Author Topic: Searching for GOD...  (Read 3896284 times)

Shaker

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #8750 on: January 25, 2016, 10:48:14 AM »
I have witnessed the amazing transformation of several hardened atheists.
It can happen to anyone, Len, including you.  :)
And yet whenever I or anybody else points out that the reverse is also true, and that staunch religious belief can simply evaporate (sometimes overnight), you deny the mere possibility that it's as likely to happen to you as anybody else.

Why is that, do you think, Alan?
Pain, or damage, don't end the world. Or despair, or fucking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man, and give some back. - Al Swearengen, Deadwood.

Shaker

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #8751 on: January 25, 2016, 10:49:44 AM »
That's nice for you, Alan ...
Can't help hearing Mrs Brown's voice when I read that ;)
Pain, or damage, don't end the world. Or despair, or fucking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man, and give some back. - Al Swearengen, Deadwood.

Leonard James

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #8752 on: January 25, 2016, 10:52:25 AM »
Can't help hearing Mrs Brown's voice when I read that ;)

Feck off!  :)

Alan Burns

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #8753 on: January 25, 2016, 10:56:24 AM »
And yet whenever I or anybody else points out that the reverse is also true, and that staunch religious belief can simply evaporate (sometimes overnight), you deny the mere possibility that it's as likely to happen to you as anybody else.

Why is that, do you think, Alan?
The devil works in mysterious ways :(
The truth will set you free  - John 8:32
Truth is not an abstraction, but a person - Edith Stein
Free will, though it makes evil possible, is also the only thing that makes possible any love or goodness or joy worth having. - CS Lewis
Joy is the Gigantic Secret of Christians - GK Chesterton

ekim

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #8754 on: January 25, 2016, 10:59:07 AM »
Why search for God?

I certainly would not want to search for the Christian God depicted by Dawkins or Hitchens or several prominent members of this forum.  And I would run a mile from the God described by Floo!

Christians are often accused of inventing the God they need to find, but in my experience, when you find God He is not the God you expected.  It is hard to imagine how one God, the creator of the universe, can have a personal relationship with every human being.  But when you find God and He makes Himself known, you will be truly overwhelmed by this personal love.  It brought me to tears when I first encountered it in my mid twenties.  God does not look upon us as a tiny cog in the vast machine of humanity.  Christ's love fills, transforms and glorifies individual human beings.

The words of this hymn come to mind (based on Hosea 14:1)

Come back to me with all your heart
Don’t let fear keep us apart
Trees do bend though straight and tall
So must we to others call

Long have I waited for
Your coming home to me
And living deeply our new li
fe

My hope and prayer is that every member of this forum will come to discover the reality of Christ's love.
A couple of points.  Perhaps you could explain why you switch between 'finding God's love' and 'Christ's love fills'.  Are you one of those Christians who claims that Jesus is God?  The other point is how do you know that the 'love' you experienced is not just the product of a surge of the appropriate hormones which have been triggered by some psychic activity/inactivity?  What makes you attribute it to your God or to Jesus?

Leonard James

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #8755 on: January 25, 2016, 11:02:43 AM »
The devil works in mysterious ways :(

And "God" let's him keep us from finding him? He can't be that interested in us then, can he?

Rhiannon

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #8756 on: January 25, 2016, 11:05:50 AM »
I have witnessed the amazing transformation of several hardened atheists.
It can happen to anyone, Len, including you.  :)

I have been transformed by my non-belief. Have you witnessed this too or do you prefer to pretend it doesn't happen?

Rhiannon

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #8757 on: January 25, 2016, 11:07:51 AM »
The devil works in mysterious ways :(

The truly awful thing is that I think you really believe that.

Leonard James

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #8758 on: January 25, 2016, 11:09:42 AM »
The truly awful thing is that I think you really believe that.

Well, if he believes in a god that only does good things, he has to find an excuse for the bad ones!  :)

Rhiannon

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #8759 on: January 25, 2016, 11:10:54 AM »
Well, if he believes in a god that only does good things, he has to find an excuse for the bad ones!  :)

Plenty of Christians don't believe in the devil as an entity. I never did.

Leonard James

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #8760 on: January 25, 2016, 11:14:51 AM »
Plenty of Christians don't believe in the devil as an entity. I never did.

So if you only believed "God" was good, how did you reconcile such things as cancer and awful volcanic eruptions killing and maiming so many people?

Rhiannon

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #8761 on: January 25, 2016, 11:19:21 AM »
So if you only believed "God" was good, how did you reconcile such things as cancer and awful volcanic eruptions killing and maiming so many people?

I didn't. I accepted I didn't know. Not did I do the 'perfect plan' thing either...'through a glass darkly' was more my way.

Shaker

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #8762 on: January 25, 2016, 11:56:35 AM »
The devil works in mysterious ways :(
So logically you must therefore believe that those who have had a religious belief and then lost it - posters here such as Lenny and Rhiannon and plenty more besides - have been deceived by Satan. Do you believe this or not?
Pain, or damage, don't end the world. Or despair, or fucking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man, and give some back. - Al Swearengen, Deadwood.

Alan Burns

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #8763 on: January 25, 2016, 11:58:50 AM »
A couple of points.  Perhaps you could explain why you switch between 'finding God's love' and 'Christ's love fills'.  Are you one of those Christians who claims that Jesus is God?
All Christians I know believe that Jesus is God made man.
Quote

 The other point is how do you know that the 'love' you experienced is not just the product of a surge of the appropriate hormones which have been triggered by some psychic activity/inactivity?  What makes you attribute it to your God or to Jesus?
I presume it all boils down to faith.  I have no physical proof, just my own personal concept of reality.
The truth will set you free  - John 8:32
Truth is not an abstraction, but a person - Edith Stein
Free will, though it makes evil possible, is also the only thing that makes possible any love or goodness or joy worth having. - CS Lewis
Joy is the Gigantic Secret of Christians - GK Chesterton

Alan Burns

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #8764 on: January 25, 2016, 12:00:13 PM »
So logically you must therefore believe that those who have had a religious belief and then lost it - posters here such as Lenny and Rhiannon and plenty more besides - have been deceived by Satan. Do you believe this or not?
Of course I do.
The truth will set you free  - John 8:32
Truth is not an abstraction, but a person - Edith Stein
Free will, though it makes evil possible, is also the only thing that makes possible any love or goodness or joy worth having. - CS Lewis
Joy is the Gigantic Secret of Christians - GK Chesterton

Alan Burns

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  • I lay it down of my own free will. John 10:18
Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #8765 on: January 25, 2016, 12:10:15 PM »
The truly awful thing is that I think you really believe that.

The King of Twist
by Steve Turner:


You twist with guile, you twist with charm,
You twist my mind, you twist my arm,
You twisted silver in my palm:
You are the King of Twist.

You twist and speak, you twist and stare,
You twist in grass, you twist in air,
You twist until the twist is there:
You are the King of Twist.

You twist the screw, you twist the vice,
You twist the rope, you twist the knife,
You twist the living out of life:
You are the King of Twist.

You twist the thorn, you twist the whip,
You twist the kiss, you twist the lip,
You twist the spear, you twist the tip:
You are the King of Twist.

You twist the nail that twists your fate,
You twist towards the judgement date,
Which is the final twist.
This is the final twist.


The truth will set you free  - John 8:32
Truth is not an abstraction, but a person - Edith Stein
Free will, though it makes evil possible, is also the only thing that makes possible any love or goodness or joy worth having. - CS Lewis
Joy is the Gigantic Secret of Christians - GK Chesterton

Shaker

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #8766 on: January 25, 2016, 12:23:53 PM »
Of course I do.
This sort of thing really does make me wonder why on earth anybody even bothers to try having a rational conversation with you.
Pain, or damage, don't end the world. Or despair, or fucking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man, and give some back. - Al Swearengen, Deadwood.

Gonnagle

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #8767 on: January 25, 2016, 01:09:59 PM »
Dear Alan,

Lets twist again, which reminds me, does the Devil have all the best tunes.

Dear floo,

Right now on radio 2, talking about tinitus. tinnitus.

Gonnagle.
http://www.barnardos.org.uk/shop/shop-search.htm

http://www.twam.uk/donate-tools

Go on make a difference, have a rummage in your attic or garage.

floo

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #8768 on: January 25, 2016, 01:19:13 PM »
Dear Alan,

Lets twist again, which reminds me, does the Devil have all the best tunes.

Dear floo,

Right now on radio 2, talking about tinitus. tinnitus.

Gonnagle.

Tinnitus an unpleasant condition which I have had for over 30 years, and has got much worse in the last 10 years, or so. I can hear it over the sound of the traffic when I am driving! :o

Maeght

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #8769 on: January 25, 2016, 01:26:14 PM »
Me too. And hyperaccusis so simple noises like light switches or the clink of china hurt!

floo

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #8770 on: January 25, 2016, 01:31:34 PM »
Me too. And hyperaccusis so simple noises like light switches or the clink of china hurt!

I hadn't come across the term hyperaccusis  before now. I don't think I suffer from it, even though music stresses me out.

torridon

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #8771 on: January 25, 2016, 01:38:39 PM »
I have no physical proof, just my own personal concept of reality.

As Eagleman points out, for each of us, our own experience of reality is something unique to the individual; it is something fabricated by our brain and each brain is slightly different.

Consider this : I thought about buying a virtual reality headset for my kids at Christmas. Didn't in the end. But in truth, we, each of us, already have such a thing, it is called a brain. That is what our brain is, in effect, an organic virtual reality headset that we can never ever take off; we are stuck with it for life; the 'reality' created for us by our brains is the only one we can ever experience but it is not 'real' reality, it has no remit to show us the truth of what is out there; rather, our reality stream is a useful fiction which continually blends new experience into models accumulated from past experience. This is why we need science - to discover what is objectively valid, we need to eliminate personal experience as a guide and compare collective accounts of experience for common denominators 

Gonnagle

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #8772 on: January 25, 2016, 01:40:20 PM »
Dear floo,

Quote
Tinnitus an unpleasant condition which I have had for over 30 years, and has got much worse in the last 10 years, or so. I can hear it over the sound of the traffic when I am driving!

Yes I know, you told us all years ago, I am a fellow sufferer, so is Tony Blackburn, there are about 6 million of us in this country alone.

Gonnagle.
http://www.barnardos.org.uk/shop/shop-search.htm

http://www.twam.uk/donate-tools

Go on make a difference, have a rummage in your attic or garage.

floo

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #8773 on: January 25, 2016, 01:42:31 PM »
Dear floo,

Yes I know, you told us all years ago, I am a fellow sufferer, so is Tony Blackburn, there are about 6 million of us in this country alone.

Gonnagle.

What has tinnitus to do with this thread?

ippy

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #8774 on: January 25, 2016, 01:43:29 PM »
Dear Alan,

Lets twist again, which reminds me, does the Devil have all the best tunes.

Dear floo,

Right now on radio 2, talking about tinitus. tinnitus.

Gonnagle.

If it's a good tune it's a good tune, it doesn't really matter where the tune comes from, I like to hear Gregorian chants, all puncher material Gonners, from time to time.

ippy