Searching for GOD...

[Outrider]

Well if you were right- yes. But you are wrong,how do I know I experience God daily.

If - and it's an if - I'm wrong, you do realise we're not just going to take your word for it. You'll need to explain why you think I'm wrong.

As to how do you know you experience God? I'd suggest that you don't, though you quite probably sincerely believe it. I don't even know that you exist, though it's entirely likely.

O.

[floo]

Well if you were right- yes. But you are wrong,how do I know I experience God daily.

  ~TW~

All in the mind!

[~TW~]

One way we see god working is sending a Judgment on all you liberal left wing lackies  with a Judgement of a  Tory Government

 Positive proof of God

    ~TW~

[floo]

One way we see god working is sending a Judgment on all you liberal left wing lackies  with a Judgement of a  Tory Government

 Positive proof of God

    ~TW~

Blimey TW, you would fit right in if you lived in the USA Bible belt with all those extreme religious rightwing loonies! 

[Outrider]

One way we see god working is sending a Judgment on all you liberal left wing lackies  with a Judgement of a  Tory Government

 Positive proof of God

God's a Tory supporter? It's TW's 'Jump the Shark' moment...

O.

[wigginhall]

One way we see god working is sending a Judgment on all you liberal left wing lackies  with a Judgement of a  Tory Government

 Positive proof of God

    ~TW~

Finally, it all makes sense.  God wants more poor people and disabled people to starve, and also more children to live in poverty, so he thought, jings, the best way to achieve this is a Tory government!  Hey, this theology stuff is a cinch.  Ding dong merrily on high!   

[ippy]

Until your example of deluded becomes more than mere opinion about believers.
Then there is no truth is there and no evidence to condemn anyone.
Which means that opinion; yours in this case has no basis or truth in it to matter.

Hi Sass, make the OED your first call and then lookup deluded, I think Len pointed something like this out to you.

Now assuming you've got the exact meaning of deluded in mind and you're in front of a mirror, well?

ippy

[~TW~]

Finally, it all makes sense.  God wants more poor people and disabled people to starve, and also more children to live in poverty, so he thought, jings, the best way to achieve this is a Tory government!  Hey, this theology stuff is a cinch.  Ding dong merrily on high!

Wiggs

 That is brilliant you nearly have it right but not quite would you like me to expand and then you will see there is a God.

 ~TW~

 

[ippy]

Blimey TW, you would fit right in if you lived in the USA Bible belt with all those extreme religious rightwing loonies! 

        .

ippy

[ippy]

One of the recurrant points made on this thread is "If He exists, why does God not intervene more often to help us"

At Mass this morning I was struck by the profound nature of our gift of freedom.  Just going back to the parable of the prodigal son, the father not only allows his son to choose, but he does not intervene even when he knows that there will be bad consequences to his son's choices.  He allows His son to suffer the consequences, but his love is still constant as he waits patiently, hoping for his return.  And when his son does turn back to him, there is no punishment waiting for squandering his inheritace - because the father knows he has learnt his lesson.  So there is no need for punishment or retribution. 

What this implies is that all our earthly experiences, good or bad, including bad consequences to our free choices, are part of a learning process in preparation for meeting our Father in heaven.

Remember, there will be great rejoicing in Heaven whenever a wayward soul returns.

Really Alan, the things you think you know, now this post of yours sits full square, with an exact description of delusional.

ippy

[Outrider]

Wiggs

 That is brilliant you nearly have it right but not quite would you like me to expand and then you will see there is a God.

 ~TW~

Oh, yes please. I'll go home, put on some popcorn and sit down to watch the comedy gold unfold...

O.

[~TW~]

Oh, yes please. I'll go home, put on some popcorn and sit down to watch the comedy gold unfold...

O.

 popcorn is about your mark O-R remember you can get it for nothing at your local Christian church foodbank.

 ~TW~

[floo]

popcorn is about your mark O-R remember you can get it for nothing at your local Christian church foodbank.

 ~TW~

Only if you are in need one hopes, and not to those who don't need free food!

[Alan Burns]

Really Alan, the things you think you know, now this post of yours sits full square, with an exact description of delusional.

ippy

Your definition of delusional would fit most of the world's population.  The sad thing is that you may well find out that you are deluding yourself into thinking you came into existence entirely by natural unguided forces.

[Outrider]

popcorn is about your mark O-R remember you can get it for nothing at your local Christian church foodbank.

Doesn't God prefer those good Tory right-wingers that buy their own, though?

O.

[Outrider]

Your definition of delusional would fit most of the world's population.

In itself that doesn't make it wrong...

The sad thing is that you may well find out that you are deluding yourself into thinking you came into existence entirely by natural unguided forces.

Well, no. If, as seems likely, we have evolved in a purely naturalistic universe, then when we die we'll just cease to exist and won't find out anything. We'll only find out if we're wrong about it...

O.

[ippy]

Your definition of delusional would fit most of the world's population.  The sad thing is that you may well find out that you are deluding yourself into thinking you came into existence entirely by natural unguided forces.

Alan that would be fine if I were, unlike you, working my assumptions from an imaginary or superstitious base.

As ever the ball's in your court, Alan.

ippy

[Leonard James]

Close minded is what your post represents.
As believers we have EVIDENCE to back up our belief.
Because you don't want to believe and therefore receive the evidence for yourself, that is something you decide for yourself.
But it does not mean that believers believe without evidence.
Truth is you won't accept even the merest possibility we have that evidence.
It is your problem alone and not the believers.

The "evidence" believers have is all autosuggestion- I know that because I was once a believer, and knew "God" existed. I felt his presence and he answered my prayers.

When I was very young I believed Santa existed, because there was a lot of evidence when he visited at Christmas and left me and my brothers and sisters presents.

[Alan Burns]

Alan that would be fine if I were, unlike you, working my assumptions from an imaginary or superstitious base.

As ever the ball's in your court, Alan.

ippy

But my base is far more real than you could ever imagine.

You can't begin to know anything about a relationship with God until you actualy enter that relationship.

[Alan Burns]

The "evidence" believers have is all autosuggestion- I know that because I was once a believer, and knew "God" existed. I felt his presence and he answered my prayers.

When I was very young I believed Santa existed, because there was a lot of evidence when he visited at Christmas and left me and my brothers and sisters presents.

The devil has many ways to convince you that God does not exist, even after you have once known Him.

[Shaker]

"It's the Devil wot dunnit" seems to be your standard reply to anything that doesn't fit your worldview or can't answer, Alan. I'm not 100% sure what your motives are in posting here, but it couldn't be clearer that absolutely nobody is even remotely persuaded or convinced by a single argument you've ever made. I suppose that concocting a devil is some sort of defence mechanism; without that scapegoat, the blame thusly diverted may have to be sought uncomfortably closer to home. Given your, let's face it, abject failure to bring anyone around to your way of thinking, the Devil is a very handy patsy or fall guy. After all; if not him - who?

[Walt Zingmatilder]

The "evidence" believers have is all autosuggestion- I know that because I was once a believer, and knew "God" existed. I felt his presence and he answered my prayers.

When I was very young I believed Santa existed, because there was a lot of evidence when he visited at Christmas and left me and my brothers and sisters presents.

I know I am pissing in the wind trying to get you to back an assertion Len, but what evidence do you have that you hold the truth now and not be auto suggested?

[Walt Zingmatilder]

The "evidence" believers have is all autosuggestion- I know that because I was once a believer, and knew "God" existed. I felt his presence and he answered my prayers.

When I was very young I believed Santa existed, because there was a lot of evidence when he visited at Christmas and left me and my brothers and sisters presents.

I know you are wrong because I was once a non believer.I didn't recognise his presence or pray.

So there we are Len completing claims which need further exploration.

As for Santa there are atheists who will tell you that is a cheap and fallacious shot.

[Leonard James]

I know I am pissing in the wind trying to get you to back an assertion Len, but what evidence do you have that you hold the truth now and not be auto suggested?

It's auto-deduced, NOT auto-suggested.

My first belief was due to upbringing and indoctrination in a Christian family and culture.

My second was due to reasoning for myself. When I was young I knew no atheists, and I certainly never read any atheist literature (if any existed at that time).

Fortunately my ability to reason was stronger than my credulity.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

It's auto-deduced, NOT auto-suggested.

My first belief was due to upbringing and indoctrination in a Christian family and culture.

My second was due to reasoning for myself. When I was young I knew no atheists, and I certainly never read any atheist literature (if any existed at that time).

Fortunately my ability to reason was stronger than my credulity.

I.m afraid I can say largely what you have said Len with the added bonus of the atheist case not stacking up in the full self knowledge of being ...............brought about by the actual presence of God.
I can bet my bottom that your reasoning follows a certain school of thought. I am afraid that given that you cannot retreat to the I just don't believe position since that is a position which commands no reason.