Author Topic: And the American gun obsession goes on, and on, and......  (Read 11786 times)

Anchorman

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And the American gun obsession goes on, and on, and......
« on: August 26, 2015, 07:09:58 PM »
Self publicity?
Insanity?
Who knows....
Pity the U.S. Congress is so wedded to its' sacred constitution that it ignores the sacredness of life.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-34068541
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Gordon

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Re: And the American gun obsession goes on, and on, and......
« Reply #1 on: August 26, 2015, 07:17:10 PM »
You'd have thought that by now they'd have seen enough carnage to realise that some form of gun control is needed - one problem being that there are already vast numbers of guns in circulation there, so getting these out of circulation would be a practical problem even if the majority of the general public cooperated.


jeremyp

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Re: And the American gun obsession goes on, and on, and......
« Reply #2 on: August 26, 2015, 07:38:47 PM »
You'd have thought that by now they'd have seen enough carnage to realise that some form of gun control is needed - one problem being that there are already vast numbers of guns in circulation there, so getting these out of circulation would be a practical problem even if the majority of the general public cooperated.

Australia did it. 
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OH MY WORLD!

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Re: And the American gun obsession goes on, and on, and......
« Reply #3 on: August 26, 2015, 08:16:06 PM »
Sure, the USA could use more gun restrictions and background checking. That being said I noted the complete absence of this topic being brought up every time, like in gun restricting France, a Muslim terrorist gets a hold of guns and goes on or attempts (as in last week) a shooting spree. Why is that? Because Europeans seem to get their jollies looking down their long snouts at my American cousins while keeping quiet on the fact guns can be bought illegally in every single UK city. I also note that there has been no mention of the fact that this latest nut job was using the fact that he was gay and black and crying discrimination as the excuse to do what he has done. He's dead and now awaits final judgement.
When you stop your killers getting their guns then maybe I'll respect this typical knee jerk UK reaction against America.

ad_orientem

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Re: And the American gun obsession goes on, and on, and......
« Reply #4 on: August 26, 2015, 08:16:15 PM »
Self publicity?
Insanity?
Who knows....
Pity the U.S. Congress is so wedded to its' sacred constitution that it ignores the sacredness of life.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-34068541

America is a basket case. Insanity definitely.
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OH MY WORLD!

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Re: And the American gun obsession goes on, and on, and......
« Reply #5 on: August 26, 2015, 08:26:54 PM »
Yes Ad o, the USA is a basket case and this explains why the suicide rate in your Finland is higher than in the basket case.

Anchorman

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Re: And the American gun obsession goes on, and on, and......
« Reply #6 on: August 26, 2015, 08:28:40 PM »
Sure, the USA could use more gun restrictions and background checking. That being said I noted the complete absence of this topic being brought up every time, like in gun restricting France, a Muslim terrorist gets a hold of guns and goes on or attempts (as in last week) a shooting spree. Why is that? Because Europeans seem to get their jollies looking down their long snouts at my American cousins while keeping quiet on the fact guns can be bought illegally in every single UK city. I also note that there has been no mention of the fact that this latest nut job was using the fact that he was gay and black and crying discrimination as the excuse to do what he has done. He's dead and now awaits final judgement.
When you stop your killers getting their guns then maybe I'll respect this typical knee jerk UK reaction against America.



-
Who's reacting against America?
Just because their attitude to guns means that statistically, more people are butchered by guns in America per year than most of Europe combined is not being anti-American.
It's being anti-American Congress.
There's a difference.
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OH MY WORLD!

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Re: And the American gun obsession goes on, and on, and......
« Reply #7 on: August 26, 2015, 08:33:04 PM »
Yes you are Anchorman. You never go after the gun loving Swiss do you. Fact is you can be a gun loving country and not be known for shooting sprees. France, an anti gun country, and the Muslim terrorist have no poroblemos getting a hold of guns. But you will never address that will you. Nope just have to look down your beak at those damned gun lovin Yankees.

Gordon

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Re: And the American gun obsession goes on, and on, and......
« Reply #8 on: August 26, 2015, 08:36:14 PM »
Yes Ad o, the USA is a basket case and this explains why the suicide rate in your Finland is higher than in the basket case.

That is an obvious non-sequitur: how does the death rate from guns in the USA relate to the suicide rate in Finland?

Anchorman

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Re: And the American gun obsession goes on, and on, and......
« Reply #9 on: August 26, 2015, 08:38:00 PM »
Where have I ever condoned terrorism. JC;
Whether IRA, INLA, UDA, UVF, Bader-Meinhoff, 'red brigade' IS/ISL, Alqeada - whatever; a terrorist is a terrorist.
What's that got to do with lax gun laws in the USA, please?
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OH MY WORLD!

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Re: And the American gun obsession goes on, and on, and......
« Reply #10 on: August 26, 2015, 08:47:40 PM »
Anchorman,
When have I ever written that you condone terrorism? Don't play me like that Anchorman. I mention the silence towards what has been going on in France and the immediate arrogant slag of the USA. This is normal behaviour for some of you UK people here. I get that Anchorman.

Anchorman

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Re: And the American gun obsession goes on, and on, and......
« Reply #11 on: August 26, 2015, 08:52:00 PM »
I don't recall being silent over the events in France - certainly the appalling Charlie Ebdo murders were well debated on this forum.
Again, what does that have to do with the extraordinarily lax gun laws Stateside?
"for, as long as but a hundred of us remain alive, never will we on any conditions be brought under English rule. It is in truth not for glory, nor riches, nor honours that we are fighting, but for freedom - for that alone, which no honest man gives up but with life itself."

Owlswing

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Re: And the American gun obsession goes on, and on, and......
« Reply #12 on: August 27, 2015, 02:30:29 AM »
Sure, the USA could use more gun restrictions and background checking. That being said I noted the complete absence of this topic being brought up every time, like in gun restricting France, a Muslim terrorist gets a hold of guns and goes on or attempts (as in last week) a shooting spree. Why is that? Because Europeans seem to get their jollies looking down their long snouts at my American cousins while keeping quiet on the fact guns can be bought illegally in every single UK city. I also note that there has been no mention of the fact that this latest nut job was using the fact that he was gay and black and crying discrimination as the excuse to do what he has done. He's dead and now awaits final judgement.
When you stop your killers getting their guns then maybe I'll respect this typical knee jerk UK reaction against America.

That's it - as per usual - shit happens in America but the Canoe has got to say that whatever shit it might be it is worse in Europe and/or Britain!

Change the bloody record, JC - we have all heard this one far, far, too many times to take any notice of it and it does nothing for your credibility on this side of the Oggin!
 
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Hope

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Re: And the American gun obsession goes on, and on, and......
« Reply #13 on: August 27, 2015, 08:27:38 AM »
When you stop your killers getting their guns then maybe I'll respect this typical knee jerk UK reaction against America.
Sorry to disappoint you, jc, but the so-called 'knee-jerk reaction' came from no-less a person than POTUS himself.  He pointed out that, whilst his own country is quite happy to spent billions of dollars on anti-terrorism measures, it isn't willing to clamp down on something that sees far more deaths per year than any terrorist threat has ever done.
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floo

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Re: And the American gun obsession goes on, and on, and......
« Reply #14 on: August 27, 2015, 08:36:31 AM »
America's love of firearms is crazy and then some. However many terrible gun related atrocities there are they never seem to get it! :o

Hope

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Re: And the American gun obsession goes on, and on, and......
« Reply #15 on: August 27, 2015, 08:37:18 AM »
Yes you are Anchorman. You never go after the gun loving Swiss do you. Fact is you can be a gun loving country and not be known for shooting sprees. France, an anti gun country, and the Muslim terrorist have no poroblemos getting a hold of guns. But you will never address that will you. Nope just have to look down your beak at those damned gun lovin Yankees.
jc, you seem to be missing the point: gun-related death in the States is so prevalent that it needs a story like the killing of two innocent journalists, or the death of x number of students/pupils in a local school or college to get anyone's interest up.  On the other hand, when did you last hear about a mass-shooting in Switzerland.  The multiple-deaths associated with the Charlie Hebdo killings in France earlier this year received world-wide coverage because they were so unusual, world-wide coverage that lasted for several days, a longevity which this latest story from Virginia will never see.
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Hope

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Re: And the American gun obsession goes on, and on, and......
« Reply #16 on: August 27, 2015, 08:48:04 AM »
America's love of firearms is crazy and then some. However many terrible gun related atrocities there are they never seem to get it! :o
Unfortunately, Floo, your own nation has its own idiosyncracies - think of its attitude to the European migrant issue.  That's no less of a head-in-the-sand attitude.
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Hope

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Re: And the American gun obsession goes on, and on, and......
« Reply #17 on: August 27, 2015, 08:54:24 AM »
Anchorman,
When have I ever written that you condone terrorism? Don't play me like that Anchorman. I mention the silence towards what has been going on in France and the immediate arrogant slag of the USA. This is normal behaviour for some of you UK people here. I get that Anchorman.
jc, I think that there is a 'slight' difference between what hapened in France earlier this week, and what happened in Virginia yesterday.  In the latter, two professionals were shot in cold blood; no-one, to my knowledge, died in the French scenario.  Rather 2 very brave, some might even say silly, American servicemen, assisted by a Frenchman and a Brit managed to disarm and overpower someone who was threatening to kill a large number of people in that train.  I don't know about the media in the States and Canada, but there has been far more coverage of the acts of bravery in the British and European press than of the failure of the attacker's intentions.
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Nearly Sane

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Re: And the American gun obsession goes on, and on, and......
« Reply #18 on: August 27, 2015, 08:58:35 AM »
America's love of firearms is crazy and then some. However many terrible gun related atrocities there are they never seem to get it! :o
Unfortunately, Floo, your own nation has its own idiosyncracies - think of its attitude to the European migrant issue.  That's no less of a head-in-the-sand attitude.

Tu quoque

Hope

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Re: And the American gun obsession goes on, and on, and......
« Reply #19 on: August 27, 2015, 09:03:13 AM »
Tu quoque
By no means; just pointing out that there are many things in Britons' 'back-yard' that need to be sorted out.
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ad_orientem

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Re: And the American gun obsession goes on, and on, and......
« Reply #20 on: August 27, 2015, 09:06:21 AM »
Yes Ad o, the USA is a basket case and this explains why the suicide rate in your Finland is higher than in the basket case.

Why do you always resort to this whenever anyone has anything critical to say concerning America?
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Outrider

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Re: And the American gun obsession goes on, and on, and......
« Reply #21 on: August 27, 2015, 09:16:53 AM »
Sure, the USA could use more gun restrictions and background checking. That being said I noted the complete absence of this topic being brought up every time, like in gun restricting France, a Muslim terrorist gets a hold of guns and goes on or attempts (as in last week) a shooting spree. Why is that? Because Europeans seem to get their jollies looking down their long snouts at my American cousins while keeping quiet on the fact guns can be bought illegally in every single UK city.

Are illegal guns available, with some difficulty, in various places in Europe? Yes. Are guns - including large-calibre, large magazine, automatic rifles, for instance -  freely available, legally, and permissible in public places by idiots with criminal records in the US? Yes. Do you see why there's a difference in reporting there? Would you rather look at the resulting statistics on gun-crime and gunshot deaths per capita instead?

Quote
I also note that there has been no mention of the fact that this latest nut job was using the fact that he was gay and black and crying discrimination as the excuse to do what he has done. He's dead and now awaits final judgement.

We've not seen anything to determine whether his claims of discrimination are true, yet - it's entirely possible, especially in the US, that he was discriminated against because of his race and sexuality: neither of those justifies gunning people down in the street, nor justifies a government policy which allows people to purchase firearms unchecked.

Quote
When you stop your killers getting their guns then maybe I'll respect this typical knee jerk UK reaction against America.

We do stop potential killers getting guns. That's why our deaths per 100,000 from guns stands at 0.26 against the US rate of 10.64 - that suggests, all things being equal, we stop around 97% of our killers.

(source: wikipedia list of countries by firearm related death rate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate)

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Outrider

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Re: And the American gun obsession goes on, and on, and......
« Reply #22 on: August 27, 2015, 09:22:19 AM »
Yes Ad o, the USA is a basket case and this explains why the suicide rate in your Finland is higher than in the basket case.

Suicide rate per 100,000:
Finland - 11.3
US - 12.6

source: Wikipedia page on deaths by suicide https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_suicide_rate

Suicide rate per 100,000 by gun
Finland - 3.34
US - 6.7

source: wikipedia page on list of countries by gun-related death rate
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate

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Outrider

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Re: And the American gun obsession goes on, and on, and......
« Reply #23 on: August 27, 2015, 09:26:57 AM »
Yes you are Anchorman. You never go after the gun loving Swiss do you. Fact is you can be a gun loving country and not be known for shooting sprees. France, an anti gun country, and the Muslim terrorist have no poroblemos getting a hold of guns. But you will never address that will you. Nope just have to look down your beak at those damned gun lovin Yankees.

Gun ownership per 100 vs gun deaths per 100,000:
Switzerland: 45.7 vs 2.91
US: 88.8 vs 10.64

Yes, Americans have cultural problem in that their guns kill more people than other people's guns, but they also have twice the number of guns per person than the Swiss you try to compare them with.

Serbia was recently an active war-zone - arguably still is, in places - and yet the Americans still have a 15% higher gun ownership rate.

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Shaker

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Re: And the American gun obsession goes on, and on, and......
« Reply #24 on: August 27, 2015, 09:39:51 AM »
Have to say it again, big O; this thread shows what is to me debate and discussion at its best, where wild claims are sprayed around like cow shit from muck spreader and are countered - in fact refuted - by hard evidence. Top banana.
« Last Edit: August 27, 2015, 09:43:20 AM by Shaker »
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