muslim Topic => Topic started by: Dajjal on June 21, 2017, 03:06:58 PM
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Peirs Morgan interviewed Tommy Robinson about his views on the Quran, but when Robinson tried to say what Gladstone and Churchill had said about the Quran he shouted him down. Morgan said, "show some respect for peoples religion"
As far as I am concerned Islam deserves no respect, because it is all a made up religion that was designed to scare silly Arabs into fighting Muhammad's wars for him. The tragedy is they are still doing it fourteen hundred years later.
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Peirs Morgan interviewed Tommy Robinson about his views on the Quran, but when Robinson tried to say what Gladstone and Churchill had said about the Quran he shouted him down. Morgan said, "show some respect for peoples religion"
As far as I am concerned Islam deserves no respect, because it is all a made up religion that was designed to scare silly Arabs respect into fighting Muhammad's wars for him. The tragedy is they are still doing it fourteen hundred years later.
Does any religion deserve respect?
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Funny you should ask that. I do have respect for the teachings of Jesus and the Buddha. But they are benign and spiritual beliefs. The Quran, on the other hand, seems to me to an obvious falsehood. For example what other holy book contains an entire chapter discussing dividing the spoils of war? See the Quran, surah 8.
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Funny you should ask that. I do have respect for the teachings of Jesus and the Buddha. But they are benign and spiritual beliefs. The Quran, on the other hand, seems to me to an obvious falsehood. For example what other holy book contains an entire chapter discussing dividing the spoils of war? See the Quran, surah 8.
That's nice, to me they all seem based in obvious made up falsehoods. You seem to be arguing that what you like should be given respect.
I take it in terms of the spoils of war stuff you missed much of the OT, it tells you about who to kill and who to rape.
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I don't have much respect for the old testament. I think it is largely made up Jewish myths, But the basic teachings of Jesus are more spiritual.
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I don't have much respect for the old testament. I think it is largely made up Jewish myths, But the basic teachings of Jesus are more spiritual.
What ones? That he came to change not a tittle of the law? Or that he came to bring a sword? Or that foreigners were dogs?
Again you are just repeating the idea that because Jesus agrees with you he should be given respect.
BTW what does 'spiritual' mean, and why is that of some import as to something being given respect?
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What ones? That he came to change not a tittle of the law? Or that he came to bring a sword? Or that foreigners were dogs?
Again you are just repeating the idea that because Jesus agrees with you he should be given respect.
BTW what does 'spiritual' mean, and why is that of some import as to something being given respect?
I was thinking more on the lines of, the sermon on the mount, and stuff like that. Besides if the story of his sacrifice on the cross is in any way true he deserves a lot of respect.
Spiritual is of the spirit, rather than of material things.
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I was thinking more on the lines of, the sermon on the mount, and stuff like that. Besides if the story of his sacrifice on the cross is in any way true he deserves a lot of respect.
Spiritual is of the spirit, rather than of material things.
So you cherry pick to get stuff you agree with and say that should be respected.
You then don't give a definition but just go with something entirely circular and give no reason for why that is deserving of respect.
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No religion is worthy of respect. People who follow religious beliefs and teachings and who then behave morally and altruistically and say that this is because of their beliefs deserve respect, but not because of their religious beliefs. In other words, it is people who either deserve respect or not and to a greater or lesser degree, depending on their totally human behaviour.
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People often say that Dajjal but they mean they respect the right of others to practice their religion & don't want to offend by dissing it, it's just clumsily put. A very common error.
I'd think the likes of Tommy Robinson wouldn't have indepth knowlege of the Qu'ran (he's no relation! When I was single my initials were EDL! I'm now glad I changed my name ;D),
Most likely he bought some large print illustrated childrens' book giving an outline of the Qu'ran, rather like some childrens' Bibles only the illustrations wouldn't be of people.
Haven't seen the interview with Piers Morgan, Dajjal, but now you've brought it up I'll find it and watch when I can, sounds interesting. Thanks.
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Why should anything deserve respect? Either you respect something because it has attributes that you value, or it doesn't and you don't.
The problem with Islam is that many Muslims demand that it be "respected" .. in response I don't give it any regard. Similarly with other religions when adherents insist on deference or lip service.
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I respect others right to practice their religion, provided it also respects others rights 🙂
So in that sense, I respect it.
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People often say that Dajjal but they mean they respect the right of others to practice their religion & don't want to offend by dissing it, it's just clumsily put. A very common error.
I'd think the likes of Tommy Robinson wouldn't have indepth knowlege of the Qu'ran (he's no relation! When I was single my initials were EDL! I'm now glad I changed my name ;D),
Most likely he bought some large print illustrated childrens' book giving an outline of the Qu'ran, rather like some childrens' Bibles only the illustrations wouldn't be of people.
Haven't seen the interview with Piers Morgan, Dajjal, but now you've brought it up I'll find it and watch when I can, sounds interesting. Thanks.
Tommy Robinson appears reasonable familiar with the Quran in some interviews. This interview with Piers Morgan though was a farce, whatever his views he was barely allowed to express them.... PM was very unprofessional.
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I've now watched it and thought Tommy R said a lot more than Piers Morgan,of whom I'm not a great fan, but I didn't see the last bit. To be fair I will waatch it to the end.
If Tommy Robinson intends to continue in public life he needs a PR team to teach him how to speak slowly, not dip at the end of sentences and refrain from saying things like, "I done" instead of "I did". It surprised me (tho' maybe it shouldn't) that he has a platform in America.
Seen better but seen worse.
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I did watch the rest of the Piers Morgan-Tommy Robinson interview.
PM was being PM but Robinson doesn't have the ability to handle that.
I thought it would be a good idea to watch& listen to some other interviews with Tommy Robinson plus phone- ins so I did. There are a lot on You Tube.
The Saira Khan one was very good, she's 'gobby' enough to handle him.
Tommy Robinson is an inarticulate yob & needs some lessons in public speaking. Also has big chip on shoulder evident from his exchange with PiersM - who actually agrees with some of what TommyR spouts.
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Just to note that the confluence of Robinson posting about Tommy Robinson led to a worry for a second that our Robinson had started referring to herself in the 3rd person, NS doesn't have the ability to handle that! ;)
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Does any religion deserve respect?
Either all do or none does. Picking some and not others makes no sense.
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Either all do or none does. Picking some and not others makes no sense.
It is my argument that Islam deserves no respect because it is all fabricated by a bandit who used religion to scare people into fighting for him. Other religions may also be fabricated, but most of them contain what might be some truth.
The message of Buddha is to live harmlessly, and kill nothing. The message of Jesus is to forgive your enemies and love them, and turn the other cheek.
But the message of Muhammad is to take no prisoners (which means kill them) and that those who oppose Muhammad should be killed or crucified, or have their hands and feet on alternate sides cut off.
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Either all do or none does. Picking some and not others makes no sense.
Don't agree - not ALL ways are equal.
I'm afraid Dajjal has it quite correct & anyone who's read the life & history of Mohd & Islam can come to little else as an answer.
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I respect peoples right to believe what they want but I don't have to respect those beliefs
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It is my argument that Islam deserves no respect because it is all fabricated by a bandit who used religion to scare people into fighting for him. Other religions may also be fabricated, but most of them contain what might be some truth.
The message of Buddha is to live harmlessly, and kill nothing. The message of Jesus is to forgive your enemies and love them, and turn the other cheek.
But the message of Muhammad is to take no prisoners (which means kill them) and that those who oppose Muhammad should be killed or crucified, or have their hands and feet on alternate sides cut off.
So in other words you respect the nice parts of Christianity (there are plenty of not nice, trust me) and you like the message of the Buddha, so that can be respected too, but you don't like Mo's so that can't be respected. Even though there is no more reason for anyone to think that Christianity is more fact based than Islam.
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Jesus would quite rightly be appalled at what's happened in his name & to his teachings !!!!
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Just to note that the confluence of Robinson posting about Tommy Robinson led to a worry for a second that our Robinson had started referring to herself in the 3rd person, NS doesn't have the ability to handle that! ;)
Yes I dun did that ;).
Looks like we're all agreed that when someone says they respect a belief, they generally really mean the believer.
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So in other words you respect the nice parts of Christianity (there are plenty of not nice, trust me) and you like the message of the Buddha, so that can be respected too, but you don't like Mo's so that can't be respected. Even though there is no more reason for anyone to think that Christianity is more fact based than Islam.
Surely it doesn't have to be fact-based w.r.t. specific claims (virgin birth and other miracles etc.) but whether beliefs have an identifiably positive/beneficial effect when carried out or put into practice. So for example, a person can be highly sceptical or even positively disbelieving of rebirth, but still think that the Buddha's teachings on non-violence and compassion are worthwhile.
I know that this is possible - I'm such a person.
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Surely it doesn't have to be fact-based w.r.t. specific claims (virgin birth and other miracles etc.) but whether beliefs have an identifiably positive/beneficial effect when carried out or put into practice. So for example, a person can be highly sceptical or even positively disbelieving of rebirth, but still think that the Buddha's teachings on non-violence and compassion are worthwhile.
I know that this is possible - I'm such a person.
But then we are getting into whether Buddhism is a religion or a philosophy.
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But then we are getting into whether Buddhism is a religion or a philosophy.
True - but we're not going to solve that one before beddy-byes, tonight or any other night.
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Good point but then we have to list what a religion entails.
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If you can do that, you'll succeed where no one else has.
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EXACTLY !!!! ;) :o :o ::)