Searching for GOD...

[Stranger]

Gordon, it is time to come out from behind your fallacy detector and face up to these simple truths:

Except they aren't simple truths at all...

If the resurrection did not happen, Christianity would have died on the cross with Jesus.

Baseless assertion.

Your choices are not inevitable reactions.

Another baseless assertion that would, if true, inevitably lead us to conclude that our choices involve randomness, which you also deny. Until you address this contradiction (gibberish about "the present" doesn't count), any claim to logic is laughable.

Realistically, my choices are mine to make.

Still no hint as to why that is incompatible with them being inevitable.

Still waiting for the logic you said you had, Alan - or the basic honesty needed to admit you have none.

[Sebastian Toe]

Gordon, it is time to come out from behind your fallacy detector and face up to these simple truths:
If the resurrection did not happen, Christianity would have died on the cross with Jesus.
Your choices are not inevitable reactions.
You have the power to choose your own destiny, by accepting Jesus as your Lord and Saviour.

Alan, it is time for you to face reality.
If Mohammed did not actually recieve his revelation from an angel, Islam would have dissapeared in the desert like a spilled cup of water in the sand.

You have the power to determine your own destiny by accepting that Islam is the one true faith.

[Roses]

Alan, it is time for you to face reality.
If Mohammed did not actually recieve his revelation from an angel, Islam would have dissapeared in the desert like a spilled cup of water in the sand.

You have the power to determine your own destiny by accepting that Islam is the one true faith.

Nice one.

[Alan Burns]

If Mohammed did not actually recieve his revelation from an angel, Islam would have dissapeared in the desert like a spilled cup of water in the sand.

Mohammed used military power to establish Islam.
Jesus used the resurrection.

[Walter]

Mohammed used military power to establish Islam.
Jesus used the resurrection.

so one is fake news and the other a lie ?

[Gordon]

Mohammed used military power to establish Islam.

So did Christians, in relation to Christianity.

Jesus used the resurrection.

Alleged resurrection, Alan, and by virtue of being dead, it would be his followers and not Jesus who exploited this aspect of the story.

[Sebastian Toe]

Mohammed used military power to establish Islam.
Jesus used the resurrection.

That  wasn't your arguement.

[Alan Burns]

So did Christians, in relation to Christianity.

Not in the establishment of the early church.

The core values of Christianity are about love and forgiveness, which contrast sharply with the message of "kill the infidels" given in the latter part of the Koran.  These peaceful, non violent, virtues were at the heart of the establishment of the early Christian church in the face of dreadful persecution from Rome and the Jewish hierarchy.  The first disciples were empowered by their personal witness of the Risen Jesus giving them the strength and courage to spread the Good News in the face of such hostility.

So as we celebrate the Risen Jesus this day, may we return back to these core Christian values as given to us by Jesus and the first disciples and begin a new life of hope and trust that we can all come through these troubled times in anticipation of the eternal joy which Jesus offers to all of us - earned through His suffering, death and resurrection.

[Nearly Sane]

“Do not think that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I have not come to bring peace, but a sword.

[Alan Burns]

“Do not think that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I have not come to bring peace, but a sword.

https://www.crosswalk.com/faith/bible-study/what-is-the-sword-of-the-spirit-and-how-should-i-use-it.html

[Nearly Sane]

https://www.crosswalk.com/faith/bible-study/what-is-the-sword-of-the-spirit-and-how-should-i-use-it.html

Post hoc evasion.

[Gordon]

Not in the establishment of the early church.

The core values of Christianity are about love and forgiveness, which contrast sharply with the message of "kill the infidels" given in the latter part of the Koran.  These peaceful, non violent, virtues were at the heart of the establishment of the early Christian church in the face of dreadful persecution from Rome and the Jewish hierarchy.  The first disciples were empowered by their personal witness of the Risen Jesus giving them the strength and courage to spread the Good News in the face of such hostility.

Well that's o.k. then: we'll just forget about all the various religious wars and social effects of organised Christianity over the centuries since then.

So as we celebrate the Risen Jesus this day, may we return back to these core Christian values as given to us by Jesus and the first disciples and begin a new life of hope and trust that we can all come through these troubled times in anticipation of the eternal joy which Jesus offers to all of us - earned through His suffering, death and resurrection.

No thanks.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Well that's o.k. then: we'll just forget about all the various religious wars and social effects of organised Christianity over the centuries since then.

No thanks.

What about Stalin, Gordon and Pol Pot?

[Gordon]

What about Stalin, Gordon and Pol Pot?

Can't speak for the other two of this dastardly trio - but I declare myself innocent of all charges, M'lud.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Can't speak for the other two of this dastardly trio - but I declare myself innocent of all charges, M'lud.

OK but don't let me catch you again.

[ippy]

so one is fake news and the other a lie ?

Alan, I was wondering? Is it that you haven't quiet managed to get your head around the full meaning of 'assertion' and what it amounts to yet?

Commiserations to you Alan, ippy.

[Alan Burns]

Alan, I was wondering? Is it that you haven't quiet managed to get your head around the full meaning of 'assertion' and what it amounts to yet?

from the dictionary:
assertion

noun
noun: assertion; plural noun: assertions

    a confident and forceful statement of fact or belief.

[Stranger]

from the dictionary:

Well done - I do hope you looked up "choice", "freedom", and "deterministic" while you were there.

noun: assertion; plural noun: assertions

    a confident and forceful statement of fact or belief.

Indeed - so it doesn't constitute an argument or logic. In your case, you are given to confident and forceful statements of your blind faith.

[Alan Burns]

Well done - I do hope you looked up "choice", "freedom", and "deterministic" while you were there.

Indeed - so it doesn't constitute an argument or logic. In your case, you are given to confident and forceful statements of your blind faith.

I have given many reasons for my so called "assertions", such as the conscious freedom aptly demonstrated by you and others in thinking up your own reasons to contradict the reasons I give.

[Stranger]

I have given many reasons for my so called "assertions", such as the conscious freedom aptly demonstrated by you and others in thinking up your own reasons to contradict the reasons I give.

Which is just a statement of your blind faith. You have given no reason whatsoever for why that kind of "freedom" needs to be your impossible, contradictory version in which we could have done differently without randomness.

Not even the first hint of a smidgen of an iota of a suggestion of a reason - let alone the "sound logic" you said you had.

Isn't it about time you gave some of this logic or admitted you have none?

[Enki]

I have given many reasons for my so called "assertions", such as the conscious freedom aptly demonstrated by you and others in thinking up your own reasons to contradict the reasons I give.

None of which counts as any sort of evidence or logic to back up your assertions, Alan, so assertions they remain. Glad to see you have taken the trouble to check the dictionary definition, though. Well done, you.

[Alan Burns]

Which is just a statement of your blind faith. You have given no reason whatsoever for why that kind of "freedom" needs to be your impossible, contradictory version in which we could have done differently without randomness.

Not even the first hint of a smidgen of an iota of a suggestion of a reason - let alone the "sound logic" you said you had.

Isn't it about time you gave some of this logic or admitted you have none?

Demonstrating yet more evidence of your freedom to consciously choose words to justify what you believe.
Just as I have the freedom to choose words to justify what I believe.

But the words you choose to use offer a meaning which reduces your conscious freedom to be just an unavoidable reaction.
Can you not see the obvious contradiction here?

[Stranger]

Can you not see the obvious contradiction here?

Have you actually provided any new reasoning or logic since the last time you asked this stupid question? Or the time before that, or the time before that?

No.

So no, I can't see any contradiction whatsoever. Just saying "obvious contradiction" doesn't make it obvious or contradictory, you actually have to point out where the contradiction is. On the other hand, I can see the contradictions in your version of "freedom", and I and others have pointed them out to you many times, and you have still not addressed them (gibberish aside).

Where is your logic? Why won't you have the basic honesty to stop pretending that you have any?

[Alan Burns]

Well that's o.k. then: we'll just forget about all the various religious wars and social effects of organised Christianity over the centuries since then.

Yes, there is plenty of evidence that the aspirations of the early Christian church have been corrupted from the inside by those seeking personal power and wealth instead of seeking the kingdom of God and His righteousness.   It is fortunate that the core values are still there in the scriptures for all to aspire to.  We all have freedom to seek and find God in our lives.

[Alan Burns]

Have you actually provided any new reasoning or logic since the last time you asked this stupid question? Or the time before that, or the time before that?

No.

So no, I can't see any contradiction whatsoever. Just saying "obvious contradiction" doesn't make it obvious or contradictory, you actually have to point out where the contradiction is. On the other hand, I can see the contradictions in your version of "freedom", and I and others have pointed them out to you many times, and you have still not addressed them (gibberish aside).

Where is your logic? Why won't you have the basic honesty to stop pretending that you have any?

The concept of logic would not exist if we did not have the conscious freedom needed to discern it.