Football 2015/16

[Andy]

To be honest, I think Bale has a few years yet before he can be considered to be in the Beckham/Scholes/Gazza bracket. They're more a benchmark for him than the other way around.

I'd rate Bale over all of those apart from Gazza. There are mega stars Maradona, Pele, Ronaldo, Messi, Best, then another class of footballer that Beckham / Scholes belong, current generation Aguero, Suarez, Silva, Bale etc.

I think you add Bale to Chelsea, Man City, Arsenal or Man Utd and that team wins the League.

Gazza was somewhere in the middle.

I'd um and ah over Beckham, but not Scholes. Not a chance.

[ProfessorDavey]

Trivia question.

There is currently just one Scot in the squads of the top seven teams from the 2014/15 premier league season. Anyone like to name him?

And by the way once you get it, you may well go ... who?!?

And a couple of other trivia points. He wasn't born in Scotland, has been on this clubs books for nearly 10 years and his number of appearances is ... umm ... zero.

Jordan Archer?

Nope not in the Tottenham squad any more as he is now at Millwall. But right position.

Just to clarify I'm talking about the current squads (i.e. August 2015) for the top 7 teams from last season (Chelsea, Man C, Man U, Arsenal, Liverpool, Tottenham and Southampton).

[Rhiannon]

To be honest, I think Bale has a few years yet before he can be considered to be in the Beckham/Scholes/Gazza bracket. They're more a benchmark for him than the other way around.

I'd rate Bale over all of those apart from Gazza. There are mega stars Maradona, Pele, Ronaldo, Messi, Best, then another class of footballer that Beckham / Scholes belong, current generation Aguero, Suarez, Silva, Bale etc.

I think you add Bale to Chelsea, Man City, Arsenal or Man Utd and that team wins the League.

Gazza was somewhere in the middle.

I'd um and ah over Beckham, but not Scholes. Not a chance.

Yeah, I thought of Scholes last night when I posted. I was never sure how much around Beckham was hype, but what always impresses me is that he wasn't that great a player, but through practice and dedication he turned himself into one. That's not a bad example to set.

I saw Gazza say something recently about how he'd do something on the pitch but have to watch it back on TV to work out exactly what it was - it all came so naturally to him.

[Andy]

There's no doubting Beckham was a great player. Sure, there was the media limelight, which I think took the microscope away from seeing how good a player he actually was. In '99 he was a revelation (but then most of the United squad was). How Ginola got Premiership player of the year over him is beyond me. He only came second to Rivaldo for world player of the year too. Perhaps that was his peak though, but I always thought he was one of those rare players who was pretty much always consistent... in a good way of course.

[ProfessorDavey]

To be honest, I think Bale has a few years yet before he can be considered to be in the Beckham/Scholes/Gazza bracket. They're more a benchmark for him than the other way around.

I'd rate Bale over all of those apart from Gazza. There are mega stars Maradona, Pele, Ronaldo, Messi, Best, then another class of footballer that Beckham / Scholes belong, current generation Aguero, Suarez, Silva, Bale etc.

I think you add Bale to Chelsea, Man City, Arsenal or Man Utd and that team wins the League.

Gazza was somewhere in the middle.

I'd um and ah over Beckham, but not Scholes. Not a chance.

Yeah, I thought of Scholes last night when I posted. I was never sure how much around Beckham was hype, but what always impresses me is that he wasn't that great a player, but through practice and dedication he turned himself into one. That's not a bad example to set.

I saw Gazza say something recently about how he'd do something on the pitch but have to watch it back on TV to work out exactly what it was - it all came so naturally to him.

I think one of the difficulties with Scholes and also Giggs, is that being 'one club' players it is a bit difficult to separate the quality of the individual from the success of the club. So to my mind it is a bit tricky to work out whether they were really exceptional players or very good players playing in a really exceptional team. I'm more inclined toward the former for Giggs (who I think would have been a star at Real Madrid or Barcelona etc had be been inclined to move) and the latter for Scholes.

[jakswan]

These discussions although largely moot I enjoy a lot. I suppose if we define:-

1) World class - a player that would have got into a world XI at some point in his career
2) Legendary - a player that would have got into any team of (1) team in history

Then I can't think of better wingers in the world than Ronaldo & Bale, maybe Hazard, Di Maria, Robben, Ribery?

[Rhiannon]

I don't think we have any English players now who'd make it into a World X1 - or even a squad.

[jeremyp]

I do wonder about the thinking within Scottish football that led them to agree to Rangers getting all but thrown out,

There's a rule about bankrupt football clubs that they had to apply. 

which resulted in a product that nobody wants to watch. So the rights go for peanuts, the sport becomes ever more impoverished, the quality nosedives, nobody watches it, the rights go for even less...

That situation already applied.  Only Rangers and Celtic had the necessary resources to provide a quality product, but then it turned out that even Rangers didn't have the resources.

[Rhiannon]

I do wonder about the thinking within Scottish football that led them to agree to Rangers getting all but thrown out,

There's a rule about bankrupt football clubs that they had to apply. 

which resulted in a product that nobody wants to watch. So the rights go for peanuts, the sport becomes ever more impoverished, the quality nosedives, nobody watches it, the rights go for even less...

That situation already applied.  Only Rangers and Celtic had the necessary resources to provide a quality product, but then it turned out that even Rangers didn't have the resources.

But the clubs had a vote. They could have voted for them to stay. The TV rights were sold on getting Celtic v Rangers several times a year - and let's face it, quality is only one reason people tuned in to that one. Take that out and there was nothing to bother watching.

[Outrider]

I don't think we have any English players now who'd make it into a World X1 - or even a squad.

I'd agree, but I'd also recall that Greece won the European Championship from a similar situation... not a prediction, by any means, but always worth remembering.

O.

[ProfessorDavey]

I don't think we have any English players now who'd make it into a World X1 - or even a squad.

I'd agree, but I'd also recall that Greece won the European Championship from a similar situation... not a prediction, by any means, but always worth remembering.

O.

Probably true, although given the number of countries and players, I think there are plenty of countries (even the most highly ranked) who wouldn't provide a player in a world XI.

Interestingly, and perhaps not surprisingly, no English player has even won the FIFA player of the year since its inception in 1991 - there have been a couple of runners up spots for Beckham (twice) and Lampard, and 3rd places for Linekar and Shearer back in the early days.

But perhaps more surprisingly no Spanish payer has won it either, with their best being just 3 third places.

[ProfessorDavey]

Trivia question.

There is currently just one Scot in the squads of the top seven teams from the 2014/15 premier league season. Anyone like to name him?

And by the way once you get it, you may well go ... who?!?

And a couple of other trivia points. He wasn't born in Scotland, has been on this clubs books for nearly 10 years and his number of appearances is ... umm ... zero.

Jordan Archer?

Nope not in the Tottenham squad any more as he is now at Millwall. But right position.

Just to clarify I'm talking about the current squads (i.e. August 2015) for the top 7 teams from last season (Chelsea, Man C, Man U, Arsenal, Liverpool, Tottenham and Southampton).

OK - no-one seems to be biting on this one.

The answer is ... drum roll ...

Ryan Fulton - yup I said you'd go 'who'!?!

He is the Liverpool's third choice keeper (not even on the bench for Sunday's opening game of the season). Very young (19 I think), has been in the set up since the age of about 10 and has yet to play a first team game. Born in Burnley but presumably qualifies as Scottish through parents.

[BashfulAnthony]

I'm bored stiff with the Premier League already  -  same old, same old.

[jeremyp]

I'm bored stiff with the Premier League already  -  same old, same old.

Well you're unlikely to find anything of interest on this then.  Try going away.

[BashfulAnthony]

I'm bored stiff with the Premier League already  -  same old, same old.

Well you're unlikely to find anything of interest on this then.  Try going away.

I'd decided that without your advice, thank you.

[jeremyp]

Well you're unlikely to find anything of interest on this then.  Try going away.

I'd decided that without your advice, thank you.

But you're still here.

[jeremyp]

Mourinho has done it again.  He has claimed the result against Man City was a fake result.  Was it?  (I only saw the highlights on MotD2).  Was Alan Shearer correct when he said "yes it was a fake result, it could have been five or six nil to Man City"?

[Rhiannon]

Shearer's on the money. You could argue that Fernandinho could have been sent off but even that wasn't conclusive.

[wigginhall]

I only saw the highlights, but wow, City looked like an express train smashing through these flimsy straw bales on the track, that is, the Chelsea defence.   I wondered what that was about with Costa and Fernandinho, he absolutely clattered him.   Well, Costa puts it about somewhat, maybe payback.   

I'm curious how Chelsea will regroup, probably buy some more players.   City are certainly laying down a marker, but it's early doors as Big Ron used to say. 

[Rhiannon]

There's an argument doing the rounds that by subbing Terry Mourinho was sending a message that he wants more defenders, and soon.

Kompany looked like a machine. Word is that the City men have spent the summer getting ripped in the gym.

[wigginhall]

Yeah, they looked like The Beast.  Oh shit, when's the Manchester derby, we're gonna get creamed.  Rooney looks like an old man already.

[jeremyp]

I just found out that West Ham are going to appeal the red card awarded to their goal keeper on Saturday.  Surely, this is a futile cause?  Photo here:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3199231/West-Ham-1-2-Leicester-City-Shinji-Okazaki-Riyad-Mahrez-strikes-secure-victory-Foxes-Upton-Park-Adrian-sees-red-dying-moments.html

If you don't know which one it is, it's the one where the goal keeper has his studs firmly planted in the chest of the Leicester City player.

[Rhiannon]

Do clubs face any sanctions for appealing? If not then I think appeals are made on the basis that there isn't much to lose.

I despair of being a WHU fan. Heroes one week, muppets the next.

[jeremyp]

Do clubs face any sanctions for appealing? If not then I think appeals are made on the basis that there isn't much to lose.

There might be a danger that the FA thinks the incident is worse than a simple red card and make the ban longer.  To me it looked like a totally reckless challenge that put the other player in danger of serious injury.

[Nearly Sane]

Of course I get what you are saying, Vlad, I am waiting for you to catch up. Once you have gone down the route of that, you then usually just go my experience is true because it feels so. At that stage the difference between something that exists and not experiencing it dissolves. You are left that the experience or non experience is the guide to truth which leads to contradiction. It is the lack of method and relativism that you use that burns away the difference between experience and non experience.