Author Topic: Genetic Memory  (Read 3188 times)

Enki

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Re: Genetic Memory
« Reply #25 on: March 12, 2019, 11:05:47 AM »

I know that evolution is a real phenomenon. I have never denied that.

The discussion is about the process that leads to evolutionary change, survival and complexity.  Random variation and NS cannot be the main driving process. Phenotypic plasticity and epigenetic change are the driving forces that lead to adaptation and survival.   


Phenotypic plasticity is usually thought to be an evolutionary adaptation. Epigentics is subsidiary to genetic variation, a sort of fine tuning of the genes.

Hence neither are the driving forces that lead to adaptation and survival. They are both dependent on evolution, for which natural selection and genetic drift are the most established explanations, established because of the evidence which they have amassed.
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torridon

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Re: Genetic Memory
« Reply #26 on: March 12, 2019, 12:58:25 PM »

I know that evolution is a real phenomenon. I have never denied that.

You keep denying it, repeatedly; every time you write that NS is a metaphor and not a real process you are denying it.

The discussion is about the process that leads to evolutionary change, survival and complexity.  Random variation and NS cannot be the main driving process. Phenotypic plasticity and epigenetic change are the driving forces that lead to adaptation and survival.   

That's just incorrect though. Epigenetics for instance is a factor, part of the bigger picture, but a relatively minor factor; epigenetic changes from what I understand tend not to have the same persistence down generations as genomic mutations.

Sriram

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Re: Genetic Memory
« Reply #27 on: March 12, 2019, 03:11:56 PM »
You keep denying it, repeatedly; every time you write that NS is a metaphor and not a real process you are denying it.

That's just incorrect though. Epigenetics for instance is a factor, part of the bigger picture, but a relatively minor factor; epigenetic changes from what I understand tend not to have the same persistence down generations as genomic mutations.


What?!!! You don't understand the difference between denying Natural Selection and denying evolution?!   ::)

From the articles given above, epigenetics does not seem to be a 'minor' factor. In fact the article states that many epigenetic factors...'can be erroneously misinterpreted as genetic variance'.



Sriram

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Re: Genetic Memory
« Reply #28 on: March 26, 2019, 12:51:47 PM »




One more recent article on the same subject.......

http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20190326-what-is-epigenetics

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For those who survived, the harrowing experiences marked many of them for life. They returned to society with impaired health, worse job prospects and shorter life expectancy. But the impact of these hardships did not stop with those who experienced it. It also had an effect on the prisoners’ children and grandchildren, which appeared to be passed down the male line of families.

While their sons and grandsons had not suffered the hardships of the PoW camps – and if anything were well provided for through their childhoods – they suffered higher rates of mortality than the wider population. It appeared the PoWs had passed on some element of their trauma to their offspring.

But unlike most inherited conditions, this was not caused by mutations to the genetic code itself. Instead, the researchers were investigating a much more obscure type of inheritance: how events in someone’s lifetime can change the way their DNA is expressed, and how that change can be passed on to the next generation.

This is the process of epigenetics, where the readability, or expression, of genes is modified without changing the DNA code itself.

Your experiences during your lifetime – particularly traumatic ones – would have a very real impact on your family for generations to come. There are a growing number of studies that support the idea that the effects of trauma can reverberate down the generations through epigenetics.

The sons of PoW veterans were also slightly more likely to die from cancer. But the daughters of former PoWs appeared to be immune to these effects.

This unusual sex-linked pattern was one of the reasons that made Costa suspect that these health differences were caused by epigenetic changes.

“The hypothesis is that there’s an epigenetic effect on the Y chromosome,” says Costa. This effect is consistent with studies in remote Swedish villages, where shortages in food supply had a generational effect down the male line, but not the female line.

And knowing that the consequences of our own actions and experiences now could affect the lives of our children – even long before they might be conceived – could put a very different spin on how we choose to live.

“There’s a malleability to the system,” says Dias. “The die is not cast. For the most part, we are not messed up as a human race, even though trauma abounds in our environment.”

At least in some cases, Dias says, healing the effects of trauma in our lifetimes can put a stop to it echoing further down the generations.

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jeremyp

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Re: Genetic Memory
« Reply #29 on: March 26, 2019, 01:44:37 PM »



One more recent article on the same subject.......

http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20190326-what-is-epigenetics

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If you read the link I posted, you'll see that epigenetic effects disappear after a couple of generations. I repeat, this isn't the magic bullet you think it is.
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Sriram

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Re: Genetic Memory
« Reply #30 on: March 27, 2019, 04:25:01 AM »


And if you have read my links you will realize that epigenetics is probably the most important mechanism to explain phenotypic plasticity and adaptations.

Don't think it is going to just wither and go away!  They have just started on epigenetics.

jeremyp

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Re: Genetic Memory
« Reply #31 on: March 28, 2019, 01:28:27 PM »

And if you have read my links you will realize that epigenetics is probably the most important mechanism to explain phenotypic plasticity and adaptations.

Don't think it is going to just wither and go away!  They have just started on epigenetics.

No.
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