England fans and the way things are now

[Rhiannon]

Ok, so the twattishness of England fans abroad has long been a thing. But it's not really been much of an issue in recent years. Is this kind of behaviour yet another symptom of where we are heading or am I just making connections where there aren't any?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/45865145

[Humph Warden Bennett]

I proudly wear a Bromley FC  T shirt.

Yes. Division Five. But we cheer on our team. Bollocks to plastic  Man U supporters.

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Good on yer. Nothing more irritating than Cockney Reds, their excuses for supporting Man U being that their greatgrandmother spent the weekend in Manchester once.

[Rhiannon]

I'm not sure that what I was getting at has been understood. Never mind.

[Nearly Sane]

Not sure would be my take. That there was so little trouble in Russia may be affected by the impression that the Russian were not going to be tolerant but then so much of any violence is often 'excused' because of police action. There's an attraction in linking it to a more xenophobic attitude and drawing lines to other events but not sure there is enough evidence for it. Might be interesting to know what chanting was going on around any incidents.

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Probably a mixture of booze and a bit of out of order behaviour, and OB eager to give someone a hiding.

[Humph Warden Bennett]

I'm not sure that what I was getting at has been understood. Never mind.

Ok since I derailed, I will get back on track.

There is some rivalry between Bromley, and Eastleigh. And between Bromley, and Maidstone United (Welling United do not matter, since it is unprofessional to kill feeble targets).

On a larger level, there is little love lost between Charlton, and Crystal Palace (Millwall are beyond the pale for both).

On an even larger level, there is little love lost between Scotland, and England (and I have to say I laughed out loud when I saw the Jock boys holding a banner at a Scotland v Argentina game with the logo "Thanks for 1986").

Those are examples of overt racism, yes, but they do not matter. What does matter is kicking the crap of out of somebody because of the team that he supports, just because he supports that team. And that is assault. And it ain't just the British Isles where it happens.

[Rhiannon]

I think that what I was getting at is that England fans haven't caused problems for a while. We're seeing the rise of the far right here, and people are getting angry. I just wondered if the former is a sign of the latter. And the rise of the rise of the far right here isn't just about racism.

[Humph Warden Bennett]

I think that what I was getting at is that England fans haven't caused problems for a while. We're seeing the rise of the far right here, and people are getting angry. I just wondered if the former is a sign of the latter. And the rise of the rise of the far right here isn't just about racism.

I remember the former National Front organising a "Young NF five a side football tournament" in the seventies. Then the NF fell apart through internal wrangling.

In my experience the far right will fall apart again because sooner or later somebody else is going to want to be Fuhrer. I hope that happens sooner rather than later.

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Is the far right on the rise? I don't know but I don't think football fans are drawn to it more than anyother group of people.

[Rhiannon]

Is the far right on the rise? I don't know but I don't think football fans are drawn to it more than anyother group of people.

Yes it is. There was definitely a link between the NF and supporting WHU when I was a kid but that may have been coincidental.

[Humph Warden Bennett]

Is the far right on the rise? I don't know but I don't think football fans are drawn to it more than anyother group of people.

Sorry Paul but this time you are wrong.

There are few things more nationalistic, than is sport.

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Yes it is. There was definitely a link between the NF and supporting WHU when I was a kid but that may have been coincidental.

No more than at Chelsea or Millwall or anywhere else. Of course football fans were easier targets in the sense that you have thousands of them congregating in one place, but it doesn't mean they're more susceptible to far right ideology (and by far right I mean neonazism/fascism).

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Sorry Paul but this time you are wrong.

There are few things more nationalistic, than is sport.

I don't think they're necessarily the same thing, that is the tribalism of supporting your national team and nationalism. No doubt they overlap somewhat, and for some more than others, but they don't completely occupy the same space.