Author Topic: Searching for GOD... (Read 3883600 times)

Dicky Underpants · « **Reply #11900 on:** April 04, 2016, 04:20:24 PM »

Quote from: Alan Burns on April 04, 2016, 04:01:03 PM

But I can confidently predict that my "meaningless assertions" will one day be discovered to comprise the very meaning behind our existence.

Including the Second Coming, forsooth? Long overdue, as can be seen from notes of disquiet even within the New Testament itself. Even if this were not the case (it is the case - Jesus was wrong - I can make assertions too), as blue says, simply making assertions on the basis of your interpretation of some ancient texts is not the way to establish truths.
I can provide an argument as to why Jesus was wrong - what is your argument that he was right in his eschatology?

Shaker · « **Reply #11901 on:** April 04, 2016, 04:23:35 PM »

Quote from: Alan Burns on April 04, 2016, 04:01:03 PM

But I can confidently predict ...

Nope.

SusanDoris · « **Reply #11902 on:** April 04, 2016, 06:09:45 PM »

Quote from: Alan Burns on April 04, 2016, 04:01:03 PM

But I can confidently predict that my "meaningless assertions" will one day be discovered to comprise the very meaning behind our existence.

What is the 'very meaning behind our existence'?

jjohnjil · « **Reply #11903 on:** April 04, 2016, 06:22:22 PM »

Quote from: SusanDoris on April 04, 2016, 06:09:45 PM

What is the 'very meaning behind our existence'?

But, Susan, he's just told you ... it's his meaningless assertions!

Alan Burns · « **Reply #11904 on:** April 04, 2016, 11:20:09 PM »

Quote from: SusanDoris on April 04, 2016, 06:09:45 PM

What is the 'very meaning behind our existence'?

May I quote the words of Fr Bede Jarrett:

And life is eternal and love is immortal, and death is only an horizon, and an horizon is nothing save the limit of our sight. Lift us up, strong Son of God, that we may see further ....

When we see beyond the horizon, we will discover the true meaning of our existence.

Shaker · « **Reply #11905 on:** April 04, 2016, 11:24:47 PM »

Aaaaaaaaaaaand the Assertatron is chugging away nicely again.

Leonard James · « **Reply #11906 on:** April 05, 2016, 06:21:31 AM »

Quote from: Alan Burns on April 04, 2016, 11:20:09 PM

May I quote the words of Fr Bede Jarrett:

And life is eternal and love is immortal, and death is only an horizon, and an horizon is nothing save the limit of our sight. Lift us up, strong Son of God, that we may see further ....

When we see beyond the horizon, we will discover the true meaning of our existence.

This merely demonstrates that Fr Bede was as deluded as you are, Alan.

Rhiannon · « **Reply #11907 on:** April 05, 2016, 10:06:10 AM »

Quote from: Alan Burns on April 04, 2016, 11:20:09 PM

May I quote the words of Fr Bede Jarrett:

And life is eternal and love is immortal, and death is only an horizon, and an horizon is nothing save the limit of our sight. Lift us up, strong Son of God, that we may see further ....

When we see beyond the horizon, we will discover the true meaning of our existence.

Well yes, you may, but it might have been better if you hadn't.

Alan Burns · « **Reply #11908 on:** April 05, 2016, 10:30:01 AM »

Apologies for my last post. The words were by William Penn, a devout Quaker and founder of the province of Pennsylvania. They were from a prayer used by Fr Bede.

Here is the prayer in full:

We give them back to thee, dear Lord, who gavest them to us;
Yet as thou dost not lose them in giving, so we have not lost them by their return.
Not as the world giveth, givest thou, O Lover of Souls.
What thou gavest, thou takest not away,
For what is thine is ours also if we are thine.
And Life is eternal and Love is immortal, and death is only an horizon, and an horizon is nothing save the limit of our sight.
Lift us up, strong Son of God, that we may see further;
Cleanse our eyes that we may see more clearly;
Draw us closer to thyself so that we may know ourselves to be nearer to our loved ones who are with thee.
And while thou dost prepare a place for us, prepare us also for that happy place, that where thou art we may be also for evermore.

Prayer used by Fr Bede Jarrett, O.P.

prayer written by William Penn
1644 - 1718

Walt Zingmatilder · « **Reply #11909 on:** April 05, 2016, 10:39:16 AM »

Quote from: Floo on April 05, 2016, 10:15:18 AM

Jarrett made an assertion without any evidence to substantiate it.

I think Jarrett is working from his experience of Christ who is himself experienced as resurrected. You of course are working from ontological materialism, which is mysteriously derived from goodness knows what, in which there is no real thing as self or consciousness and the human is in fact a P Zombie automaton.

BeRational · « **Reply #11910 on:** April 05, 2016, 10:55:02 AM »

Quote from: Alan Burns on April 05, 2016, 10:30:01 AM

Apologies for my last post. The words were by William Penn, a devout Quaker and founder of the province of Pennsylvania. They were from a prayer used by Fr Bede.

Here is the prayer in full:

We give them back to thee, dear Lord, who gavest them to us;
Yet as thou dost not lose them in giving, so we have not lost them by their return.
Not as the world giveth, givest thou, O Lover of Souls.
What thou gavest, thou takest not away,
For what is thine is ours also if we are thine.
And Life is eternal and Love is immortal, and death is only an horizon, and an horizon is nothing save the limit of our sight.
Lift us up, strong Son of God, that we may see further;
Cleanse our eyes that we may see more clearly;
Draw us closer to thyself so that we may know ourselves to be nearer to our loved ones who are with thee.
And while thou dost prepare a place for us, prepare us also for that happy place, that where thou art we may be also for evermore.

Prayer used by Fr Bede Jarrett, O.P.

prayer written by William Penn
1644 - 1718

So what?

Why should anyone care?

Alan Burns · « **Reply #11911 on:** April 05, 2016, 11:13:13 AM »

Quote from: BeRational on April 05, 2016, 10:55:02 AM

So what?

Why should anyone care?

I just wanted to share this wonderful insight.

It is hard to describe the absolute joy of reading these words, written by someone who knows God, knowing them to be truly inspired.

Stranger · « **Reply #11912 on:** April 05, 2016, 11:25:45 AM »

Quote from: Jonique Anoo on April 05, 2016, 10:39:16 AM

Quote from: Floo on April 05, 2016, 10:15:18 AM
Jarrett made an assertion without any evidence to substantiate it.
...You of course are working from ontological materialism...

That doesn't follow from what Floo said.

Learn some logic!!!

BeRational · « **Reply #11913 on:** April 05, 2016, 11:28:03 AM »

Quote from: Alan Burns on April 05, 2016, 11:13:13 AM

I just wanted to share this wonderful insight.

It is hard to describe the absolute joy of reading these words, written by someone who knows God, knowing them to be truly inspired.

I do not see them as any sort of insight.
I believe they believe in god, but I do not believe they know god.
I do not believe the words are inspired by a god, just written by a human.

Why would you think anything else?

Walt Zingmatilder · « **Reply #11914 on:** April 05, 2016, 11:51:01 AM »

Quote from: Some Kind of Stranger on April 05, 2016, 11:25:45 AM

...You of course are working from ontological materialism...

That doesn't follow from what Floo said.

Learn some logic!!!

Of course it does.

Stranger · « **Reply #11915 on:** April 05, 2016, 11:52:07 AM »

Quote from: Jonique Anoo on April 05, 2016, 11:51:01 AM

Of course it does.

Please expand.......

Walt Zingmatilder · « **Reply #11916 on:** April 05, 2016, 11:59:45 AM »

Quote from: Some Kind of Stranger on April 05, 2016, 11:52:07 AM

Please expand.......

The clue is in what Floo means by evidence.

Stranger · « **Reply #11917 on:** April 05, 2016, 12:04:33 PM »

Quote from: Jonique Anoo on April 05, 2016, 11:59:45 AM

The clue is in what Floo means by evidence.

By 'expand' I meant give us your full argument. How exactly, does claiming there is no evidence for something suggest ontological materialism...?

Dicky Underpants · « **Reply #11918 on:** April 05, 2016, 05:04:59 PM »

Quote from: Some Kind of Stranger on April 05, 2016, 12:04:33 PM

By 'expand' I meant give us your full argument. How exactly, does claiming there is no evidence for something suggest ontological materialism...?

I'm sure he'd like us to evaluate the 'evidence of spiritual experience'. Which of course is simply evidence of strange phenomena perceived by our brains. Not much of which - in the vast repertoire of varieties thereof - shows much consistency, even within the religious fold to which he has pledged allegiance. Rather difficult to evaluate such a plethora of psychedelic anomalies.

savillerow · « **Reply #11919 on:** April 05, 2016, 05:18:14 PM »

AB Just to add to your concoction, from the previous post you wrote "prepared for his coming" Can you give me a comprehensive overview as to what then might follow. You did not pursue it fully, you just gave me some Bob Dylan lyrics. The WHOLE world would be what? The people in it would be what? Everything "he " says would be ok by you? This approach may lead to brain death wouldnt you think? But you tell me please.

ippy · « **Reply #11920 on:** April 05, 2016, 08:27:56 PM »

Quote from: Alan Burns on April 05, 2016, 10:30:01 AM

Apologies for my last post. The words were by William Penn, a devout Quaker and founder of the province of Pennsylvania. They were from a prayer used by Fr Bede.

Here is the prayer in full:

We give them back to thee, dear Lord, who gavest them to us;
Yet as thou dost not lose them in giving, so we have not lost them by their return.
Not as the world giveth, givest thou, O Lover of Souls.
What thou gavest, thou takest not away,
For what is thine is ours also if we are thine.
And Life is eternal and Love is immortal, and death is only an horizon, and an horizon is nothing save the limit of our sight.
Lift us up, strong Son of God, that we may see further;
Cleanse our eyes that we may see more clearly;
Draw us closer to thyself so that we may know ourselves to be nearer to our loved ones who are with thee.
And while thou dost prepare a place for us, prepare us also for that happy place, that where thou art we may be also for evermore.

Prayer used by Fr Bede Jarrett, O.P.

prayer written by William Penn
1644 - 1718

Is this a bid to take over the Sass spot Alan?

ippy

Alan Burns · « **Reply #11921 on:** April 06, 2016, 08:24:16 AM »

Quote from: savillerow on April 05, 2016, 05:18:14 PM

AB Just to add to your concoction, from the previous post you wrote "prepared for his coming" Can you give me a comprehensive overview as to what then might follow. You did not pursue it fully, you just gave me some Bob Dylan lyrics. The WHOLE world would be what? The people in it would be what? Everything "he " says would be ok by you? This approach may lead to brain death wouldnt you think? But you tell me please.

There are dozens of references to the second coming in the bible. Just google "second coming scriptures" to view them.

In essence, everybody will be aware of Jesus in all His glory, and I assume there will be many who will feel guilt and shame when confronted with the truth of God's love. Many will be rejected by Him because they have rejected Him.

"If anyone is ashamed of me and my words in this adulterous and sinful generation, the Son of Man will be ashamed of him when He comes in his Father's glory with the holy angels." (Mark 8:38)

Alan Burns · « **Reply #11922 on:** April 06, 2016, 08:31:26 AM »

Quote from: Floo on April 06, 2016, 08:27:41 AM

What you don't seem to get Alan is that just because something is quoted in the Bible doesn't make it true if there is no verifiable evidence to back it up.

There is plenty of evidence, Floo. It is up to you whether you accept it or reject it.

Stranger · « **Reply #11923 on:** April 06, 2016, 08:32:29 AM »

Quote from: Alan Burns on April 06, 2016, 08:24:16 AM

There are dozens of references to the second coming in the bible. Just google "second coming scriptures" to view them.

In essence, everybody will be aware of Jesus in all His glory, and I assume there will be many who will feel guilt and shame when confronted with the truth of God's love. Many will be rejected by Him because they have rejected Him.

"If anyone is ashamed of me and my words in this adulterous and sinful generation, the Son of Man will be ashamed of him when He comes in his Father's glory with the holy angels." (Mark 8:38)

If your god is hiding from us (which, if it exists, it surely is) and it is then going to reject us for not accepting something without evidence, it is your god who should be ashamed...

Shaker · « **Reply #11924 on:** April 06, 2016, 08:40:56 AM »

Quote from: Alan Burns on April 06, 2016, 08:31:26 AM

There is plenty of evidence, Floo.

No there isn't.

For one thing, assertions about something predicted, something believed to happen in the future at some unspecified point meets nobody's criterion of evidence.

Except yours.

So let me amend that to: it meets no rational person's criterion of evidence.

News:

Author Topic: Searching for GOD... (Read 3883600 times)

Rhiannon