Religion and Ethics Forum
General Category => Politics & Current Affairs => Topic started by: Nearly Sane on January 04, 2018, 05:28:56 PM
-
Eh??????
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-42571219
-
I knew someone called John Worboys many years ago - though I think he was 'Jon', short for Jonathan - and was shocked when I saw the thread title, wondered what he'd done to be locked up! Glad to say not the Jon I knew.
Vile man, I feel sorry for the survivors of his attacks but presumably he's done eight years and been a model prisoner so not much anyone can do about it.
The police will be keeping a very close eye on this man.
-
I knew someone called John Worboys many years ago - though I think he was 'Jon', short for Jonathan - and was shocked when I saw the thread title, wondered what he'd done to be locked up! Glad to say not the Jon I knew.
Vile man, I feel sorry for the survivors of his attacks but presumably he's done eight years and been a model prisoner so not much anyone can do about it.
The police will be keeping a very close eye on this man.
The parole board can chose not to give parole.
-
That they can, I wondered about that too.
-
That they can, I wondered about that too.
Which is what struggle to comprehend. Now, don't get me wrong there are bleeding heart snowflakes that have my picture on the wall with the raised eyebrow and the line 'Prison works? really?' on the picture but we have a prison system that makes no effort to rehabilitate suddenly succeeding here? Really? Raises eyebrow.
-
They should have thrown away the key! >:(
-
They should have thrown away the key! >:(
Then the word rehabilitation has always been a mystery for you, since you are so totally a retributionist.
-
I saw him on the news. Can't imagine - over 100 victims! I wonder if there will be more in the news with a few details of some rehabilitation during his incarceration, they surely can't just let him out because he's behaved himself in prison. Or perhaps he'll fade into obscurity (unless he reoffends).
"....."stringent" licence conditions.
He will have to report to probation staff every week and is barred from contacting any of his victims."
Presumably his name will be changed, now he's in the news he'll a target. Easy enough to change his appearance I would think. The police will watch him and probably one police officer to visit him, keep an eye and liaise with the PO.
-
Excellent demonstration of the value that the criminal justice system places on women.
-
I don't know that there would be a different result if men had been raped by him. Rape and sexual assault are heinous crimes regardless of the sex of the victims & though there are more women victims, it happens a lot to men. (I hope that isn't a 'whataboutmenery', I'm not asking a question.)
This bit of the article was interesting:-
"According to the judge who sentenced him in 2009, John Worboys had "developed and perfected a web of deceit" to ensnare his victims.
The question raised by his imminent release is whether Worboys may have deceived the Parole Board into concluding that he no longer posed a threat to women.
Parole panel members have specialist skills and experience but manipulative individuals who are desperate for freedom may be able to convince even the most sceptical criminal justice practitioner that they should be given a chance.
A second concern is whether Worboys has been let out to help cut the backlog of prisoners who have served longer than the minimum term imposed as part of their indeterminate sentence for public protection (IPP)."
As he was so very good at weaving a web of deceit before his conviction, one wonders if he still is and has been able to dupe everybody. In which he may offend again - which of course I hope he doesn't - & end up back behind bars.
He's not out yet, it's possible he will blot his copybook whilst still inside resulting in his parole being revoked.
I do remember the case quite well now, just didn't remember his name.
-
Then the word rehabilitation has always been a mystery for you, since you are so totally a retributionist.
You can't rehabilitate people like Worboys, imo.
-
I find this kind of discussion very uncomfortable.
In the first place, I accept that John Worboys behaved in a manner which is totally unacceptable in a civilised society. His behaviour was reprehensible, He was apprehended, his behaviour was investigated, he was tried according to the criminal law, found guilty and received an indeterminate sentence.
I am trying to be non-judgemental, I am avoiding the use of easy, value-laden, emotive words like "scum" and "evil". We live in a society which is governed by the rule of law. We hope - should we be accused of any infringement of the law - that we will be treated according to principles and practices that are universally accepted.
The rule of law applies to all of us, and equally to bodies like the Parole Board. Its decision in this case appears surprising. However, I dislike the idea - intensely - that judicial and administrative decisions which are taken within the rule of law may be subverted by a different kind of rule - that is the rule of the mob, encouraged by an unrestrained popular press.
We do not have a balanced report about the Parole Board's decision. We do not know, in fact we are not allowed to know, the reasons for its decision. I would doubt that its members are so easily manipulated as Robbie seems to imply. My guess is that this decision is now being scrutinised within the judiciary and appropriate branches of the executive. If it is faulty then we can expect that it will be reviewed.
But my main concern is not with this particular case but with the way in which the "popular" press appears to believe it has the right to incite the hoi polloi.
In the words of Rudyard Kipling: Power without responsibility. The prerogative of the harlot throughout the ages.
-
It is the job of the parole board to protect people from the likes of Worboys and if that means keeping them locked up for life so be it.
-
My experience of the court system is that the perpetrator and his needs come first. The least relevant person is the victim.
I’m not seeing any ‘mob rule’ here. I am seeing 100 plus women with very little justice.
-
My experience of the court system is that the perpetrator and his needs come first. The least relevant person is the victim.
I’m not seeing any ‘mob rule’ here. I am seeing 100 plus women with very little justice.
Agreed.
-
Justice is a process not an outcome. All the victims have had justice - however they may not have obtained satisfaction or found closure.
John Worboys received an indeterminate sentence. If he is released on parole he will still be serving the sentence and will be subject to reincarceration at any time. It may well be that the Parole Board's decision is in error.
-
Excellent demonstration of the value that the criminal justice system places on women.
More like an excellent demonstration of how the media see assaults against women as more serious than assaults against men.
-
I saw him on the news. Can't imagine - over 100 victims! I wonder if there will be more in the news with a few details of some rehabilitation during his incarceration, they surely can't just let him out because he's behaved himself in prison. Or perhaps he'll fade into obscurity (unless he reoffends).
"....."stringent" licence conditions.
He will have to report to probation staff every week and is barred from contacting any of his victims."
Presumably his name will be changed, now he's in the news he'll a target. Easy enough to change his appearance I would think. The police will watch him and probably one police officer to visit him, keep an eye and liaise with the PO.
100 victims was an allegation not proved.
Worboys is an asshole, he spend the rest of his life looking over his shoulder. Is that not suitable punishment?
-
100 victims was an allegation not proved.
Worboys is an asshole, he spend the rest of his life looking over his shoulder. Is that not suitable punishment?
No! I hope they can find enough evidence to bring him to trial on the other offences too.
-
My experience of the court system is that the perpetrator and his needs come first. The least relevant person is the victim.
I’m not seeing any ‘mob rule’ here. I am seeing 100 plus women with very little justice.
He was caught. He went to prison. Everything that has happened since has been in accord with the British justice system. On the assumption that the parole board has done its job properly, justice has been (or rather is being) served. Just because he is no longer in prison doesn't mean his sentence is over.
Personally, I am sceptical that he is no longer a danger to the public, but obviously I am not privy to all the facts that the parole board has, nor am I an expert in the behaviour of sex offenders. I am also disappointed that nobody seems to have taken into account the fact that this will pile on more pain for his victims. Or maybe they have taken it into account but decided it does not outweigh the advantages of returning Worboys to society. We don't know and I think that is a problem that needs to be looked at.
-
Simon Jenkins (not a journalist I always turn to) writes well here about our attitudes to crime in this country - he covers many of the thorny problems that surround our system of justice including our own attitudes to it:
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/jan/05/revenge-law-john-worboys-victims-crimes-justice
-
Thank you for finding that, Trent.
Simon Jenkins says pretty much what I was trying to say in my earlier post (#11) but does so more clearly and cogently than I was able to.
-
I think it highly erroneous to assume that those concerned by this feel that there has been inadequate punishment or vengeance.
-
Not totally irrelevant.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-england-42580040/theodore-johnson-woman-predicted-killer-would-strike-again
-
Agree, not irrelevant.
She knew the man after all.
Dreadful to think he had two manslaughter convictions before murdering his girlfriend.
John Worboys served his sentence in a prison, not a prison hospital, I think.
Other alleged victims are going to try to have him convicted for his alleged attacks on them.
This article explains a bit about the parole system and Worboys case in particular :-
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-42574651
-
I wonder what excuses will be made if Worboys assaults other women on his release?
-
None he'll just be banged up and not let out.
-
None he'll just be banged up and not let out.
There would still be excuses as to why he was let out in the first place.
-
Oh yes, many questions would be asked. I was thinking about excuses on his behalf - which he is well past. I hope he doesn't reoffend though, wouldn't want anyone else to go through an attack by him.
-
The right wing press do serve a purpose.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-42798469