Who created the deity?

[floo]

deleted

[Alien]

Another poster stated on another thread that we couldn't have come from nothing, so by the same token nor could the deity. 'He was always there', doesn't cut the mustard, imo!

I must have missed that. Are you mixing up "he was always there" with "he had no beginning"?

[floo]

Another poster stated on another thread that we couldn't have come from nothing, so by the same token nor could the deity. 'He was always there', doesn't cut the mustard, imo!

I must have missed that. Are you mixing up "he was always there" with "he had no beginning"?

And the difference is?

The most logical explanation is that the deity is one of the nastier human creations, with all the worst human faults and failings.

[Alien]

...
The most logical explanation is that the deity is one of the nastier human creations, with all the worst human faults and failings.

It's not going to be you just asserting that God is evil, is it? I don't have time for such stuff.

[jakswan]

t's not going to be you just asserting that God is evil, is it? I don't have time for such stuff.

Odd, you seem to have plenty of time for asserting your god is good.

[floo]

...
The most logical explanation is that the deity is one of the nastier human creations, with all the worst human faults and failings.

It's not going to be you just asserting that God is evil, is it? I don't have time for such stuff.

What is good about it? No one ever seems to be able to answer that question with any credibility!

[jeremyp]

I must have missed that. Are you mixing up "he was always there" with "he had no beginning"?

Can you explain the difference between "always there" and "had no beginning"?

[Spud]

Another poster stated on another thread that we couldn't have come from nothing,

If you mean me, what I said was "it is naturally impossible for matter to arise from nothing". In other words, matter doesn't arise by natural processes. Yet apparently we have come from nothing. This implies a supernatural origin for matter.

so by the same token nor could the deity. 'He was always there', doesn't cut the mustard, imo!

Time is actually the relative movement of matter.
(Reference https://www.physicsforums.com/threads/matter-forms-space-time-is-relative-motion.39029/)
So, if 'the deity' created matter, then 'it' existed before time.

[Hope]

What is good about it? No one ever seems to be able to answer that question with any credibility!

I suppose whose credibility you judge that by.  Since you seem to start threads about the same issue every couple of months - on the grounds, I suspect, that you haven't liked the answers you received on the previous threads - I'm not sure that your credibility is anything to judge anyone else's credibility by.

[2Corrie]

Another poster stated on another thread that we couldn't have come from nothing, so by the same token nor could the deity. 'He was always there', doesn't cut the mustard, imo!

I must have missed that. Are you mixing up "he was always there" with "he had no beginning"?

And the difference is?

The most logical explanation is that the deity is one of the nastier human creations, with all the worst human faults and failings.

convince yourself Floo. 

Who created the universe? Itself?

[Shaker]

1. Why do you use the word 'who'? Rather telling that; it implies that for some reason you automatically think in terms of conscious agency. Why would that be?

2. Do we know that the universe was created at all? No, we don't.

[Hope]

2. Do we know that the universe was created at all? No, we don't.

If the Big Bang did occur, it would suggest that the universe ddn't come into being in and of its own action.  That would then suggest that, in the fundamental sense of the term - 'create' - that something occurred outside of the influence of what we now refer to as 'the universe'.

[jakswan]

Another poster stated on another thread that we couldn't have come from nothing, so by the same token nor could the deity. 'He was always there', doesn't cut the mustard, imo!

I must have missed that. Are you mixing up "he was always there" with "he had no beginning"?

And the difference is?

The most logical explanation is that the deity is one of the nastier human creations, with all the worst human faults and failings.

convince yourself Floo. 

Who created the universe? Itself?

I don't know what (not who) created the universe and neither do you.

[floo]

Another poster stated on another thread that we couldn't have come from nothing, so by the same token nor could the deity. 'He was always there', doesn't cut the mustard, imo!

I must have missed that. Are you mixing up "he was always there" with "he had no beginning"?

And the difference is?

The most logical explanation is that the deity is one of the nastier human creations, with all the worst human faults and failings.

convince yourself Floo. 

Who created the universe? Itself?

I am sure the explanation will be found one day, and I bet when it is no deity will be involved.

[Shaker]

2. Do we know that the universe was created at all? No, we don't.

If the Big Bang did occur, it would suggest that the universe ddn't come into being in and of its own action.  That would then suggest that, in the fundamental sense of the term - 'create' - that something occurred outside of the influence of what we now refer to as 'the universe'.

Good luck extracting a god out of that 

[2Corrie]

Another poster stated on another thread that we couldn't have come from nothing, so by the same token nor could the deity. 'He was always there', doesn't cut the mustard, imo!

I must have missed that. Are you mixing up "he was always there" with "he had no beginning"?

And the difference is?

The most logical explanation is that the deity is one of the nastier human creations, with all the worst human faults and failings.

convince yourself Floo. 

Who created the universe? Itself?

I am sure the explanation will be found one day, and I bet when it is no deity will be involved.

Such faith! 

[jakswan]

Another poster stated on another thread that we couldn't have come from nothing, so by the same token nor could the deity. 'He was always there', doesn't cut the mustard, imo!

I must have missed that. Are you mixing up "he was always there" with "he had no beginning"?

And the difference is?

The most logical explanation is that the deity is one of the nastier human creations, with all the worst human faults and failings.

convince yourself Floo. 

Who created the universe? Itself?

I am sure the explanation will be found one day, and I bet when it is no deity will be involved.

Such faith! 

Suggest you look up the definition of faith.

[floo]

Another poster stated on another thread that we couldn't have come from nothing, so by the same token nor could the deity. 'He was always there', doesn't cut the mustard, imo!

I must have missed that. Are you mixing up "he was always there" with "he had no beginning"?

And the difference is?

The most logical explanation is that the deity is one of the nastier human creations, with all the worst human faults and failings.

convince yourself Floo. 

Who created the universe? Itself?

I am sure the explanation will be found one day, and I bet when it is no deity will be involved.

Such faith! 

I have much more faith in science and human ingenuity than I have in religion. If humans had waited for the flipping deity to lend a hand we would still be sitting on the edge of the primeval swamp!

[Outrider]

If you mean me, what I said was "it is naturally impossible for matter to arise from nothing". In other words, matter doesn't arise by natural processes. Yet apparently we have come from nothing. This implies a supernatural origin for matter.

Only if we were to accept your assertion that 'it's naturally impossible for matter to arise from nothing' as valid - it isn't.

The point raised is still valid, though - if we were to accept the contention that matter can't arise from nothing, and to accept  another commonly posited contention of reality-deniers that 'complex information can't emerge without a guide' then how do you explain the complex entity posited in the form of gods?

O.

[trippymonkey]

Doesn't sound to me like we have all the facts anyway !!! 
Then again, would we understand it all if we did?? 
 
Are we cavemen grunting in front of a laptop ?!?!!?!?

Nick

[Alien]

Doesn't sound to me like we have all the facts anyway !!! 
Then again, would be understand it all if we did?? 
 
Are we cavemen grunting in front of a laptop ?!?!!?!?

Nick

Good questions. Is it OK if I quote you in a discussion elsewhere on objective morality?

[trippymonkey]

Of course you may. As long as it's 'good' !?!?! 
Please send me links of these discussions.

Nick

[OH MY WORLD!]

I can't believe your nerve floo. If God is as bad as you think and just a nasty creation of man, then who was this Lord you thanked and prayed to when you penned and put on the internet, that grandma's prayer of yours?

[Alien]

Of course you may. As long as it's 'good' !?!?! 
Please send me links of these discussions.

Nick

Shall do.

[floo]

I am bumping this topic up again as it has been mentioned a few times on another thread.