Searching for GOD...

[ippy]

Cognitive scientists neuroscientists..........are, these jobs, vocations or modii vivendi?

Been at the random word generator again Vlad?

ippy

[floo]

Rationality it seems to fly out of the window where some Christians are concerned, which is clear from some of the posts on this extremely long thread.  I wonder how far they would go to oblige their version of god? If, for the sake of argument, they truly believe it was asking them to sacrifice their child, Abraham style, would they go through with it, and if not, why not?

[ippy]

Rationality it seems to fly out of the window where some Christians are concerned, which is clear from some of the posts on this extremely long thread.  I wonder how far they would go to oblige their version of god? If, for the sake of argument, they truly believe it was asking them to sacrifice their child, Abraham style, would they go through with it, and if not, why not?

Some Floo?

ippy

[floo]

Some Floo?

ippy

Some aren't Biblical literalists.

[ippy]

Some aren't Biblical literalists.

Floo, they're all taking on this stuff without a shred of evidence for the magical, mystical and superstitional content. 

ippy

[SwordOfTheSpirit]

And that is where the somewhat smug complacency comes in. I have checked synonyms for 'smug' but complacent is close. You apparentlyy do not attempt to consider any argument impartially; the possibility, or probability, that you are not right  is kept firmly outside the barrier of your belief, it seems to me.

And that is where the somewhat smug complacency comes in. I have checked synonyms for 'smug' but complacent is close. You apparentlyy (sic) do not attempt to consider any argument impartially; the possibility, or probability, that you are not right  is kept firmly outside the barrier of your non-belief, it seems to me.

The Most Honourable Sister of Titular Indecision, who needs to argue against religious belief, not because she has any kind of proof that she is correct, but because some lurker may read the posts of e.g. Alan Burns, Sassy or Vlad and become a religious believer.

The word hypocrite scarcely does it justice.

[Gordon]

And that is where the somewhat smug complacency comes in. I have checked synonyms for 'smug' but complacent is close. You apparentlyy (sic) do not attempt to consider any argument impartially; the possibility, or probability, that you are not right  is kept firmly outside the barrier of your non-belief, it seems to me.

What someone believes and whether or not their belief is justified are two different things: so you need to unpack this.

The Most Honourable Sister of Titular Indecision, who needs to argue against religious belief, not because she has any kind of proof that she is correct, but because some lurker may read the posts of e.g. Alan Burns, Sassy or Vlad and become a religious believer.

The title element relates to previous events here (The 'Church of the Debatable Saints') which was a bit of fun involving a member who is non-active these days, so from before your time. As to the likelihood of posts by those you mention converting readers to theism then, in the words of that great philosopher John McEnroe', 'you can't be serious'.

btw - good to see you posting again.

[Shaker]

As to the likelihood of posts by those you mention converting readers to theism then, in the words of that great philosopher John McEnroe', 'you can't be serious'.

This was/is the stated aim of one formerly fairly prolific but currently quiescent poster, who has not to my knowledge been successful in his mission in any way, shape or form with anyone whatever.

The arrogance of it all is variously funny, exasperating and in the end rather depressing.

[Nearly Sane]

And that is where the somewhat smug complacency comes in. I have checked synonyms for 'smug' but complacent is close. You apparentlyy (sic) do not attempt to consider any argument impartially; the possibility, or probability, that you are not right  is kept firmly outside the barrier of your non-belief, it seems to me.

The Most Honourable Sister of Titular Indecision, who needs to argue against religious belief, not because she has any kind of proof that she is correct, but because some lurker may read the posts of e.g. Alan Burns, Sassy or Vlad and become a religious believer.

The word hypocrite scarcely does it justice.

Oh wow, a 'Christian' wants to mock a typo of someone with restricted sight.

[floo]

And that is where the somewhat smug complacency comes in. I have checked synonyms for 'smug' but complacent is close. You apparentlyy (sic) do not attempt to consider any argument impartially; the possibility, or probability, that you are not right  is kept firmly outside the barrier of your non-belief, it seems to me.

The Most Honourable Sister of Titular Indecision, who needs to argue against religious belief, not because she has any kind of proof that she is correct, but because some lurker may read the posts of e.g. Alan Burns, Sassy or Vlad and become a religious believer.

The word hypocrite scarcely does it justice.

You are an unpleasant little person, obviously your faith does you no credit at all!

[Shaker]

You are an unpleasant little person, obviously your faith does you no credit at all!

Funny, that.

[Alan Burns]

It is not surprising that many people in our increasingly secular world have their natural instinctive awareness of God quashed by media and peer pressure.

On our recent cruising holiday (our first cruise!) we were in Malaga on the feast of Corpus Christi.  We wanted to attend a church service, so I tried to look up service times at the big cathedral in Malaga.  All the internet sights I tried said the cathedral was closed.  The service desk on our cruise ship also said the cathedral was closed that day.  On further interrogation on the internet I found on a Q and A forum that there were five services taking place that day, all open to the public.  Apparently the tourist industry no longer recognise that cathedrals are still used as places of worship!

So we enjoyed attending a packed cathedral celebrating the great feast of Corpus Christi.

[Shaker]

It is not surprising that many people in our increasingly secular world have their natural instinctive awareness of God quashed by media and peer pressure.

Any evidence for these assertions?

[floo]

I don't think there is an instinctive awareness of any god. Many of us have had religious upbringings, for better or for worse. Quite a number, when they get to an age where they can properly question their faith become unbelievers like myself, when it no longer has any credibility.

[torridon]

It is not surprising that many people in our increasingly secular world have their natural instinctive awareness of God quashed by media and peer pressure...

For 'natural instinctive awareness', I would read 'evolved cognitive bias'. Awareness derives from perception, perception derives from sensory information capture, external sensory information would register on suitable inanimate and unbiased detectors.

Glad you enjoyed your holiday, welcome back.

[ippy]

It is not surprising that many people in our increasingly secular world have their natural instinctive awareness of God quashed by media and peer pressure.

On our recent cruising holiday (our first cruise!) we were in Malaga on the feast of Corpus Christi.  We wanted to attend a church service, so I tried to look up service times at the big cathedral in Malaga.  All the internet sights I tried said the cathedral was closed.  The service desk on our cruise ship also said the cathedral was closed that day.  On further interrogation on the internet I found on a Q and A forum that there were five services taking place that day, all open to the public.  Apparently the tourist industry no longer recognise that cathedrals are still used as places of worship!

So we enjoyed attending a packed cathedral celebrating the great feast of Corpus Christi.

The various organisations probably didn't know about the services because religion is going the way of Wotan, Thor and perhaps Zeus, this religion stuff is no longer taken seriously by most of the population of western Europe, it's usually because so few of us are  interested or care, I would have thought that was obvious. 

ippy

[wigginhall]

I don't think anybody minds AB going to his cathedral service, just as I don't mind my local shaman warbling on about sacred animals.   But it's the attempt at universality which sticks in the crop, or wherever things stick.  Thus, the idea of a universal 'natural instinctive awareness of God' is one of AB's untested formulae, which doesn't leave room for those without such an awareness.   I find it claustrophobic.

[Shaker]

I don't think anybody minds AB going to his cathedral service, just as I don't mind my local shaman warbling on about sacred animals.   But it's the attempt at universality which sticks in the crop, or wherever things stick.  Thus, the idea of a universal 'natural instinctive awareness of God' is one of AB's untested formulae, which doesn't leave room for those without such an awareness.   I find it claustrophobic.

He has to assert universality, though, because without claiming them as true-for-everybody his entire worldview and belief system simply becomes his own personal set of opinions, and unevidenced and unsupported opinions at that. And that's not going to win anyone over.

[Rhiannon]

He has to assert universality, though, because without claiming them as true-for-everybody his entire worldview and belief system simply becomes his own personal set of opinions, and unevidenced and unsupported opinions at that. And that's not going to win anyone over.

Well, yes. I'm not sure it's just us that he's trying to convince. If we can't see it maybe it's because there is nothing to be seen. And then what happens?

[floo]

Well, yes. I'm not sure it's just us that he's trying to convince. If we can't see it maybe it's because there is nothing to be seen. And then what happens?

I do wonder if some religious people, who give it large about their faith, are trying to convince themselves as well as others as to its merits.

[Shaker]

Well, yes. I'm not sure it's just us that he's trying to convince. If we can't see it maybe it's because there is nothing to be seen. And then what happens?

For me, nothing.

For him, the demolition and ruination of his entire worldview. No wonder he expends so much energy trying to prop it up.

[Alan Burns]

For me, nothing.

For him, the demolition and ruination of his entire worldview. No wonder he expends so much energy trying to prop it up.

I do not need to prop up the blindingly obvious truth that our conscious self awareness is not an accidental unintended by-product of unguided molecular activity from the debris of an exploded star.  Just trying to share the truth of our God given spiritual nature.

[floo]

I do not need to prop up the blindingly obvious truth that our conscious self awareness is not an accidental unintended by product of unguided molecular activity from the debris of an exploded star.  Just trying to share the truth of our God given spiritual nature.

Alan it isn't a truth, it is only a belief for which there is no verifiable evidence.

[Shaker]

I do not need to prop up the blindingly obvious truth that our conscious self awareness is not an accidental unintended by product of unguided molecular activity from the debris of an exploded star.

Except of course it isn't a "blindingly obvious truth" at all but merely an opinion of yours.

Just trying to share the truth of our God given spiritual nature.

And as the forum's resident ginger stepchild, how's that working out for you, do you think?

[Alan Burns]

Alan it isn't a truth, it is only a belief for which there is no verifiable evidence.

you are the evidence, Floo.