Romans 16

[ekim]

That sounds just about right to me ekim...The son of man is a lesser title than the Son of God and Jesus, knowing that he was the highest intelligent force on all the Earth was happy to think of himself as the son of man but humbly rejected the title of Son of God until his work was completed. He then stood on the same, identical ground as Almighty God, himself...of equal status, but he rejected this truth, humbly remaining the Son of God to whom he owed his entire eternal existence to...not just by divine intervention...but by the righteous science his father had taught him.

I would think that the two expressions are to distinguish between the physical/mental aspects of being human and what is thought of as the divine aspect within mankind, what is referred to as neshama (the soul).  As far as I recall, the symbolism used is 'air'.   'Ruach' (spirit) meant 'air' and 'neshama meant 'breath' i.e. the air within man.  The humility probably comes from realising that one cannot claim possession of it.

[Sassy]

What would 'son' even mean incthat context ? Does its mean that Jesus was not a clone of God, rather he had a regular mashup of characteristics, half from his mother and half from God, half of his chromosomes were from Mary, and the other half were divine, perfect, in some way  ?

What does that mean?

Christ made it clear that to be a descendant of Abraham, you have to do as he did.
The Father God, made it clear that Jesus is to be CALLED THE 'SON OF GOD' would it require
God to tell us these things if he himself was to be made flesh?

All living things are created by God he is Father of all. So why waste time with silly questions?

Christ made God known to us. What he never did and would not do is claim to be God or equal to God.

[Sassy]

Problem with that with Sassy is that she isn't a trinitarian so I think torridon's question has import based on that.

Trinitarian...that has something to do with Christ?

Show me where in Christ's teachings he claimed to God or that he was God.

[Sassy]

I would think that the two expressions are to distinguish between the physical/mental aspects of being human and what is thought of as the divine aspect within mankind, what is referred to as neshama (the soul).  As far as I recall, the symbolism used is 'air'.   'Ruach' (spirit) meant 'air' and 'neshama meant 'breath' i.e. the air within man.  The humility probably comes from realising that one cannot claim possession of it.

How come those claiming to be in the know cannot work out what it means to be the Son of God and the Son of Man?

Son of God, because Christ was not born of the sinful flesh but like the first Adam he was born by the power of Gods words. He was divine in nature and without sin as the first Adam.
He was the Son of Man because like Adam he was created flesh by the power and word of God and he was fully human physically. So the descendant of Adam with the nature of God.

He had to fully flesh to die on the cross for mankind. His nature was divine because like God he did not sin.

[torridon]

What does that mean?

Christ made it clear that to be a descendant of Abraham, you have to do as he did.
The Father God, made it clear that Jesus is to be CALLED THE 'SON OF GOD' would it require
God to tell us these things if he himself was to be made flesh?

All living things are created by God he is Father of all. So why waste time with silly questions?

Christ made God known to us. What he never did and would not do is claim to be God or equal to God.

I think that avoided, rather than answered, my question.  A son inherits half his characteristics from his mother's line and half from his father's line.  Did he inherit from Joseph, or was he a clone of Mary, where did he get his Y chromosomes from if he wasn't Joseph's real son ?

[ekim]

His nature was divine because like God he did not sin.

.. and yet in Mk10 18 Jesus is alleged to have said to a follower : Why do you call me good? There is only one Good and that is God.

[jeremyp]

But a lot of the early aspects of modern 'Western' science are deemed to be 'rediscoveries' of older, Eastern science ideas.

But that isn't true of the example you came up with. You could have tried heliocentricity as something more plausible, or at a stretch, the atomic theory of matter.

[Ricky Spanish]

Eye-witness accounts??? Where are their witnesses for these gods?
<SNIP - irrelevant.>

There were a lot for Christ but so far none I know for the others.
SNIP - Irrelevant.>

There are just as many attested writings, if not more, that Attis, Osiris, Dionysus, Tammuz, Mithras, Adonis and numerous others did exist, where is your proof that they didn't?

[Sassy]

I think that avoided, rather than answered, my question.  A son inherits half his characteristics from his mother's line and half from his father's line.  Did he inherit from Joseph, or was he a clone of Mary, where did he get his Y chromosomes from if he wasn't Joseph's real son ?

Torridon,

Where did Adam get his Y from?

The concept of the first man should really explain that.
With God NOTHING is impossible.

[Sassy]

.. and yet in Mk10 18 Jesus is alleged to have said to a follower : Why do you call me good? There is only one Good and that is God.

Like they couldn't make the connection?

[Sassy]

There are just as many attested writings, if not more, that Attis, Osiris, Dionysus, Tammuz, Mithras, Adonis and numerous others did exist, where is your proof that they didn't?

They don't exist now and neither did they ever show they did when it comes to deities etc

[Hope]

There are just as many attested writings, if not more, that Attis, Osiris, Dionysus, Tammuz, Mithras, Adonis and numerous others did exist, where is your proof that they didn't?

And they are extant where, Ricky?

[torridon]

Torridon,

Where did Adam get his Y from?

The concept of the first man should really explain that.
With God NOTHING is impossible.

You are using one crackpot idea as if it somehow lends authority to another crackpot idea.  If Jesus didn't have an earthly father then he would lack Y chromosomes in which case he probably wouldn't have survived to term and even if he did he would have been a woman not a man.  And if god created Adam from scratch and all our genetic inheritance derives from him you have to wonder why god would choose to splice in all the legacy DNA from our prehuman ancestors to make us look as if we had descended through lines of mammalian ancestry and you'd have to wonder why he also decided to splice in all the ancient viral insertions into his DNA and why he chose splice in several thousand heritable disorders into the Adam DNA to create unnecessary suffering for his descendants.

[floo]

They don't exist now and neither did they ever show they did when it comes to deities etc

No god exists they are all human productions, imo.

[Sebastian Toe]

Like they couldn't make the connection?

Did they make the connectipn, that he is god?

[Sassy]

You are using one crackpot idea as if it somehow lends authority to another crackpot idea.

It was you who asked...

I think that avoided, rather than answered, my question.  A son inherits half his characteristics from his mother's line and half from his father's line.  Did he inherit from Joseph, or was he a clone of Mary, where did he get his Y chromosomes from if he wasn't Joseph's real son ?

I told you...

Torridon,wrote:

Where did Adam get his Y from?

The concept of the first man should really explain that.
With God NOTHING is impossible.

We were discussing Jesus and Adam, were we not both biblical in the bible? If Adam was created with a Y chromosome bu God
then where would Jesus have got his from? God the Father of all mankind. So why make an unreasoned statement when God obviously created all chromosomes?

If Jesus didn't have an earthly father then he would lack Y chromosomes in which case he probably wouldn't have survived to term and even if he did he would have been a woman not a man.

Adam and Christ, didn't have a human Father but both had a Y chromosome... What does that tell you about the first Adam/man made by God without man and the second Adam who was Jesus Christ made by God without a man?

Do you really require having to have it spelled out? Should you be discussing things which are obvious in the bible?

  And if god created Adam from scratch and all our genetic inheritance derives from him you have to wonder why god would choose to splice in all the legacy DNA from our prehuman ancestors to make us look as if we had descended through lines of mammalian ancestry and you'd have to wonder why he also decided to splice in all the ancient viral insertions into his DNA and why he chose splice in several thousand heritable disorders into the Adam DNA to create unnecessary suffering for his descendants.

You haven't a clue have you. You have pain and suffering because Adam fell and could not eat from the tree of life.
Adam handed human kind over to Satan. He caused the suffering and decay. Now perhaps you can read the bible then you won't have to ask the questions it already answers.

[Sassy]

Did they make the connectipn, that he is god?

How would that be? Well you asked the question you can now explain  how such a question would have arose.
Yeah right... you cannot even give us a reason using the bible for such a question. Should read the bible.

[Sebastian Toe]

How would that be? Well you asked the question you can now explain  how such a question would have arose.
Yeah right... you cannot even give us a reason using the bible for such a question. Should read the bible.

You should read a dictionary - 'soon'!