Discerning the wheat from the tares.

[Sassy]

King James 2000 Bible
But while men slept, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went his way.



King James Bible
These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

Note to reader: The NT did not exist and the scriptures they checked were OT.

So to ensure what you believe it must be checked out by the OT not the NT.

So discuss beliefs and origins without using the NT.
Show in the OT where the Prophets taught that the Messiah would be God made man. It is clear that the Messiah was to be a man raised from their own brethren.

Deuteronomy 18: 15-18.

God himself saying he would raise them up a Prophet from amongst their own brethren.

The NT must reflect the truth of the OT. If it cannot be found in the OT it must (as in the times of the disciples) be rejected. Because at no time during the preaching of the good news did a copy of the NT become included in scripture.
Christ fulfilled the scriptures about himself and he foretold of the things still to come.

[floo]

I am of the opinion the life of Jesus was created by the gospel writers to fit in with supposed 'prophecies'.

[ad_orientem]

Your argument is flawed. When Moses wrote the Pentateuch the writings of the prophets did not exist. Does that mean they're not scripture? The NT is scripture because the Church recognises them as such. The same goes for the OT. But then you are a heretic and so it's not surprising that you have a screwed view of the NT and most importantly of Christ, nay, you believe in some other Christ, not the Christ of scripture.

[floo]

Your argument is flawed. When Moses wrote the Pentateuch the writings of the prophets did not exist. Does that mean they're not scripture? The NT is scripture because the Church recognises them as such. The same goes for the OT. But then you are a heretic and so it's not surprising that you have a screwed view of the NT and most importantly of Christ, nay, you believe in some other Christ, not the Christ of scripture.

There is no evidence Moses wrote anything. Funny most of the Jews didn't see that bloke Jesus as any sort of Messiah, and it appears his nearest and dearest didn't rate him either!

[ad_orientem]

Your argument is flawed. When Moses wrote the Pentateuch the writings of the prophets did not exist. Does that mean they're not scripture? The NT is scripture because the Church recognises them as such. The same goes for the OT. But then you are a heretic and so it's not surprising that you have a screwed view of the NT and most importantly of Christ, nay, you believe in some other Christ, not the Christ of scripture.

There is no evidence Moses wrote anything. Funny most of the Jews didn't see that bloke Jesus as any sort of Messiah, and it appears his nearest and dearest didn't rate him either!

The Jews are blind to the scriptures.

[BashfulAnthony]

Your argument is flawed. When Moses wrote the Pentateuch the writings of the prophets did not exist. Does that mean they're not scripture? The NT is scripture because the Church recognises them as such. The same goes for the OT. But then you are a heretic and so it's not surprising that you have a screwed view of the NT and most importantly of Christ, nay, you believe in some other Christ, not the Christ of scripture.

There is no evidence Moses wrote anything. Funny most of the Jews didn't see that bloke Jesus as any sort of Messiah, and it appears his nearest and dearest didn't rate him either!

I agree with you about Moses;  but you are entirely incorrect, again, about Jesus,  After His death His brother, James became head of the early Church. 

Is it really necessary to refer to Jesus as "that bloke?"  As far as I'm concerned that sort of comment is far more unpleasant and abusive than anything I ever say.  I wouldn't treat a poltergeist in such a cavalier manner.

[Sassy]

Your argument is flawed. When Moses wrote the Pentateuch the writings of the prophets did not exist. Does that mean they're not scripture? The NT is scripture because the Church recognises them as such. The same goes for the OT. But then you are a heretic and so it's not surprising that you have a screwed view of the NT and most importantly of Christ, nay, you believe in some other Christ, not the Christ of scripture.

So CHRIST is wrong when he claims that King James Bible
Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

He doesn't claim to come to just fulfill the Torah does he?

In fact he claimed to King James Bible
And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.

I guess your use of the word heretic is again misused and deliberately done ignoring what Christ said:

Now if Christ never said that then you would have a point.
But in the NT Jesus meets up with Elijah the Prophet and Moses.
You see the Word of God in the OT and the works are confirmed by Christ.
Just as Christ did not mention any NEW scriptures nor the Prophets or the disciples then we can be sure that Christs words are living words. For the bible is about truth. The truth is that Jesus was to bring the truth to man about what God wanted.

But nowhere does the Father or the Son state New Scriptures will come. Hence the truth is that God changes life no more through the written but through the Spirit.

King James Bible
Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

John 16:13

The Spirit teacheth all believers now.
What Christians write is not what saves but whom you believe in and whom teaches you.

[ad_orientem]

Yes, you are a heretic, a follower of Arius, and you do not believe in Christ otherwise you would acknowledge that that Christ is God. You do not understand the scriptures.

[Leonard James]

You do not understand the scriptures.

The Oracle has spoken! 

[BashfulAnthony]

You do not understand the scriptures.

The Oracle has spoken! 

Despite your snipe, what he says is true!

[Leonard James]

Despite your snipe, what he says is true!

No it isn't! There is no way to prove the truth of the ramblings of some long dead religious types ... and you know that as well as I do.

[DaveM]

Well considering that a central aspect of Paul's preaching was to claim that Jesus was both God and Christ, and considering that after diligently searching the (OT) Scriptures to check Paul's claims, and considering once more that many of them became believers we can only come to one conclusion.  Those 'more noble' Jews at Berea must have found OT evidence to their satisfaction that Paul's claims were indeed correct and that Jesus is in fact God.

[Leonard James]

Well considering that a central aspect of Paul's preaching was to claim that Jesus was both God and Christ, and considering that after diligently searching the (OT) Scriptures to check Paul's claims, and considering once more that many of them became believers we can only come to one conclusion.  Those 'more noble' Jews at Berea must have found OT evidence to their satisfaction that Paul's claims were indeed correct and that Jesus is in fact God.

Such is the power of a charismatic teacher to sway people to his beliefs.

[floo]

Despite your snipe, what he says is true!

No it isn't! There is no way to prove the truth of the ramblings of some long dead religious types ... and you know that as well as I do.

In more recent times we don't know for sure if people who do happen to have some historical basis, unlike the Biblical characters, said and did the things claimed for them. 

[BashfulAnthony]

Despite your snipe, what he says is true!

No it isn't! There is no way to prove the truth of the ramblings of some long dead religious types ... and you know that as well as I do.

In more recent times we don't know for sure if people who do happen to have some historical basis, unlike the Biblical characters, said and did the things claimed for them.

And such a point of view can be attributed to countless events in history, but we do not roundly condemn them all,  unless we are pig-ignorant.

[Leonard James]

Despite your snipe, what he says is true!

No it isn't! There is no way to prove the truth of the ramblings of some long dead religious types ... and you know that as well as I do.

In more recent times we don't know for sure if people who do happen to have some historical basis, unlike the Biblical characters, said and did the things claimed for them.

Absolutely, Roses. We can only be guided by the strength of the evidence presented by their followers/detractors.

And n my opinion it is always better to err on the side of scepticism rather than credulity.

[DaveM]

Well considering that a central aspect of Paul's preaching was to claim that Jesus was both God and Christ, and considering that after diligently searching the (OT) Scriptures to check Paul's claims, and considering once more that many of them became believers we can only come to one conclusion.  Those 'more noble' Jews at Berea must have found OT evidence to their satisfaction that Paul's claims were indeed correct and that Jesus is in fact God.

Such is the power of a charismatic teacher to sway people to his beliefs.

Excepting that even a casual reading of Acts 17 makes it plain that those in Berea were not the sort to allow themselves to be swayed by a glib talker (which Paul by his own admission was not).  Which is precisely why they were cautious enough and suspicious enough to search the Scriptures daily to check him out.

[BashfulAnthony]

Despite your snipe, what he says is true!

No it isn't! There is no way to prove the truth of the ramblings of some long dead religious types ... and you know that as well as I do.

In more recent times we don't know for sure if people who do happen to have some historical basis, unlike the Biblical characters, said and did the things claimed for them.

Absolutely, Roses. We can only be guided by the strength of the evidence presented by their followers/detractors.

And n my opinion it is always better to err on the side of scepticism rather than credulity.

That's the whole point_ but you err on all counts, because you haven't the depth of knowledge to make informed judgements.

[floo]

Despite your snipe, what he says is true!

No it isn't! There is no way to prove the truth of the ramblings of some long dead religious types ... and you know that as well as I do.

In more recent times we don't know for sure if people who do happen to have some historical basis, unlike the Biblical characters, said and did the things claimed for them.

Absolutely, Roses. We can only be guided by the strength of the evidence presented by their followers/detractors.

And n my opinion it is always better to err on the side of scepticism rather than credulity.

There is plenty to be sceptical about where that not so good book is concerned.

[BashfulAnthony]

Despite your snipe, what he says is true!

No it isn't! There is no way to prove the truth of the ramblings of some long dead religious types ... and you know that as well as I do.

In more recent times we don't know for sure if people who do happen to have some historical basis, unlike the Biblical characters, said and did the things claimed for them.

Absolutely, Roses. We can only be guided by the strength of the evidence presented by their followers/detractors.

And n my opinion it is always better to err on the side of scepticism rather than credulity.

There is plenty to be sceptical about where that not so good book is concerned.

There is plenty to be sceptical about in the world:  poltergeists, for example.  What are your views on them?

[Leonard James]

Excepting that even a casual reading of Acts 17 makes it plain that those in Berea were not the sort to allow themselves to be swayed by a glib talker (which Paul by his own admission was not).  Which is precisely why they were cautious enough and suspicious enough to search the Scriptures daily to check him out.

It's easy to find corroboration in the records of people who all believed the same thing.

However, that is a long way from it proving the truth.

[BashfulAnthony]

Excepting that even a casual reading of Acts 17 makes it plain that those in Berea were not the sort to allow themselves to be swayed by a glib talker (which Paul by his own admission was not).  Which is precisely why they were cautious enough and suspicious enough to search the Scriptures daily to check him out.

It's easy to find corroboration in the records of people who all believed the same thing.

However, that is a long way from it proving the truth.

I have no recollection of you ever debating any specific points about Christianity on this forum.  Yet you dismiss it all.  Show some knowledge and perception by actually debating, rather than this across-the-board dismissal.

[DaveM]

Excepting that even a casual reading of Acts 17 makes it plain that those in Berea were not the sort to allow themselves to be swayed by a glib talker (which Paul by his own admission was not).  Which is precisely why they were cautious enough and suspicious enough to search the Scriptures daily to check him out.

It's easy to find corroboration in the records of people who all believed the same thing.

However, that is a long way from it proving the truth.

There are plenty of people who cannot recognise the truth even when it is staring them in the face, amongst them a certain Pontius Pilate.

[Leonard James]

I have no recollection of you ever debating any specific points about Christianity on this forum.

That will be because your memory is not that good.

Yet you dismiss it all.

More lies!

Show some knowledge and perception by actually debating, rather than this across-the-board dismissal.

Debating with you, my dear Tony, is like talking to a robot.

[Leonard James]

There are plenty of people who cannot recognise the truth even when it is staring them in the face, amongst them a certain Pontius Pilate.

No to mention most of the Christians on this board!