Author Topic: Searching for GOD...  (Read 3874482 times)

floo

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #23200 on: October 25, 2017, 05:39:31 PM »
And is this your belief, or do you have factual evidence to back it up? I wouldn't want you to be a hypocrite!

It is my belief that you cannot back up your assertions with any verifiable evidence.

ippy

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #23201 on: October 27, 2017, 12:39:25 PM »
It is my belief that you cannot back up your assertions with any verifiable evidence.

Have you noticed the absence of A B on this thread Floo d'you think we might have converted him to be a non-religious person, only he certainly has dropped all of his old tosh including the evangelizing?

Regards ippy

Walt Zingmatilder

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #23202 on: October 27, 2017, 01:07:40 PM »
Have you noticed the absence of A B on this thread Floo d'you think we might have converted him to be a non-religious person, only he certainly has dropped all of his old tosh including the evangelizing?

Regards ippy
I think he has been Bored off by you guys.

Shaker

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #23203 on: October 27, 2017, 01:16:38 PM »
I think he has been Bored off by you guys.
I think he's realised he's been wasting his time trying to convert people to unreason.
Pain, or damage, don't end the world. Or despair, or fucking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man, and give some back. - Al Swearengen, Deadwood.

floo

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #23204 on: October 27, 2017, 01:44:07 PM »
Have you noticed the absence of A B on this thread Floo d'you think we might have converted him to be a non-religious person, only he certainly has dropped all of his old tosh including the evangelizing?

Regards ippy

Maybe his version of god has told him he isn't doing a good job of it. ;D

bluehillside Retd.

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #23205 on: October 27, 2017, 01:53:05 PM »
Floo,

Quote
Maybe his version of god has told him he isn't doing a good job of it. ;D

It'd be a strange god I think who wanted to make himself known to his special creation, picked AB as his emissary, then equipped him only with very bad arguments to do the job. Why not instead provide a few argument that aren't obviously false?

As for AB himself, naive optimist that I am I like to think that he's in some way grateful for the advice he's had that flat wrong arguments aren't just "not watertight" as if in some way that means they still have some value, but rather they're just plain wrong. Perhaps the realisation will spur him to look for an argument for his god that isn't hopeless. 
« Last Edit: October 27, 2017, 01:57:46 PM by bluehillside »
"Don't make me come down there."

God

floo

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #23206 on: October 27, 2017, 02:06:02 PM »
Floo,

It'd be a strange god I think who wanted to make himself known to his special creation, picked AB as his emissary, then equipped him only with very bad arguments to do the job. Why not instead provide a few argument that aren't obviously false?

As for AB himself, naive optimist that I am I like to think that he's in some way grateful for the advice he's had that flat wrong arguments aren't just "not watertight" as if in some way that means they still have some value, but rather they're just plain wrong. Perhaps the realisation will spur him to look for an argument for his god that isn't hopeless.

I reckon AB is just waiting to get his second wind; the Welsh Revival of 1904/1905 will have nothing on him!  ;D ;D ;D

SusanDoris

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #23207 on: October 27, 2017, 03:32:37 PM »
AB's arguments are hopeless, but at least he is not smug and supercilious, like a certain other poster who calls in occasionally graciously to bestow upon us what he presumably thinks are his, um, er, profound(?!) thoughts.
The Most Honourable Sister of Titular Indecision.

floo

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #23208 on: October 27, 2017, 03:38:02 PM »
AB's arguments are hopeless, but at least he is not smug and supercilious, like a certain other poster who calls in occasionally graciously to bestow upon us what he presumably thinks are his, um, er, profound(?!) thoughts.

I agree.

Walt Zingmatilder

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #23209 on: October 27, 2017, 03:47:54 PM »
Blimey. Are you guys telepathic?

ippy

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #23210 on: October 27, 2017, 03:51:49 PM »
I think he has been Bored off by you guys.

I'll bet A B has a better understanding of secularism than you have Vlad, oh yes! how silly of me, but then most people have.

Kind regards ippy

Walt Zingmatilder

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #23211 on: October 27, 2017, 03:57:22 PM »
I'll bet A B has a better understanding of secularism than you have Vlad, oh yes! how silly of me, but then most people have.

Kind regards ippy
I have an understanding of more secularisms than many people. For instance some people are ignorant of soviet secularism in the Stalinist era.

bluehillside Retd.

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #23212 on: October 27, 2017, 04:08:32 PM »
Vlad,

Quote
I have an understanding of more secularisms than many people. For instance some people are ignorant of soviet secularism in the Stalinist era.

Oh dear.

Are you aware too of soviet moustache wearing in the Stalinist era?
« Last Edit: October 27, 2017, 04:11:11 PM by bluehillside »
"Don't make me come down there."

God

Walt Zingmatilder

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #23213 on: October 27, 2017, 04:27:31 PM »
Vlad,

Oh dear.

Are you aware too of soviet moustache wearing in the Stalinist era?
Moustache wearing never sanctioned what the soviet secular state did
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/belief/2017/oct/26/why-the-soviet-attempt-to-stamp-out-religion-failed

bluehillside Retd.

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #23214 on: October 27, 2017, 04:31:06 PM »
Vlad,

Quote
Moustache wearing never sanctioned what the soviet secular state did
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/belief/2017/oct/26/why-the-soviet-attempt-to-stamp-out-religion-failed

Nor did secularism, notwithstanding your casual slur of associating the two.
"Don't make me come down there."

God

Walt Zingmatilder

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #23215 on: October 27, 2017, 04:35:32 PM »
Vlad,

Nor did secularism, notwithstanding your casual slur of associating the two.
Unfortunately there are those who want religion out of the public forum.

bluehillside Retd.

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #23216 on: October 27, 2017, 04:40:08 PM »
Vlad,

Quote
Unfortunately there are those who want religion out of the public forum.

What are you trying to say here, and why have you just ignored your mistake about “Soviet secularism”?
"Don't make me come down there."

God

Walt Zingmatilder

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #23217 on: October 27, 2017, 05:05:08 PM »
Vlad,

What are you trying to say here, and why have you just ignored your mistake about “Soviet secularism”?
Ah, The No true secularism line?

bluehillside Retd.

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #23218 on: October 27, 2017, 05:20:04 PM »
Vlad,

Quote
Ah, The No true secularism line?

No, the old "stop placing "secularism" next to whatever unpleasant dogma term takes your fancy to damn by association the former with no connecting logic between them" line.   
"Don't make me come down there."

God

Shaker

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #23219 on: October 27, 2017, 05:34:07 PM »
Unfortunately there are those who want religion out of the public forum.
But exactly who believes this is your closely guarded and dearly cherished secret, eh Vlad  ;)
Pain, or damage, don't end the world. Or despair, or fucking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man, and give some back. - Al Swearengen, Deadwood.

ippy

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #23220 on: October 27, 2017, 07:39:20 PM »
Unfortunately there are those who want religion out of the public forum.

This post of yours Vlad, I can hardly believe it, the sheer magnitude of your ignorance of secular aims.

You've done it again Vlad, you really are clueless, you really need to do a lot of reading and taking in of the things you read about secularism, you're priceless.

Regards ippy

Alan Burns

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #23221 on: October 28, 2017, 01:02:25 PM »
Of all the earthly pleasures which this world has to offer, one thing is absolutely certain – they all come to an end.  But in contrast, there is the unending joy of knowing God’s love – a joy which, once found, will be perceived to transcend even the death of our physical bodies.

The opening post of this thread implies that many of the posters on this forum have no wish to search for and discover the joy of knowing God, but instead seem intent on finding reasons not to believe.  The content of this thread aptly demonstrates the truth of this opening post, showing the intent of posters not just to find fault, but in many cases to ridicule any arguments put forward for the existence of God by trying to equate such belief with magic, leprechauns, pixies etc.

And in denying the evidence for God and the human soul, they also have to deny their own freedom to make conscious choices.  In a Godless, soulless world, every event must have a natural, physical cause which is entirely defined as an unavoidable consequence to all previous events – thus relegating any perception that we have control of our thoughts, words and actions to be an illusion – and everything we do is simply an unavoidable reaction to events.  Yet the very act of trying to deny the evidence for our ability to choose is in itself evidence of our ability to make conscious choices.  As the opening post implies, it is evident that posters are deliberately choosing to find reasons not to believe rather than to search for God.

But once you concede the possibility of consciously driven interaction with this world, it opens up the amazing realization that there is purpose and meaning in everything:

Was light meant to be seen?
Are the differing wavelengths in light meant to be perceived as colour?
Is gravity meant to keep us on the ground?
And is gravity meant to enable the earth to orbit the sun?
Were vegetables and fruit meant to be eaten?
Were beautiful flowers meant to be perceived?
Was the presence of water, oxygen, carbon etc meant to provide the ingredients for life?
Was the enquiring mind of mankind meant to discover the useful properties of such things as electricity, radio waves, metals, silicon, fossil fuels, etc?
And was this enquiring mind also meant to search for and discover God?

Or was it all just an accidental consequence from the lifeless, aimless, Godless, soulless cloud of exploding gas?
The truth will set you free  - John 8:32
Truth is not an abstraction, but a person - Edith Stein
Free will, though it makes evil possible, is also the only thing that makes possible any love or goodness or joy worth having. - CS Lewis
Joy is the Gigantic Secret of Christians - GK Chesterton

Shaker

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #23222 on: October 28, 2017, 01:08:38 PM »
The wrongness - as usual - in your latest dreary rant is beyond my patience to skin, gut and bone in detail, so I'll confine myself to the final sentence:

Quote
Or was it all just an accidental consequence from the lifeless, aimless, Godless, soulless cloud of exploding gas?
Yes.
Pain, or damage, don't end the world. Or despair, or fucking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man, and give some back. - Al Swearengen, Deadwood.

Gordon

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #23223 on: October 28, 2017, 01:38:37 PM »
The opening post of this thread implies that many of the posters on this forum have no wish to search for and discover the joy of knowing God, but instead seem intent on finding reasons not to believe.

Wrong, as usual: the problem is that there are no good reasons to believe in god.

Quote
As the opening post implies, it is evident that posters are deliberately choosing to find reasons not to believe rather than to search for God.

Wrong again: it's simply that some of us aren't credulous enough to fall for the bad reasons to believe in god.

Quote
But once you concede the possibility of consciously driven interaction with this world, it opens up the amazing realization that there is purpose and meaning in everything:

Was light meant to be seen?
Are the differing wavelengths in light meant to be perceived as colour?
Is gravity meant to keep us on the ground?
And is gravity meant to enable the earth to orbit the sun?
Were vegetables and fruit meant to be eaten?
Were beautiful flowers meant to be perceived?
Was the presence of water, oxygen, carbon etc meant to provide the ingredients for life?
Was the enquiring mind of mankind meant to discover the useful properties of such things as electricity, radio waves, metals, silicon, fossil fuels, etc?
And was this enquiring mind also meant to search for and discover God?

I see your problem here, Alan, which involves your repeated and spurious use of the word 'meant'.

Quote
Or was it all just an accidental consequence from the lifeless, aimless, Godless, soulless cloud of exploding gas?

That seems highly likely.

jjohnjil

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Re: Searching for GOD...
« Reply #23224 on: October 28, 2017, 01:40:53 PM »
The wrongness - as usual - in your latest dreary rant is beyond my patience to skin, gut and bone in detail, so I'll confine myself to the final sentence:
Yes.
Hi Shaker

Thanks for making me spray coffee all over my PC !

'May have just seen Michael J. Fox in a flower shop. I can't be 100% sure; he had his back to the fuchsias'.

I almost choked but at least it gave me my first LOL of the day.