Satan statue

[Owlswing]

Reply to message #92

And this all in the name of the "loving" God of the Christians and his "loving" son.

Gives a whole different interpretation to "Suffer the little children" doesn't it?

Where, I wonder is the evidence of the rejection of and steps to stop and prevent these barbaric practices from the worldwide Christian church and its members!

[Owlswing]

If a deity looks ugly and harsh.... but the group encourages inclusiveness, selflessness, humility, tolerance, peace and nonviolence...then the deity is godly.

I suppose it depends on what is included within inclusiveness.

By the way, Sriram, from what I have read of world belief systems, Christianity is the only one that was for the whole of humanity from its very inception.

And it so very kindly tried to FORCE itself on everybody whether they liked it or not.
Just wanting to save their poor damned souls, eh?

Love it! A precise and concise statement of the problem with Christianity - my way, oh sorry - My Way or the highway (to Hell)!

[Rhiannon]

Regardless of how a deity looks...I think the morals and behaviour patterns encouraged by the group is more important IMO.

If the deity looks nice, gentle and handsome...but if the group encourages divisiveness, pride, selfishness, condemnation of others, violence and so on...then the deity is demonic.

If a deity looks ugly and harsh.... but the group encourages inclusiveness, selflessness, humility, tolerance, peace and nonviolence...then the deity is godly.

This is a very good point. It doesn't matter at all what an image looks like, or what title a deity has come to that, but what it inspires in its followers. Think what actions have been carried out in the name of the Prince of Peace.

[Owlswing]

Regardless of how a deity looks...I think the morals and behaviour patterns encouraged by the group is more important IMO.

If the deity looks nice, gentle and handsome...but if the group encourages divisiveness, pride, selfishness, condemnation of others, violence and so on...then the deity is demonic.

If a deity looks ugly and harsh.... but the group encourages inclusiveness, selflessness, humility, tolerance, peace and nonviolence...then the deity is godly.

This is a very good point. It doesn't matter at all what an image looks like, or what title a deity has come to that, but what it inspires in its followers. Think what actions have been carried out in the name of the Prince of Peace.

Let's face it, Lady Rhi, some of the Egyptian deities were hardly paragons of beauty were they? The Roman ones were mostly human shaped though.

[Andy]

A-theism
Against theism ie god(s)

Its about belief.

Atheism is a LACK of belief NOT a belief!

It varies, doesn't it? For some it is an absence of belief, but for others it is a specific declaration that gods do not exist.

No, it doesn't vary. All have an absence of belief in gods, just not all declare gods don't exist.

Well that's two variants. Those who declare no gods exist are stating a definite position, no?

Yes, but they still don't believe gods exist. You were saying some atheists do A, but some do B. I'm just clarifying that all do A, but some do B too.

[Rhiannon]

A-theism
Against theism ie god(s)

Its about belief.

Atheism is a LACK of belief NOT a belief!

It varies, doesn't it? For some it is an absence of belief, but for others it is a specific declaration that gods do not exist.

No, it doesn't vary. All have an absence of belief in gods, just not all declare gods don't exist.

Well that's two variants. Those who declare no gods exist are stating a definite position, no?

Yes, but they still don't believe gods exist. You were saying some atheists do A, but some do B. I'm just clarifying that all do A, but some do B too.

Methinks that is splitting hairs somewhat. It's a given that the Bs are also As, isn't it? So atheism does vary.

Not as much as paganism though. 

[Andy]

Methinks that is splitting hairs somewhat. It's a given that the Bs are also As, isn't it? So atheism does vary.

Not as much as paganism though. 

No, it's just accurate.

Atheists vary, just as everyone does anyway. Atheism doesn't.

[Rhiannon]

Regardless of how a deity looks...I think the morals and behaviour patterns encouraged by the group is more important IMO.

If the deity looks nice, gentle and handsome...but if the group encourages divisiveness, pride, selfishness, condemnation of others, violence and so on...then the deity is demonic.

If a deity looks ugly and harsh.... but the group encourages inclusiveness, selflessness, humility, tolerance, peace and nonviolence...then the deity is godly.

This is a very good point. It doesn't matter at all what an image looks like, or what title a deity has come to that, but what it inspires in its followers. Think what actions have been carried out in the name of the Prince of Peace.

Let's face it, Lady Rhi, some of the Egyptian deities were hardly paragons of beauty were they? The Roman ones were mostly human shaped though.

I don't know that human=beautiful. Is there anything lovelier than sharing one's life with a living representation of Bastet?

And the moon is quite lovely too. And the ocean, mountaintop, waterfall, snail, seedling...

[Rhiannon]

Methinks that is splitting hairs somewhat. It's a given that the Bs are also As, isn't it? So atheism does vary.

Not as much as paganism though. 

No, it's just accurate.

Atheists vary, just as everyone does anyway. Atheism doesn't.

Well it does a bit.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Implicit_and_explicit_atheism

[Owlswing]

Regardless of how a deity looks...I think the morals and behaviour patterns encouraged by the group is more important IMO.

If the deity looks nice, gentle and handsome...but if the group encourages divisiveness, pride, selfishness, condemnation of others, violence and so on...then the deity is demonic.

If a deity looks ugly and harsh.... but the group encourages inclusiveness, selflessness, humility, tolerance, peace and nonviolence...then the deity is godly.

This is a very good point. It doesn't matter at all what an image looks like, or what title a deity has come to that, but what it inspires in its followers. Think what actions have been carried out in the name of the Prince of Peace.

Let's face it, Lady Rhi, some of the Egyptian deities were hardly paragons of beauty were they? The Roman ones were mostly human shaped though.

I don't know that human=beautiful. Is there anything lovelier than sharing one's life with a living representation of Bastet?

And the moon is quite lovely too. And the ocean, mountaintop, waterfall, snail, seedling...

Conceded!

[Shaker]

Your post as usual has absolutely nothing to do with intelligence - the word is Wicca, not wicker 

I know... It was simply a gliche

The word is cliché.

But what is your excuse... Why reply to a spelling mistake and not the contents.

The contents are an incoherent word salad.

My excuse is exhaustion what is yours for not being able to produce an argument for the post?

I've just provided it - most of the time what you come out with isn't even comprehensible English.

[Sriram]

If a deity looks ugly and harsh.... but the group encourages inclusiveness, selflessness, humility, tolerance, peace and nonviolence...then the deity is godly.

I suppose it depends on what is included within inclusiveness.

By the way, Sriram, from what I have read of world belief systems, Christianity is the only one that was for the whole of humanity from its very inception.

Hope,

I don't know about that. Christians have always been trying to make everyone a Christian. They never recognized the merits of other belief systems and never accepted anyone else as knowledgeable and blessed.  It is probably the  very smug...'we are the only blessed ones'... attitude of the Jews that brushed off on the Christians as well.

However,  having said that I and most Indians are very appreciative of the  service mindedness of Christians. The missionaries, nuns and others  who traveled far and wide into unknown and often dangerous places... and their brave and tireless efforts to serve the poor,  to cure the ailing and to educate the people ....is truly amazing! Proves that faith can work wonders.

In recent decades Hindus have tried to pick up a few of these laudable qualities from Christians.

[Shaker]

I don't know about that. Christians have always been trying to make everyone a Christian. They never recognized the merits of other belief systems and never accepted anyone else as knowledgeable and blessed.  It is probably the  very smug...'we are the only blessed ones'... attitude of the Jews that brushed off on the Christians as well.

Excellent point.

[Leonard James]

However,  having said that I and most Indians are very appreciative of the  service mindedness of Christians. The missionaries, nuns and others  who traveled far and wide into unknown and often dangerous places... and their brave and tireless efforts to serve the poor,  to cure the ailing and to educate the people ....is truly amazing! Proves that faith can work wonders.

Unfortunately, the "educating" includes teaching them belief in a false "God". Every rose has a thorn.

In recent decades Hindus have tried to pick up a few of these laudable qualities from Christians.

Then I hope they take note of the above failing.

[Sriram]

I don't know about that. Christians have always been trying to make everyone a Christian. They never recognized the merits of other belief systems and never accepted anyone else as knowledgeable and blessed.  It is probably the  very smug...'we are the only blessed ones'... attitude of the Jews that brushed off on the Christians as well.

Excellent point.

Thanks Shaker!

[Sriram]

However,  having said that I and most Indians are very appreciative of the  service mindedness of Christians. The missionaries, nuns and others  who traveled far and wide into unknown and often dangerous places... and their brave and tireless efforts to serve the poor,  to cure the ailing and to educate the people ....is truly amazing! Proves that faith can work wonders.

Unfortunately, the "educating" includes teaching them belief in a false "God". Every rose has a thorn.

Spreading the faith was their motivation...but they nevertheless helped millions of people. That is commendable.

[Owlswing]

However,  having said that I and most Indians are very appreciative of the  service mindedness of Christians. The missionaries, nuns and others  who traveled far and wide into unknown and often dangerous places... and their brave and tireless efforts to serve the poor,  to cure the ailing and to educate the people ....is truly amazing! Proves that faith can work wonders.

Unfortunately, the "educating" includes teaching them belief in a false "God". Every rose has a thorn.

In recent decades Hindus have tried to pick up a few of these laudable qualities from Christians.

Then I hope they take note of the above failing.

Agreed in toto.

[Owlswing]

However,  having said that I and most Indians are very appreciative of the  service mindedness of Christians. The missionaries, nuns and others  who traveled far and wide into unknown and often dangerous places... and their brave and tireless efforts to serve the poor,  to cure the ailing and to educate the people ....is truly amazing! Proves that faith can work wonders.

Unfortunately, the "educating" includes teaching them belief in a false "God". Every rose has a thorn.

Spreading the faith was their motivation...but they nevertheless helped millions of people. That is commendable.

Yes, they did, but at a price!

For people like the Aztecs and the Mayans who told them to go home and to take their religion with them the price was extinction via military actio or venerial disease.

[BashfulAnthony]

OOHHH Interesting.
Would you please elaborate???

If you were referring to my comment, certainly.

I believe that there are multiple deities. I do not believe in one almighty deity who is responsible for everything that exists.

I believe that deity is present in all things but not a single deity.

I do not believe that all nature, that the whole universe is deity, a single deity.

What precisely do you mean by "deity?"

One or more of the Gods and Goddesses that make up my personal pantheon of deities.

Help me here.  Do you see these gods as "beings," or spirits, or what?

No, they are entities, like yours, there, but invisible most of the time - usually until you call upon them. Rather like yours.

So, correct me if I'm wrong:  your "entity" could be the self-same as mine, just perceived in a slightly different manner?

Get this once and for all BA - my deities are NOTHING like yours.

Aye, some are not the most friendly at times but they say what they mean, they mean what they say, they do not wrap it up in a load of shit so that they need a bunch of know-it-all priests to "interpret" their words.

If you fuck up your punishment will fit the crime (karma and the "three-fold law) not OTT eternal damnation in the Fires of Hell just for saying "I do not believe in you" and "I do not need you to "save" me".

Probably because they are all in your mind.  What evidence do you have for "their" existence?

[Shaker]

I like where this is going 

[Owlswing]

What precisely do you mean by "deity?"

One or more of the Gods and Goddesses that make up my personal pantheon of deities.

Help me here.  Do you see these gods as "beings," or spirits, or what?

No, they are entities, like yours, there, but invisible most of the time - usually until you call upon them. Rather like yours.

So, correct me if I'm wrong:  your "entity" could be the self-same as mine, just perceived in a slightly different manner?

Get this once and for all BA - my deities are NOTHING like yours.

Aye, some are not the most friendly at times but they say what they mean, they mean what they say, they do not wrap it up in a load of shit so that they need a bunch of know-it-all priests to "interpret" their words.

If you fuck up your punishment will fit the crime (karma and the "three-fold law) not OTT eternal damnation in the Fires of Hell just for saying "I do not believe in you" and "I do not need you to "save" me".

Probably because they are all in your mind.  What evidence do you have for "their" existence?

As I have said to Floo elsewhere.

Drop the evidence shit OK.

You cannot "prove" the existence of your deity any more than I can "prove" the existence of mine.

Why?

If you weren't so stuck in trying to "dis" my beliefs to the aggrandisement of your own you would be able to see it - either that or you are just too stupid to see it.

You cannot, I cannot, no-one can, "prove" the existence of something that is a belief, a matter of faith.

Now do me a favour either knock of the faux-stupid questions that, presumably, make you think that you are cleverer than I or just shut up.

[BashfulAnthony]

What precisely do you mean by "deity?"

One or more of the Gods and Goddesses that make up my personal pantheon of deities.

Help me here.  Do you see these gods as "beings," or spirits, or what?

No, they are entities, like yours, there, but invisible most of the time - usually until you call upon them. Rather like yours.

So, correct me if I'm wrong:  your "entity" could be the self-same as mine, just perceived in a slightly different manner?

Get this once and for all BA - my deities are NOTHING like yours.

Aye, some are not the most friendly at times but they say what they mean, they mean what they say, they do not wrap it up in a load of shit so that they need a bunch of know-it-all priests to "interpret" their words.

If you fuck up your punishment will fit the crime (karma and the "three-fold law) not OTT eternal damnation in the Fires of Hell just for saying "I do not believe in you" and "I do not need you to "save" me".

Probably because they are all in your mind.  What evidence do you have for "their" existence?

As I have said to Floo elsewhere.

Drop the evidence shit OK.

You cannot "prove" the existence of your deity any more than I can "prove" the existence of mine.

Why?

If you weren't so stuck in trying to "dis" my beliefs to the aggrandisement of your own you would be able to see it - either that or you are just too stupid to see it.

You cannot, I cannot, no-one can, "prove" the existence of something that is a belief, a matter of faith.

Now do me a favour either knock of the faux-stupid questions that, presumably, make you think that you are cleverer than I or just shut up.

Tetchy old guy, aren't you!

 So, you are just saying, you made these deities up and expect people to accept that as real?

"...make you think that you are cleverer than I."   That is self-evident, old son!!   

 

[trippymonkey]

Sorry but shouldn't that be said TO a Christian & not FROM one???

N

[BashfulAnthony]

Sorry but shouldn't that be said TO a Christian & not FROM one???

N

It is, just about every day.  The difference is, there is not one tiny scrap of evidence to support CMG KCMG GCMG's  claims.  He can't even put forward any clue as to their existence or "form."   It's all in the mind, I'm afraid.

[trippymonkey]

Well God IS, of course.
I'm NOT an atheist but there's really NO way to prove a God.
Personally I don't care what others think. as said in the other thread.

What matters is your ACTIONS NOT gobbing off all the time & arguing over non-provable things ?!!??!