Searching for GOD...

[Nearly Sane]

Pedantry will never be dead while  you are alive, NS. 

It's not pedantry to argue that scientific theory should be accurately represented, and if it was I would be proud of being a pedant. The sloppy incorrect use of terminology means that people can import all their woo.

[Nearly Sane]

When it is quite clear what a poster means, being pedantic is nit-picking.

I repeat, the changes that have occurred to produce humans are much more radical than those needed to produce modern viruses.

As already pointed out your interpretation of floo's remarks makes no sense since we were talking about animal consciousness. Using terms 's that in the science have no meaning is not perfectly clear, and is indicative of a lack of understanding.

[Nearly Sane]

It is because he has brainwashed himself into believing the Bible story of creation as fact.

Is Alan a YEC?

[Leonard James]

Is Alan a YEC?

I've no idea, but I'm sure he favours the creation story over evolution.

[Gonnagle]

Dear Leonard,

See!! your conversation with Sane proves my point, I can't help but think that there are millions of kids out there thinking, we evolved from monkeys or apes.

Monkey like, ape like, not descended from but cousins of, or I could have this all wrong We need a proper basic understanding, I can't help but think that some people are running scared of the creationists, the design people, but of course, YEC are scarey, afternoon TW.

Gonnagle.

[Nearly Sane]

I've no idea, but I'm sure he favours the creation story over evolution.

I always the that he was more in line with wigginhall's metaphor of the magic syringe of consciousness being used rather than a talking snake guy.

[floo]

I was under the impression that humans are an ape like species, who evolved faster than other apes. Humans didn't descent from Adam and Eve as the creation myth would have us believe.

[Gordon]

I repeat, the changes that have occurred to produce humans are much more radical than those needed to produce modern viruses.

With respect, Len, that isn't so - the point here is that viruses have evolved (and will continue to evolve) in direct relation to their situation (and any changes to that), as is the case for us humans. This doesn't make us more radical, or in any sense better than viruses, in that both they and us humans are evolved to suit our respective situations.

[Nearly Sane]

I was under the impression that humans are an ape like species, who evolved faster than other apes. Humans didn't descent from Adam and Eve as the creation myth would have us believe.

They haven't evolved 'faster'. What do you think you mean by that term?

[BeRational]

I was under the impression that humans are an ape like species, who evolved faster than other apes. Humans didn't descent from Adam and Eve as the creation myth would have us believe.

No we are an ape suited to our environment, and actually can control our environment.

ALL life on the planet is equally evolved as we are, just in different ways.

I think the mistake people are making is comparing animals to some trait that we have and then find them not as good at it.

How good are you at flying?
A bird might 'think' we are way behind in the evolution stakes, and the bird is at the top.

[Leonard James]

Dear Leonard,

See!! your conversation with Sane proves my point, I can't help but think that there are millions of kids out there thinking, we evolved from monkeys or apes.

We did! The problem, Gonners, is that "humans" didn't suddenly appear. What happened was that an ape was born with what we would now call a human characteristic, and that was the only thing that differed it from other apes. Then one of its descendants developed another different "human characteristic", and over time the differences became so great that the new "ape" finally couldn't interbreed with its original forbears. Probably physical separation of its group from other apes played a great part in the change too.

[Leonard James]

With respect, Len, that isn't so - the point here is that viruses have evolved (and will continue to evolve) in direct relation to their situation (and any changes to that), as is the case for us humans. This doesn't make us more radical, or in any sense better than viruses, in that both they and us humans are evolved to suit our respective situations.

I didn't say that WE are more radical, I said that the changes which had to take place to produce man were more radical than the changes that occurred to produce the modern virus.

[Nearly Sane]

We did! The problem, Gonners, is that "humans" didn't suddenly appear. What happened was that an ape was born with what we would now call a human characteristic, and that was the only thing that differed it from other apes. Then one of its descendants developed another different "human characteristic", and over time the differences became so great that the new "ape" finally couldn't interbreed with its original forbears. Probably physical separation of its group from other apes played a great part in the change too.

Just no. We evolved from a common ancestor. The above misunderstanding is exactly the sort of thing that leads to the daft 'why are there still monkeys?' question and goes back to the idea that somehow chimpanzees and gorillas are less evolved than us.

[Leonard James]

Just no. We evolved from a common ancestor.

And what species was that common ancestor?

[Gonnagle]

Dear Leonard,

Ape like, if I have right ( please let me have it right, please, please!! ) before there was our modern day ape, no wait, haud oan, there was ape like things, we branched off one way and the apes branched off another way.

Gonnagle.

[Nearly Sane]

Dear Leonard,

Ape like, if I have right ( please let me have it right, please, please!! ) before there was our modern day ape, no wait, haud oan, there was ape like things, we branched off one way and the apes branched off another way.

Gonnagle.

Nope, we are apes.

[Leonard James]

Dear Leonard,

Ape like, if I have right ( please let me have it right, please, please!! ) before there was our modern day ape, no wait, haud oan, there was ape like things, we branched off one way and the apes branched off another way.

Gonnagle.

Correct. But the ape branch didn't change very much or become a separate species. We did.

[Gonnagle]

Dear Sane,

Yes my brain has just gone "tilt" back to the F****** drawing board for me.

Actually, now that I have read Leonards post, the both of you can go and

Gonnagle.

[Nearly Sane]

Correct. But the ape branch didn't change very much or become a separate species. We did.

Incorrect.

[floo]

NS is the expert!

[Nearly Sane]

NS is the expert!

In comparison to someone who thinks humans evolved faster, yes, I am.

[floo]

In comparison to someone who thinks humans evolved faster, yes, I am.

Really?

[Nearly Sane]

Really?

Yes, really.

Try this as a starter about recent primate evolution. After that, there are quite a few good primers on evolution that you could read.



http://humanorigins.si.edu/education/intro-human-evolution

[Gonnagle]

Dear Sane,

http://humanorigins.si.edu/education/intro-human-evolution


Ape like, very first sentence.

I hate being right all the time

But thank you, your link looks like it ticks all the boxes.

Gonnagle.

[BeRational]

Dear Sane,

http://humanorigins.si.edu/education/intro-human-evolution


Ape like, very first sentence.

I hate being right all the time

But thank you, your link looks like it ticks all the boxes.

Gonnagle.

Well yes ape like, but not like any of todays modern apes.