OOB dream experience.

[Udayana]

Either because she doesn't know herself or, if she actually used the words "dumping detritus", she thought you would not understand her theory. Which school or field of psychology does she study/work in?

As far as I know there is no current theory of dreams worth the title.

[Udayana]

Ippy, You could show her this exchange and get more details maybe?

[floo]

Ippy, You could show her this exchange and get more details maybe?

And your expertise in this field is?

There seems to be quite a lot of research into dreaming!

http://psychology.about.com/od/statesofconsciousness/p/dream-theories.htm

[Nearly Sane]

And your expertise in this field is?

There seems to be quite a lot of research into dreaming!

http://psychology.about.com/od/statesofconsciousness/p/dream-theories.htm

What is this obsession on the forum of late of people needing 'ologies'?

[wigginhall]

Either because she doesn't know herself or, if she actually used the words "dumping detritus", she thought you would not understand her theory. Which school or field of psychology does she study/work in?

As far as I know there is no current theory of dreams worth the title.

I've found psychoanalytic and Jungian ideas about dreams interesting, but I think the big mistake which used to be made in psychotherapy was to prescribe an interpretation.  This was too hierarchical - sit there, while I tell you what your dreams mean.  This is too intrusive, I think, and the same with manuals of dream interpretation.  However, people can use their own dreams in quite productive ways, as a set of symbols.  But in that sense, they are no different from any symbols really. 

[Udayana]

And your expertise in this field is?

There seems to be quite a lot of research into dreaming!

http://psychology.about.com/od/statesofconsciousness/p/dream-theories.htm

I'm not claiming any special expertise. There is a lot of interesting research into dreaming, including the activation-synthesis model you have linked to. But the video suggested it was "our most creative conscious state" - not "dumping detritus".
 

[Udayana]

I've found psychoanalytic and Jungian ideas about dreams interesting, but I think the big mistake which used to be made in psychotherapy was to prescribe an interpretation.  This was too hierarchical - sit there, while I tell you what your dreams mean.  This is too intrusive, I think, and the same with manuals of dream interpretation.  However, people can use their own dreams in quite productive ways, as a set of symbols.  But in that sense, they are no different from any symbols really.

Jung's cataloging of symbols and archetypes was useful, but psychoanalysis itself has no real scientific basis. The most useful idea I've picked up from it is that other people in your dreams just represent various aspects of yourself, ie. projected onto them, not anything directly to do with those persons. I think this definitely has helped me gain insight when thinking about my own dreams.

[Gonnagle]

Dear Udayana,

The most useful idea I've picked up from it is that other people in your dreams just represent various aspects of yourself, ie. projected onto them, not anything directly to do with those persons.

That was at the back of my mind ( a place that definitely needs a de-clutter ) was it Freud who said that we are all the people in our dreams, is that what you are saying?

Gonnagle.

[Udayana]

Essential yes, though did it originate with Freud? I came across it in Gestalt therapy.

[Gonnagle]

Dear Udayana,

Essential yes, though did it originate with Freud? I came across it in Gestalt therapy.

Not sure myself but if it is true, hell! I don't think I will ever sleep again

Gonnagle.

[King Oberon]

That sounds like an uncommon load of old toffee to me!

An unbeliever!, Persecute! Kill the heretic! 

[Udayana]

Dear Udayana,

Not sure myself but if it is true, hell! I don't think I will ever sleep again

Gonnagle.

It's not something that is "true" or "not true" though. More like a different perspective from which to think about your dream - that may be helpful or maybe not.

[wigginhall]

Jung's cataloging of symbols and archetypes was useful, but psychoanalysis itself has no real scientific basis. The most useful idea I've picked up from it is that other people in your dreams just represent various aspects of yourself, ie. projected onto them, not anything directly to do with those persons. I think this definitely has helped me gain insight when thinking about my own dreams.

Yes, I think the idea of projection is useful with some dreams, although not all.  I think you have to have a kind of mixed approach to dreams, if you are working as a therapist.   Psychoanalytic, Jungian, Gestalt, Kleinian, I used to take what's useful, although some people disagree.   Scientific?  That's another thread, really.  I see therapy as an interpretive art.

Good point about 'truth' - yes, that's not the issue. 

[Dicky Underpants]

Well, OOB experiences are similar to NDEs ... maybe Old Father Time is lurking near! 

Perish the thought, Len! As you may remember, I related some of my own experiences of this sort of thing way back on the old BBC forum, and all these experiences occurred before I was thirty (except for a number of weird lucid dream experiences I had in my mid-thirties, which resulted from my taking extremely strong opiates over a long period for intense pain relief).
One OOB occurred when I was on a train (the only occasion when I appeared to 'see my body'). I was in the toilet when the train jolted into motion, and I appeared to see myself collapsing onto the wash-basin and then to the floor. I had a number of strange experiences during my teens when I found myself apparently floating out of the window of my childhood home, through a landscape akin to the actual one, but different in a number of aspects. I suspect these were self-induced.

[ippy]

Ippy, You could show her this exchange and get more details maybe?

I could do this if I needed to, anyway since I was only passing on something that just happened to come up in a family type conversation and I thought at the time interesting.

Why do you seem to be making some kind of argument out of this I'm not, if it bothers you that much you could look it up and perhaps some new theories have come to light, I don't know, I only know the info I've heard, I'm not an expert, and I haven't even implied as much.

ippy

[BashfulAnthony]

You always look confused!

    So witty!

[Bubbles]

The current thinking is that dreaming is the brain dumping the detritus it gathers during its wakeful hours.

Unless you have some need for a fortune teller, "cross my palm with silver" and all of that, I'd rather go with current theory from professionals.

ippy

It was just my opinions and observations.

Sometimes I do disagree with current theory from professionals, because it seems to me professionals don't know everything.

I don't always go with the current thinking from professionals because sometimes, just occasionally I think they are wrong.

Not on dreams specifically, but on advice given by professionals that varies from year to year. ( example midwives on the best way to put a baby in a cot)

Just because someone has an ' ology' doesn't mean they know it all.

Posters on here have related instances when they have thought an " expert" or doctor was wrong.

I see nothing wrong with ordinary people challenging other people with an "ology"

Having an " ology" doesn't mean that person thinks for themselves.

It just means, they have read a lot of books.

[Udayana]

I could do this if I needed to, anyway since I was only passing on something that just happened to come up in a family type conversation and I thought at the time interesting.

Why do you seem to be making some kind of argument out of this I'm not, if it bothers you that much you could look it up and perhaps some new theories have come to light, I don't know, I only know the info I've heard, I'm not an expert, and I haven't even implied as much.

ippy

Sorry, I don't mean to make an argument of it. I don't mind nonsense, but I do have an allergic reaction to nonsense being presented as logical or scientific to try and oppose something that clearly has no pretensions to be either.

[Leonard James]

Dear Leonard,

Sigmund Freud.

You have some weird wishes old son

Gonnagle.

Believe that and you'll believe anything, Gonners! 

[ippy]

Sorry, I don't mean to make an argument of it. I don't mind nonsense, but I do have an allergic reaction to nonsense being presented as logical or scientific to try and oppose something that clearly has no pretensions to be either.

It's not clear what nonsense you're referring to Please enlighten me?

ippy

[ippy]

It was just my opinions and observations.

Sometimes I do disagree with current theory from professionals, because it seems to me professionals don't know everything.

I don't always go with the current thinking from professionals because sometimes, just occasionally I think they are wrong.

Not on dreams specifically, but on advice given by professionals that varies from year to year. ( example midwives on the best way to put a baby in a cot)

Just because someone has an ' ology' doesn't mean they know it all.

Posters on here have related instances when they have thought an " expert" or doctor was wrong.

I see nothing wrong with ordinary people challenging other people with an "ology"

Having an " ology" doesn't mean that person thinks for themselves.

It just means, they have read a lot of books.

I don't have any problems going with whatever the current theory happens to be, I always, without fail back off of mumbo jumbo, then again if the current theory changes, it can be really interesting to know why.

ippy

[Leonard James]

Perish the thought, Len! As you may remember, I related some of my own experiences of this sort of thing way back on the old BBC forum, and all these experiences occurred before I was thirty (except for a number of weird lucid dream experiences I had in my mid-thirties, which resulted from my taking extremely strong opiates over a long period for intense pain relief).
One OOB occurred when I was on a train (the only occasion when I appeared to 'see my body'). I was in the toilet when the train jolted into motion, and I appeared to see myself collapsing onto the wash-basin and then to the floor. I had a number of strange experiences during my teens when I found myself apparently floating out of the window of my childhood home, through a landscape akin to the actual one, but different in a number of aspects. I suspect these were self-induced.

To be honest, Dicky, I don't believe that dreams "mean" anything. They are just the brain free-wheeling when our normal senses are switched off, as in sleep or unconsciousness.

We humans seem to want to find "meanings/causes" for everything, and often resort to fantasy to satisfy that need.

[Udayana]

It's not clear what nonsense you're referring to Please enlighten me?

ippy

"The current thinking is that dreaming is the brain dumping the detritus it gathers during its wakeful hours."

[ippy]

"The current thinking is that dreaming is the brain dumping the detritus it gathers during its wakeful hours."

It could well be, I don't know, all I do know it was the thinking, so I was told, at that time by someone that is well qualified, and well qualified in that area, it's up to you, please yourself.

ippy 

[BashfulAnthony]

"The current thinking is that dreaming is the brain dumping the detritus it gathers during its wakeful hours."

Indeed, and that's why so many atheists are so busy dreaming:  lots of detritus to shed!