Searching for GOD...

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Perhaps you could consider what inspired humanity to build the Hagia Sophia Mosque in Istanbul or the Blue Mosque in Esfahan.  How about the Brihadeeswarar Temple in India.  Take a trip to Thailand and you will be dazzled by the temples.  What inspired neolothic migrants from western Europe to start building stone circles in Orkney  ?  Christian culture has produced fantastic works but don't be indifferent to the fact that so have many other cultures; consider what are the common denominators to all these things.  If you think you can pin it all down to a single carpenter's boy from Palestine you're far from seeing and understanding the bigger picture.

You seem to have missed the usual punchline that all these people have got it wrong and we now know better and that the bigger picture is really the smaller picture.

[Maeght]

You seem to have missed the usual punchline that all these people have got it wrong and we now know better and that the bigger picture is really the smaller picture.

You seem to have missed the point.

[Alan Burns]

Perhaps you could consider what inspired humanity to build the Hagia Sophia Mosque in Istanbul or the Blue Mosque in Esfahan.  How about the Brihadeeswarar Temple in India.  Take a trip to Thailand and you will be dazzled by the temples.  What inspired neolothic migrants from western Europe to start building stone circles in Orkney  ?  Christian culture has produced fantastic works but don't be indifferent to the fact that so have many other cultures; consider what are the common denominators to all these things.  If you think you can pin it all down to a single carpenter's boy from Palestine you're far from seeing and understanding the bigger picture.

You are quoting further evidence of the human awareness that there is more to life than material things.  There are a great many examples of the human need to search for God.  Our aim should be to discern the one which leads to God.

[Maeght]

You are quoting further evidence of the human awareness that there is more to life than material things.  There are a great many examples of the human need to search for God.  Our aim should be to discern the one which leads to God.

Belief, not awareness.

[Alan Burns]

Belief, not awareness.

And can anyone define how such belief in non material things can be generated by the uncontrolled deterministic reactions of material particles?

[Sebastian Toe]

You are quoting further evidence of the human awareness that there is more to life than material things.  There are a great many examples of the human need to search for God.  Our aim should be to discern the one which leads to God.

...and for the people who have searched and definitely found God, just not your God?

[bluehillside Retd.]

AB,

And can anyone define how such belief in non material things can be generated by the uncontrolled deterministic reactions of material particles?

To a significant extent, yes. Even if the answer was "no" though, what do you think that would mean for your conjectures "God", "soul" etc?   

[Stranger]

And can anyone define how such belief in non material things can be generated by the uncontrolled deterministic reactions of material particles?

Yes - evolution of hyperactive agency detection.

 

[floo]

You are quoting further evidence of the human awareness that there is more to life than material things.  There are a great many examples of the human need to search for God.  Our aim should be to discern the one which leads to God.

When I was a believer as a child I searched for god but never found it, so I drew the obvious conclusion.

[Alan Burns]

Yes - evolution of hyperactive agency detection.

 

Your faith in what can be achieved by the crude process of evolution seems to be based on the logic that  -  If God does not exist - then evolution is the only possible explanation
But you still have the problem of explaining how any form of conscious belief can be defined in material terms.

[Sebastian Toe]

Your faith in what can be achieved by the crude process of evolution seems to be based on the logic that  -  If God does not exist - then evolution is the only possible explanation
But you still have the problem of explaining how any form of conacious belief can be defined in material terms.

Who says it is a problem?
Seemingly only you!

[Alan Burns]

When I was a believer as a child I searched for god but never found it, so I drew the obvious conclusion.

And have you not considered the simple possibility that you have not found Him yet?
Please don't just give up.

[Maeght]

And can anyone define how such belief in non material things can be generated by the uncontrolled deterministic reactions of material particles?

Don't try to avoid the point.

[Alan Burns]

Who says it is a problem?
Seemingly only you!

So can you direct me to what you believe to be the material based definition of what comprises and defines the property of conscious belief?

[Walter]

And have you not considered the simple possibility that you have not found Him yet?
Please don't just give up.

but why does the most powerful entity in the universe hide, what's he afraid of?

[SusanDoris]

It remains to be seen whether AB thinks that non-believers can have any kind of spirituality in the first place. Some theists can be intensely proprietorial about the word, which is why it's more likely that you're using the same word but mean different things by it.

Very much agree with Rhiannon and you on this point.

[bluehillside Retd.]

AB,

Your faith in what can be achieved by the crude process of evolution seems to be based on the logic that  -  If God does not exist - then evolution is the only possible explanation
But you still have the problem of explaining how any form of conscious belief can be defined in material terms.

Why are you here? Seriously, why though? You post reply after reply that are full of mistakes, you have the mistakes explained, you ignore the explanations, then you repeat the mistakes. What do you hope to achieve by it?

Look, I’ll show you:

Your faith in what can be achieved…

It’s not “faith” at all – it’s reasoned deduction based on the overwhelming evidence for evolution.

…by the crude process of evolution…

It’s not “crude” at all, and just attaching terms like that is yet another piece of fallacious thinking called the fallacy of judgmental language.

…seems to be based on the logic that  -  If God does not exist - then evolution is the only possible explanation

Of course it isn’t. Evolution is the only meaningful explanation because it’s the only one we have that’s supported by evidence. Any personal beliefs you may happen to have in something you call “God” is entirely irrelevant for that purpose because, absent any evidence at all for it, it has no explanatory value whatever. 

But you still have the problem of explaining how any form of conscious belief can be defined in material terms.

No he hasn’t. First it’s only a “problem” in the sense that more work is needed to complete the already heavily populated, evidence-based explanation we do have.

Second, even if that wasn’t true all you’d have would be a “don’t know”. “Don’t know” is no more helpful to the (entirely definition and evidence-free) conjecture “God” than it is for the conjecture “leprechauns”.

I can’t stop you continually crashing and burning like this, but do you not think it might do you a favour if you at least understood the problems you’re giving yourself and actually tried to address them?   

[Walter]

Very much agree with Rhiannon and you on this point.

me also

[Sebastian Toe]

So can you direct me to what you believe to be the material based definition of what comprises and defines the property of conscious belief?

I havent got a problem. You seemingly have.

[Sebastian Toe]

  Our aim should be to discern the one which leads to God.

...and for the people who have searched and definitely found a lead to God, just not your God?

[floo]

Your faith in what can be achieved by the crude process of evolution seems to be based on the logic that  -  If God does not exist - then evolution is the only possible explanation
But you still have the problem of explaining how any form of conscious belief can be defined in material terms.

I agree evolution is the only possible explanation.

[torridon]

You are quoting further evidence of the human awareness that there is more to life than material things.  There are a great many examples of the human need to search for God.  Our aim should be to discern the one which leads to God.

Of course we yearn for happiness, we would all love to have a heavenly father that will not die and leave us to cope alone, we all seek to ponder the mysteries of life, we all want to not die; these yearnings are pretty much all human universals.  Because we have a yearning for them, and because we express those yearnings through art and architecture and religion says nothing about about any transcendental truth beyond our existence.

[floo]

Of course we yearn for happiness, we would all love to have a heavenly father that will not die and leave us to cope alone, we all seek to ponder the mysteries of life, we all want to not die; these yearnings are pretty much all human universals.  Because we have a yearning for them, and because we express those yearnings through art and architecture and religion says nothing about about any transcendental truth beyond out existence.

Speak for yourself.

[Stranger]

So can you direct me to what you believe to be the material based definition of what comprises and defines the property of conscious belief?

Can you provide any "definition of what comprises and defines the property of conscious belief"?

Seriously Alan, after all the previous discussion, are you still peddling the blatant lie that it's being 'material' that makes understanding conciousness difficult? Doesn't your god have something to say about 'bearing false witness'?

[Nearly Sane]

I agree evolution is the only possible explanation.

Just to note this is a classic argument from ignorance.