Corbyn at the Fabian

[Hope]

In a speech at the Fabian Society earlier today, Jeremy Corbyn suggested that a future Labour Government could "ban companies from paying dividends to shareholders unless they pay workers the living wage, ... "  http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-35330331  He also noted that of the G7 nations, only the USA has a greater wealth divergence (not the term he used, but I can't remember the exact wording) than the UK

He also said that, if he was to become Prime Minister, he would honour hs pledge to renationalise the railways, saying that bthis would make the fares cheaper.  One of the big problems with nationalised industries in the past was the issue of demarcation where what a person could do would be rigidly segmented - such that, in the mines for instance, an electrical job that could be done by a single person within a building company, might need to be done incrementally by 2 or even 3 people.  Would this kind of mentality still exist?  Would nationalised businesses begin to become overstaffed, thus raising prices rather than reducing them?

Returning to the opening point I made, how easy would this requirement be to police or control?  Why stop there?  Why not say that companies trading in the UK, regardless of where their HQs are, would not be allowed to pay dividends to British shareholders unless the company paid its fair share of corporation and other taxes?

[Aruntraveller]

Would nationalised businesses begin to become overstaffed, thus raising prices rather than reducing them?

Oh aye - because having umpteen different energy companies to choose from doesn't increase staffing levels 

And as we have seen has been so successful at keeping energy prices down.

And if you didn't get it there was an emphasis on sarcasm there.

[Diarthrognathus Josteyn Ward]

Ye gods, Trent, you still posting here??

BTW, Robin Hood Energy. Especially where you live. Not for profit, and cheaper than the competition.

No shareholders, no paid directors, run by the council.

[Aruntraveller]

Ye gods, Trent, you still posting here??

BTW, Robin Hood Energy. Especially where you live. Not for profit, and cheaper than the competition

Josteyn

Still keeping my eye on them   Had heard about Robin Hood energy but we fall outside the City so weren't sure if we were eligible - and been dealing with other issues so energy providers low on the list. Although with the snow now falling outside my window perhaps its time to investigate further! Good to hear from you. Hope you are keeping well.

[Outrider]

In a speech at the Fabian Society earlier today, Jeremy Corbyn suggested that a future Labour Government could "ban companies from paying dividends to shareholders unless they pay workers the living wage, ... "  http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-35330331  He also noted that of the G7 nations, only the USA has a greater wealth divergence (not the term he used, but I can't remember the exact wording) than the UK

Great in principle, difficult to apply. A more effective solution would be to set the minimum wage as a living wage rather than just rebranding it as such as has been done now, and making sure it applies to everyone who is working, not just those over 25.

He also said that, if he was to become Prime Minister, he would honour hs pledge to renationalise the railways, saying that bthis would make the fares cheaper.  One of the big problems with nationalised industries in the past was the issue of demarcation where what a person could do would be rigidly segmented - such that, in the mines for instance, an electrical job that could be done by a single person within a building company, might need to be done incrementally by 2 or even 3 people.  Would this kind of mentality still exist?  Would nationalised businesses begin to become overstaffed, thus raising prices rather than reducing them?

Renationlising the railways makes sense, purely because it's not a market in which companies can genuinely compete for customers - you need to take the train you need to take, which is only being run by one company.

Returning to the opening point I made, how easy would this requirement be to police or control?

Virtually impossible. All that would happen is that the company would be restructured into sub-holdings, each holding a 'band' of pay grades - the lowest paid work would be pressured even more to be outsourced to contractors, making those roles less secure.

Why stop there?  Why not say that companies trading in the UK, regardless of where their HQs are, would not be allowed to pay dividends to British shareholders unless the company paid its fair share of corporation and other taxes?

The overwhelming majority of companies already pay the legally required taxes - the problem isn't that they don't pay what they should, it's that what they should be paying is set so low, but that's not something that the UK government can change in isolation. The only way around that is to charge at the point of payment rather than at the point of profit or earnings, but that curtails spending and the economy stagnates. Unless there's a concerted push from a broad range of governments to close down tax benefits for large corporations it's going to continue to be a race to the bottom.

O.

[Hope]

Oh aye - because having umpteen different energy companies to choose from doesn't increase staffing levels 

And as we have seen has been so successful at keeping energy prices down.

And if you didn't get it there was an emphasis on sarcasm there.

I noticed that, but then excessive employment over a number of companies is somewhat different to excessive employment within a single company.  Like you, I feel that there are far too many companies engaged in identical activities - be that energy provision, telecommunications (by the way, what's your take on the the BT/EE link-up?), transport, perhaps even local government provision.  However I'm questioning whether nationalisation of such services is the best way forward.

[Gonnagle]

Dear Hope,

Commonsense, that is the man's message, no sorry! commonsense and greed, it is not rocket science, even poor uneducated me gets it, a fairer society, who on this forum does not want a fairer society.

As for the renationalisation of the railways, our Vlad hit the nail on the head many moons ago, the government wants us all working but the unemployed can't afford to travel to appointments, citizens on low wages find the cost of travelling to and from work uneconomical, what was it Vlad said, something about keeping the wheels of industry flowing.

Not forgetting the con that we all fall for year in and year out, the price of your ticket is only going up ***%, we rail a little and then just accept it, probably a science behind why we allow this con to continue.

Gonnagle.

[Aruntraveller]

Hi hope in principle I would like to see renationalisation of the utilities but in practical terms I cannot see a realistic and econimically sensible way of doing it.
We are in a completely different scenario to that faced by the post war govt of Atlee. How you would even go about untangling the web of foreign companies invlolved, Deutschbahn and EDF to name but two with relation to EU law I cannot even begin to contemplate. Although if there was a no vote in the referendum it may make that bit easier....but still it just seems like humpty dumpty to.me. Too many broken pieces to put back together again.
It hurts me to say it but I do think renationalisation is a non starter.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Ye gods, Trent, you still posting here??

BTW, Robin Hood Energy. Especially where you live. Not for profit, and cheaper than the competition.

No shareholders, no paid directors, run by the council.

Diarthrognagus!As I live and breathe............I thought you were extinct old chap.

[jakswan]

I'm baffled by this policy, why not just increase the living wage. On Marr when asked Corbyn explained that companies get around it. Then bring in better legislation?

I'd support stricter controls on paying the living wage but Corbyn says things that play up his far left image.

If he wants to get power then he should learn how to spin like Sturgeon or Blair!