Antonin Scalia dead

[Nearly Sane]

Reading some of the discussions by Scalia, and by some of the Republican candidates as regards originalism, one hears echoes of the fetishism apparent in literalism in Biblical terms. I wonder if there is a reaction to the gradual loss of certainties of ideas like identity that drives people to cling to such simplicity?

[Hope]

Reading some of the discussions by Scalia, and by some of the Republican candidates as regards originalism, one hears echoes of the fetishism apparent in literalism in Biblical terms. I wonder if there is a reaction to the gradual loss of certainties of ideas like identity that drives people to cling to such simplicity?

There was a time when dyslexia was the vogue diagnosis in regard to poor educational achievement (this sort of coincided with the time I started teaching, and we had it thrust down our throats in the last couple of years of college.  Some 7 or 8 years later the diagnosis had changed to ADHD, and INSET sessions were full of how to recognise the issue and how to minimise the problems around reporting it to the Ed. Psych.  We now have dispraxia, discalculia, autism and its various forms.  Next decade, who knows what we'll have. 

Society seems to dislike some of the more simple explanations - for instance the child who is consistently disobedient at school because the disciplinary regime there is so different to that which they experience at home.

I sometimes feel that society allows more of these unusual conditions because it means that it can potentially limit its response to some of the behaviour.  Clearly, there are many children (and adults) for whom there are such issues, but I've seen too many children diagnosed with such conditions when their activities don't warrant it.  Perhaps the most famous for me was the Year 7 lad who was streets behind his cohort average and even though he was in the Special Needs Class he made absolutely no progress for the first 8 months of the year. He was tested and diagnosed with dyslexia by the Ed Psych in the April.  In the May, the school (and the SEN department in particular) was visited by the police who were investigating a spate of thefts across the city where he lived and went to school.  It soon became clear that this lad was the subject of the investigation, and in discussion with the SEN staff, year tutor and deputy head with responsibility for the lower school, the police made it clear that he was extremely bright, and had been leading a criminal gang (which included several elder relatives of his own) for the past 4 years.  He had been assessed by an Ed Psych 2 years earlier when his name had come up as a partial ring-leader in an investigation and no sign of dyslexia evidenced itself.  Sadly, I never heard what happoened to him further down the line: that was in the early 1990s, and I left the staff to work in Nepal 2 years after all this came to light.

[Sassy]

Don't be stupid! What on earth is the difference between condemning his actions during his life and doing so after his death? To make such a difference would be the height of hypocrisy.
 

I have said nothing about his family, so don't go creating straw men just to suit yourself (as usual).

No one said you had...

Look it up for yourself, I am not going to waste my time trying to educate you. Partly because I have better things to do, but mainly because any attempt to do so will meet with a brick wall of incomprehension.

Read them properly instead of putting a spin on it which DOES NOT EXIST...

Only hypocrites respect in death somebody they despised in life.

Were you sad when Hitler died?

There was a great Irving Berlin number that looked forward to his death.

http://lyricsplayground.com/alpha/songs/w/whenthatmanisdeadandgone.shtml

I guess you have double standards... by all means discuss what he did wrong. But by no means diss him when dead in public
where is family could read simply by google search of his name.

There is no hypocrisy in respect for his family since this is what I am referring to. In spite of anything he might have done at least respect their grief. Tell me what he did in life to deserve such angst from you and others. I had never heard of him till today. But pray God it isn't his decisions did not agree with abortion bill or gay marriage. Because that would show how bias and how atheists believe only they are right about such matters... Atheists are against abortion and gay marriage too.
Right or wrong does not come into choices. Nor does it make it right for you to abuse him in death.

So tell me what evils he committed and how he was in such a high place of power for doing so.

So stop making false accusations my post was perfectly clear in that I had been referring to his family.

Seems the brick wall was your own built brick by brick... Maybe an apology would go some way to show sincerity unless deliberate, of course.

[Shaker]

So stop making false accusations my post was perfectly clear in that I had been referring to his family.

Nobody even mentioned his family but you, so give over with the bleating and the whining.

[Leonard James]

Look it up for yourself, I am not going to waste my time trying to educate you. Partly because I have better things to do, but mainly because any attempt to do so will meet with a brick wall of incomprehension.


Read them properly instead of putting a spin on it which DOES NOT EXIST...


So stop making false accusations my post was perfectly clear in that I had been referring to his family.

Seems the brick wall was your own built brick by brick... Maybe an apology would go some way to show sincerity unless deliberate, of course.

                 

For goodness' sake climb back into your ivory tower of sanctimonious righteousness and give us all some peace.

Pray to your "God" to free you from your stuck-up, know-all nature and give you a little wisdom.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

                 

For goodness' sake climb back into your ivory tower of sanctimonious righteousness and give us all some peace.

Exactly what I was going to say to you Len.......only I was going to use the word 'Hacienda' instead of 'Tower'.

[Leonard James]

Exactly what I was going to say to you Len.......only I was going to use the word 'Hacienda' instead of 'Tower'.

Yes, most of us can't afford ivory towers. 

[Nearly Sane]

There was a time when dyslexia was the vogue diagnosis in regard to poor educational achievement (this sort of coincided with the time I started teaching, and we had it thrust down our throats in the last couple of years of college.  Some 7 or 8 years later the diagnosis had changed to ADHD, and INSET sessions were full of how to recognise the issue and how to minimise the problems around reporting it to the Ed. Psych.  We now have dispraxia, discalculia, autism and its various forms.  Next decade, who knows what we'll have. 

Society seems to dislike some of the more simple explanations - for instance the child who is consistently disobedient at school because the disciplinary regime there is so different to that which they experience at home.

I sometimes feel that society allows more of these unusual conditions because it means that it can potentially limit its response to some of the behaviour.  Clearly, there are many children (and adults) for whom there are such issues, but I've seen too many children diagnosed with such conditions when their activities don't warrant it.  Perhaps the most famous for me was the Year 7 lad who was streets behind his cohort average and even though he was in the Special Needs Class he made absolutely no progress for the first 8 months of the year. He was tested and diagnosed with dyslexia by the Ed Psych in the April.  In the May, the school (and the SEN department in particular) was visited by the police who were investigating a spate of thefts across the city where he lived and went to school.  It soon became clear that this lad was the subject of the investigation, and in discussion with the SEN staff, year tutor and deputy head with responsibility for the lower school, the police made it clear that he was extremely bright, and had been leading a criminal gang (which included several elder relatives of his own) for the past 4 years.  He had been assessed by an Ed Psych 2 years earlier when his name had come up as a partial ring-leader in an investigation and no sign of dyslexia evidenced itself.  Sadly, I never heard what happoened to him further down the line: that was in the early 1990s, and I left the staff to work in Nepal 2 years after all this came to light.

? And once more??, even thrice??? Sorry, Hope, really don't see the connection between this and my post you replied to.

[OH MY WORLD!]

What rotters. Celebrating the death of somebody you never took an interest in learning about. Well there are decent people, liberal judges on the SC, that actually knew the man well and despite their differences, loved the man dearly. You people are disgusting.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/justice-ruth-bader-ginsburg-remembers-justice-antonin-scalia/ar-BBpviug

Now I hear Dicky Dawkins had a stroke..........

[OH MY WORLD!]

Bill Clinton being a decent human being. Try and learn something.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/video/politics/bill-clinton-comments-on-the-death-of-justice-scalia/2016/02/13/c8b35580-d2d0-11e5-90d3-34c2c42653ac_video.html

[ProfessorDavey]

What rotters. Celebrating the death of somebody you never took an interest in learning about. Well there are decent people, liberal judges on the SC, that actually knew the man well and despite their differences, loved the man dearly. You people are disgusting.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/justice-ruth-bader-ginsburg-remembers-justice-antonin-scalia/ar-BBpviug

I haven't been celebrating the death of anyone.

But virtually all of us have had no personal contact with Scalia so we cannot judge whether he is lovely and charming as an individual or horrible and rude.

What we do know about him is his views and we can judge him on those. It is perfectly reasonable to have a deeply unfavourable opinion of him on the basis of his views and nothing else (because we don't know him). It is also perfectly reasonable to maintain that unfavourable opinion on him based on his views in death as well as life. Indeed I would argue that it would be deeply hypocritical to be highly unfavourable toward him due to his views in life, but somehow to put on crocodile tears in death and pretend he was a cuddly liberal - he wasn't.

I note you link to comments from Bill Clinton - he, unlike us, knew him personally so can make comments on him personally as well as on his views, we cannot. In addition, of course, he is a politician and his wife is running for president so I suspect he will chose his words very carefully.

[Shaker]

Bill Clinton being a decent human being.

Ah yes, Clinton - a politician and one with a proven track record of truthfulness

[Leonard James]

I haven't been celebrating the death of anyone.

But virtually all of us have had no personal contact with Scalia so we cannot judge whether he is lovely and charming as an individual or horrible and rude.

What we do know about him is his views and we can judge him on those. It is perfectly reasonable to have a deeply unfavourable opinion of him on the basis of his views and nothing else (because we don't know him). It is also perfectly reasonable to maintain that unfavourable opinion on him based on his views in death as well as life. Indeed I would argue that it would be deeply hypocritical to be highly unfavourable toward him due to his views in life, but somehow to put on crocodile tears in death and pretend he was a cuddly liberal - he wasn't.

I note you link to comments from Bill Clinton - he, unlike us, knew him personally so can make comments on him personally as well as on his views, we cannot. In addition, of course, he is a politician and his wife is running for president so I suspect he will chose his words very carefully.

Excellent post!

[Shaker]

I haven't been celebrating the death of anyone.

I believe it was Mark Twain who said something along the lines of: "I wish ill to no man, although there are many obituaries I have read with great pleasure."

[Bubbles]

Did this man order aircraft into buildings?

Antitheist types have a funny demonology....Take Mary Whitehouse. For expressing a view she is vilified by antitheists.

Mary Whitehouse?

You are showing your age   

Haven't heard her name for years.

Most people probably don't even know who she was, unless they are older.

 

[Bubbles]

Yes but also what she considered rightly or wrongly as the impressionable and at the end of the day so what? She must have known that against the BBC, a progressive government, financial and consumer interest she would have limited success but never gave up trying to influence.

I feel you are trying to goad me into some kind of debate on whether fictional representations have any effect on people. As I recall Whitehouse frequently criticised Dr Who for violence and Tom and Jerry..............It's easy to agree that that is going toward daft as a brush.....but what about realistic portrayals...what about learning by observation.

Your alternative would have us left to sexism (Mainly for Men) and then the clean up would then have been led by Auntie Germaine.........How would that have panned out I wonder.

Yes, as a dr who fan, I couldn't stand the woman.

She was dictorial.

Even as a child I couldn't abide her.

[Bubbles]

Antonin Scalia seemed to support some of the worst and scarier views in the USA.

 

He seems to have been one of those sort of polititians.

[Nearly Sane]

Antonin Scalia seemed to support some of the worst and scarier views in the USA.

 

He seems to have been one of those sort of polititians.

While the decisions have political impacts, he wasn't a politician. I disagree with a lot of Scalia's decisions but I don't see him as particularly scary. It's a conservative view of the US constitution but that's about it.

I find scary that the Republican candidates want to try and hold a nomination off fora year. I doubt Scalia would have approved of that and ironically it is they who seek to desecrate his legacy.

[ProfessorDavey]

While the decisions have political impacts, he wasn't a politician. I disagree with a lot of Scalia's decisions but I don't see him as particularly scary. It's a conservative view of the US constitution but that's about it.

I find scary that the Republican candidates want to try and hold a nomination off fora year. I doubt Scalia would have approved of that and ironically it is they who seek to desecrate his legacy.

I think one of the biggest issues here is that it would appear to be a job for life, which ramps up the massive importance of selecting a new Supreme Court Justice, and also means that whether or no a President gets an opportunity to reshape the Supreme Court or not is pretty well a matter of luck.

This doesn't seem right to me. I am uncomfortable with someone (whoever that may be) being in such a position of authority (and one of just 9) and to be in that position for thirty years, or more as was the case for Scalia. It creates a degree of 'bed blocking' which I think is unhealthy.

Currently most of the members were first appointed in their early 50s (one at the age of just 43) - so with current life expectancy 30-40+ years in the role looks to be the norm unless that person choses to retire. There is talk of a 45 year-old being Scalia's replacement - if so he could easily be in that role for 40 years or more.

I think a lot of the problems on the politics front might be solved by the appointments being fixed term or perhaps renewable only once, with a limit of perhaps 15 years in the role. This would provide greater turnover and make the individual appointments less controversial.

[Sassy]

Nobody even mentioned his family but you, so give over with the bleating and the whining.

I MENTIONED HIS FAMILY.. So stop falsely accusing of bleating and whining and stick your neck back in...
Zip it Zippy... LOL.. Couldn't resist... Your beliefs help get you through your pain by attacking others but in
truth you are still fighting the obvious. Believing in Christ would be the road to your healing and recovery.
That is the truth but you don't like truth do you?

[Shaker]

I MENTIONED HIS FAMILY.. So stop falsely accusing of bleating and whining and stick your neck back in...

Can you not read?

Nobody even mentioned his family but you

Zip it Zippy... LOL.. Couldn't resist... Your beliefs help get you through your pain

My only pain at the moment is trying to wade through the mangled car-crash word salad that passes for your posts.

in truth you are still fighting the obvious.

Stupidity - against which, on the authority of Schiller, the gods themselves labour in vain.

[Nearly Sane]

Of course, this is what actually happened   

'Scalia asphyxiated by muslim secret service agent

Calling card left - perfectly  left sheets, pajamas, pillow over head and indication of muslim brotherhood. Cannot post source out of fear from my government but u will see it shortly. The JPs were called away for the weekend necessitating call to far away JP. Marshalls disuaded visit for confirm of death, giving cause over phone. This is Obama's horsehead in the bed to Trump, being done on the eve of repub debate - if we can get to Scalia we can get to you. Secret service protection means nothing. Expect Trump now to either double down, or let up on Obama and withdraw. If Trump continues on, it is all out war between TPTB and him. If so, hope he has his personal security overlooking the SS, as I'm sure he trusts them more. You would not believe what is being circulated here in the press, it would boggle ur mind. Sorry that I cannot post without fear from gov but it is the way it is. The US govt is the biggest most corrupt crime organization in the history of the world. Trump is ur only hope, assuming he somehow gets past the corruption alive.'

[OH MY WORLD!]

Well Scalia and Shaker, our resident Marxist, had something in common, they both favour the death penalty. A couple years ago Shaker informed me that he wasn't opposed to the death penalty. I was shocked but latter he called himself an old Marxist. At that point it made sense. See, political opposites CAN agree on some things.

Because somebody is your political opposite doesn't make the phrase, ding dong the witch is dead, an acceptable response to their demise.

[Shaker]

Well Scalia and Shaker, our resident Marxist, had something in common, they both favour the death penalty. A couple years ago Shaker informed me that he wasn't opposed to the death penalty.

No longer the case, as I've changed my mind.

At one point I would have said (and perhaps did say) that I supported capital punishment in principle but not in practice; that I wasn't inherently opposed to the world being better off without certain people who have committed the most terrible of crimes, but that I couldn't support its execution (no pun intended) in practice because of the possibility of killing an innocent party. What the situation is like in North America I don't know but I do know that in my lifetime in the UK alone the number of miscarriages of justice is long and horrific; I can reel off any number of names of those found guilty of murder and who would have been executed at the time if capital punishment had been in place but who were later determined to be not guilty. Stefan Kiszko. Stephen Downing. Angela Cannings. Sally Clark. Barry George. The Bridgewater Four. The Guildford Four. The Birmingham Six. The Cardiff Three. Those are just a few off the top of my head; the rest don't bear thinking about.

Then I thought about it for another ten seconds and realised that it makes little sense to have no particular opinion about something in principle if you're adamantly opposed to it in practice. It's a bit like Stan's emphatic upholding of his right to have a baby (even though he actually can't) in Life of Brian: what's the bloody point? So no, I don't support capital punishment any more. Robert Black died (of natural causes) in prison in Northern Ireland on January 12th this year, aged 68, having served 21 years of a life sentence (minimum of 35 years) for the abduction, rape and murder of four little girls (definite; his actual tally is suspected to be very significantly higher). I think the world is a slightly cleaner place without him and can think of or know of nothing that he did to make the world in any way better or to justify his existence in this life before prison or after it. But I don't know that he should have been hanged, because although in hindsight it seems as good as certain that he committed the wicked deeds for which he was imprisoned, it seemed at the time equally certain for the above-named individuals. That's not a risk worth taking.

Get me an absolutely perfect, 100% infallible legal system free of even the possibility let alone the actuality of human error or deliberate corruption and I'll gladly revisit my opinion. Until then, no.