Extended Sunday opening hours

[Shaker]

Nearly 12:15 on a Sunday - no sign of being forced to shop as yet - have till 16:00 though - wish me luck - Shaker out.

[jeremyp]

Dear Rhiannon,

A rethink, yes that is exactly what I am arguing for, less artics on the road, less food wastage, consumer and supermarket, less working hours, more time with family.

Gonnagle.

Sunday opening reduces food wastage. 

[ProfessorDavey]

Dear Prof,

Oh! I'am a fundie now, wonder if TW has a badge, anyway I am willing to concede that the argument regarding is it good for the economy and will it affect small business, then yes it seems that it will not have a detrimental effect.

I think you are Scottish based, so another Scottish poster who already benefits from extended opening hours on Sunday accepting it doesn't have a detrimental effect on small businesses.

But is it good for the country, good for the planet, is it morally good, then no, unless you have a convincing argument to persuade me otherwise.

Gonnagle.

So as a Scottish poster, where extended opening hours are already permitted I assume you want to see that reversed in Scotland to restrict opening hours on Sundays to 6 hours for large shops (as in E&W) or perhaps even further. Do you really want to see this restriction applied. Do you currently see your own county's moral position hampered by your current opening hours on a Sunday?

[ProfessorDavey]

I think for most people in Scotland the notion that larger shops can only open from 10-4 or 11-5 seems very odd and anachronistic. They are used to much a more civilised approach on Sundays and I'm sure end up rather bemused when south of the border when they try to pop into Tesco's at 9am or Homebase at 4pm and find them shut.

I just spent the last two weeks in Cornwall and I had to remember on both Sundays that the main supermarkets were on restricted hours if we wanted to use them.

Back home last evening, so went to Tesco at 8am this morning to get some essentials since the grandkids are here all day (their parents both working), and Mrs G will get the rest of what we need later this evening after they have gone - probably around 7pm-ish - and since the grandkids are often here over weekends she often shops on a Sunday evening this isn't unusual.

I can't see why some in E & W would see our shopping plans for today as being akin to the end of civilisation as we know it since it is just uneventful routine here; but is an option we have that is legally denied to you guys south of the border.

Exactly.

So the longer opening hours allows you to ensure that the need for shopping is minimally intrusive on you family life. Why is this so hard to understand for some other posters. Effectively that longer opening hours on a Sunday means it is easier to fit the need for shopping around the desire to enjoy life (including family life) rather than requiring family life and other pleasures to be fitted around the short shop opening hours.

[Rhiannon]

Generally, Gonners, a supermarket is a place to buy food. My local Tesco does a limited range of magazines and books and some stationery and cooking utensils, and adults' socks. Otherwise, food. It enables me to have more family time, not less, because I can get everything I need with the help of my kids in one hit rather than spending most of a day going to various shops across two towns (the reality of rural living us I couldn't begin to get everything in one place) and at much greater expense. I wish I could produce more food myself but at the moment I can't.

Once I have the food we need I set about creating memories, whether it is what my kids describe as 'awesome' picnics in the grounds of our local stately home, afternoon tea in the garden or dinner around the table. It's not 'stuff', but meals I can create with love for my children. Sharing food with people you love is something that makes life so much richer, no?

What you are arguing for is this.

http://stuffocation.org

I agree. But not being able to buy salad and bread at 8 am on a Sunday won't make a great deal of difference either way.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Nearly 12:15 on a Sunday - no sign of being forced to shop as yet - have till 16:00 though - wish me luck - Shaker out.

Consumerism is not your vice. Posting antitheist cobblers is.

[ProfessorDavey]

So the answer to getting less consumerism is........ a bit more consumerism.
That's like giving an alcoholic a hair of the dog or one for the road.

See Gordon's recent post.

Extended opening hours isn't increasing consumerism at all, but is allowing him to enjoy his family life rather more easily knowing he and his missus can pop into the supermarket first thing or last thing during the day on Sunday thus not interfering with the enjoyment of the visit from grandchildren.

[Rhiannon]

Dear Rhiannon,

A rethink, yes that is exactly what I am arguing for, less artics on the road, less food wastage, consumer and supermarket, less working hours, more time with family.

Gonnagle.

Sunday opening reduces food wastage.

Agreed.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Dear Rhiannon,

A rethink, yes that is exactly what I am arguing for, less artics on the road, less food wastage, consumer and supermarket, less working hours, more time with family.

Gonnagle.

Sunday opening reduces food wastage.

I think you will find that in the early fifties when only the papershop was allowed open on sunday AM that food wastage was minimal.

[jeremyp]

Nearly 12:15 on a Sunday - no sign of being forced to shop as yet - have till 16:00 though - wish me luck - Shaker out.

Consumerism is not your vice. Posting antitheist cobblers is.

Why is it anti-theist to go shopping on a Sunday?  Your own holy book tells you that Saturday is the one that is a no-no for shopping.

[jeremyp]

I think you will find that in the early fifties when only the papershop was allowed open on sunday AM that food wastage was minimal.

And you don't think rationing had anything to do with that?

[Walt Zingmatilder]

I think you will find that in the early fifties when only the papershop was allowed open on sunday AM that food wastage was minimal.

And you don't think rationing had anything to do with that?

So you agree that food wastage is linked to having plenty and more sunday trading means greater plenitude.

[Rhiannon]

Dear Prof,

Oh! I'am a fundie now, wonder if TW has a badge, anyway I am willing to concede that the argument regarding is it good for the economy and will it affect small business, then yes it seems that it will not have a detrimental effect.

But is it good for the country, good for the planet, is it morally good, then no, unless you have a convincing argument to persuade me otherwise.

Gonnagle.

What you are arguing for is a rethink about consumerism full stop. Extending Sunday trading in England and Wales doesn't particularly impact that.

So the answer to getting less consumerism is........ a bit more consumerism.
That's like giving an alcoholic a hair of the dog or one for the road.

If you want to argue that allowing Westgate and Bluewater to open longer encourages consumerism, I'll listen. But this conversation has focussed on the need to protect small shops (which are very often stuffed with pointless manufactured crap) against supermarkets, which generally sell food. There are all kinds of problems that supermarkets could do with addressing, but that doesn't make them temples of rampant consumerism, just places to buy stuff to eat.

[Gonnagle]

Dear Prof,

My position as a Scot, Glaswegian, Brit, I want the weekend for family, community, leisure, I want one day where the world stops.

One day with no cars on the road, one day of silence.

Gonnagle.

[ProfessorDavey]

Dear Prof,

My position as a Scot, Glaswegian, Brit, I want the weekend for family, community, leisure, I want one day where the world stops.

One day with no cars on the road, one day of silence.

Gonnagle.

So do you support bringing in restrictions to shop opening hours in Scotland to align with E&W or even to go further than that, for example banning opening entirely.

[Gonnagle]

Dear Rhiannon,

I am not against supermarkets, I am against 24/7 shopping.

Gonnagle.

[Rhiannon]

Dear Prof,

My position as a Scot, Glaswegian, Brit, I want the weekend for family, community, leisure, I want one day where the world stops.

One day with no cars on the road, one day of silence.

Gonnagle.

So no Sunday pub lunch, no footie or cricket, no trips to pretty gardens or chips at the seaside? No family museum events, heritage weekends, Sunday afternoon concerts in the park, weekend-long festivals?

[ProfessorDavey]

One day with no cars on the road, one day of silence.

Go live in the western isles then seeing as your desire is to an extent what the wee frees would like.

But just to check there isn't a wee touch of double standards here, I assume you would extend that to people who need to drive to get to church - that shouldn't happen too in your 'no cars on the road' wish.

[Gonnagle]

Dear Prof,

I might be a Glaswegian but I do practice the Queens English, the answer to your question, YES!!

Gonnagle.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Dear Prof,

Oh! I'am a fundie now, wonder if TW has a badge, anyway I am willing to concede that the argument regarding is it good for the economy and will it affect small business, then yes it seems that it will not have a detrimental effect.

But is it good for the country, good for the planet, is it morally good, then no, unless you have a convincing argument to persuade me otherwise.

Gonnagle.

What you are arguing for is a rethink about consumerism full stop. Extending Sunday trading in England and Wales doesn't particularly impact that.

So the answer to getting less consumerism is........ a bit more consumerism.
That's like giving an alcoholic a hair of the dog or one for the road.

If you want to argue that allowing Westgate and Bluewater to open longer encourages consumerism, I'll listen. But this conversation has focussed on the need to protect small shops (which are very often stuffed with pointless manufactured crap) against supermarkets, which generally sell food. There are all kinds of problems that supermarkets could do with addressing, but that doesn't make them temples of rampant consumerism, just places to buy stuff to eat.

No several supermarkets retail electrical goods, hardware, clothing in fact anything they would sell during the week.

[Rhiannon]

Dear Rhiannon,

I am not against supermarkets, I am against 24/7 shopping.

Gonnagle.

What do you think the internet enables? 24/7 shopping's already well established. I can buy as much over-manufactured, planet-destroying tat that I want whenever I want, any day of the year, and get it flown in from anywhere in the world and delivered to my door. The one thing I can't get is decent fresh food early on a Sunday morning.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

One of the tenets of consumerism is that the human being is inadequate and in need of material acquisition.
That is a homoncularisation. 24/7 society with 24/7 people means no reflection on it all. Basically reflection or even time to be is the enemy of those who wish to turn us into a ''herd''. The process is neotenisation where we are juvenilised.

[Rhiannon]

Dear Prof,

Oh! I'am a fundie now, wonder if TW has a badge, anyway I am willing to concede that the argument regarding is it good for the economy and will it affect small business, then yes it seems that it will not have a detrimental effect.

But is it good for the country, good for the planet, is it morally good, then no, unless you have a convincing argument to persuade me otherwise.

Gonnagle.

What you are arguing for is a rethink about consumerism full stop. Extending Sunday trading in England and Wales doesn't particularly impact that.

So the answer to getting less consumerism is........ a bit more consumerism.
That's like giving an alcoholic a hair of the dog or one for the road.

If you want to argue that allowing Westgate and Bluewater to open longer encourages consumerism, I'll listen. But this conversation has focussed on the need to protect small shops (which are very often stuffed with pointless manufactured crap) against supermarkets, which generally sell food. There are all kinds of problems that supermarkets could do with addressing, but that doesn't make them temples of rampant consumerism, just places to buy stuff to eat.

No several supermarkets retail electrical goods, hardware, clothing in fact anything they would sell during the week.

Not all supermarkets do. See my post above. They are not shopping destinations in the same way that the big malls are and the current practice is indicating that the gigantic superstores are a thing of the past as they increasingly need to sub-let space to other retailers or for other uses (eg gym, medical centres etc)

[Gonnagle]

Dear Vlad,

I Love your big words, but yes a time for reflection.

Dear Rhiannon,

Fresh produce!! Do you hear yourself!! I know that you are not stupid and you know what it entails to put that fresh produce on your table.

Gonnagle.

[Gordon]

No several supermarkets retail electrical goods, hardware, clothing in fact anything they would sell during the week.

Good - that is the point of having no ST restrictions: when Mrs G goes to Tesco at 7ish this evening one item on the list is a pair of 'in-ear' headphones.

Why should I be restricted to what I buy on Sunday evenings (apart from alcohol after 10pm) - wait a minute: I'm not, but you are Vlad.