Coincidences

[Sriram]

Hi everyone,

Here is an article of today from CNN about 'Synchronicity'.

http://us.cnn.com/2015/12/29/us/odd-coincidences-synchronicity-the-other-side/index.html

******************

Royce Burton was teaching history at a New Jersey university when he decided to tell his class about a frightening experience he had as a young man.

He was a Texas Ranger, patrolling the Rio Grande in 1940, when he got lost in a canyon after dark. He tried to climb out but lost his balance just as he neared the top of a cliff. Suddenly Joe, a fellow Ranger, appeared and hoisted him up to safety with his rifle strap. Burton thanked Joe for saving his life but lost contact with him after both men enlisted in the military during World War II.

Burton was in the middle of sharing his story when an elderly man appeared in the doorway. It was Joe, the fellow Ranger. He had tracked Burton down 25 years later and walked into his classroom at precisely the moment Burton was recounting his rescue.

"I'll have Joe finish the rest of the story," Burton said, without missing a beat as the astonished classroom witnessed the two men's reunion.

You could call Burton's story an amazing coincidence, but James Hollis calls it something else: "synchronicity" -- a meaningful coincidence.

Synchronicity is an odd term, but it's a familiar experience to many people. Someone dreams of a childhood friend he hasn't heard from in years and gets a phone call from that friend the next day. Another person loses his mother and hears her favorite song on the radio on the day of her funeral. Someone facing a terrible personal crisis is the accidental recipient of a book that seems written just for him or her.

"Everybody has stories like that," says Hollis, a Jungian analyst and author who knew Burton and shares his story in the book "Hauntings: Dispelling the Ghosts Who Run Our Lives." "We live in a haunted world where invisible energies are constantly at work."

Hollis, the Jungian analyst, readily concedes some coincidences exist apart from synchronicity. But he says there are other odd coincidences that go beyond mathematical possibility. You just can't explain them away. He says these strange stories reveal "the spectral presence" of some kind of energy that deliberately infiltrates people's daily lives.

Try to explain why these coincidences occur, and few agree. Even Jung struggled to grasp the implication of synchronicity -- some say he had at least three different definitions of it, and his followers disagreed about its meaning.

Says Williams, the disbeliever: "I don't think anyone has had a bead on the absolute truth."

So what are we left with? Puzzling stories of falling babies, plum pudding and odd coincidences that can shape people's lives -- and even haunt them.

******************

Cheers.

Sriram

[Bubbles]

I like this story about Jung in this article on it

And the one about the plum pudding below it is intriguing 

🌹

Because our scientific worldview is built on the concept of cause and effect, as a culture we tend to doubt and deny aspects of experience that aren’t measurable and verifiable. So often when events coincide in startling ways, the first words we hear or say are, “Oh, it’s just a coincidence.”

Some people might think of it in terms of the odds. If there is a one-in-a-million chance of that coincidence happening, why make such a big deal of it? After all, somebody has to win the lottery! This point of view has a certain validity: synchronicity is part and parcel of physical laws. It doesn’t defy the natural order of events; it simply raises more questions than can easily be answered by a cause-and-effect equation.

The concept that everything has a concrete cause is so entrenched in our modern Western mentality that it took considerable courage for Carl Jung to take on the subject of synchronicity. He didn’t discuss it in depth until the eighth decade of his life when, as he wrote in his preface to the I Ching, “The changing opinions of men scarcely impress me anymore.” A dramatic incident clarified his thinking on the matter. He had been looking for some way to break through to a patient who was super-rational, had rigid, stock answers for everything, and therefore was not doing well in therapy. He writes, “I was sitting opposite her one day with my back to the window, listening to her flow of rhetoric. She had an impressive dream the night before, in which someone had given her a golden scarab—a costly piece of jewelry. While she was still telling me this dream, I heard something behind me gently tapping on the window. I turned around and saw that it was a fairly large flying insect that was knocking against the windowpane from outside in the obvious effort to get into the dark room. This seemed to me very strange. I opened the window immediately and caught the insect in the air as it flew in. It was a scarabaeid beetle, whose gold-green color most nearly resembles that of a golden scarab. I handed the beetle to my patient with the words, ‘Here is your scarab.’ The experience punctured the desired hole in her rationalism and broke the ice of her intellectual resistance.” On the basis of his work with his patients, Jung said that synchronicity is more likely to occur when we are in a highly charged state of emotional and mental awareness—when, in his words, the “archetypes,” universal images or themes underlying human behavior, are activated.

Before Jung, Austrian biologist Paul Kammerer documented another type of coincidence that he called seriality, in which things repeat themselves across time. He wrote of a case involving a Mr. Deschamps who, as a boy in Orleans, France, was presented with a piece of plum pudding by a guest of the family, Mr. de Fortgibu. Years later, Mr. Deschamps, now a young man, ordered plum pudding in a Paris restaurant, only to find that the last piece had just been taken—by Mr. de Fortgibu, who was sitting across the room. Many years later, at a dinner party where Mr. Deschamps was again offered plum pudding, he regaled his guests with the story and remarked that all that was missing was Mr. de Fortgibu. Soon the door burst open and in came Mr. de Fortgibu himself, now a disoriented old man who had gotten the wrong address and had entered by mistake.

When we talk about synchronicity within the book, we base it on Jung’s definition—

Synchronicity is the coming together of inner and outer events in a way that cannot be explained by cause and effect and that is meaningful to the observer.

—And we include in our discussions Kammerer’s recognition of seriality as a form of meaningful coincidence, which, while not considered by Jung, is encountered in such events as the significant repetition of songs, numbers, and phrases.

 

http://www.flowpower.com/understanding_synchronicity.htm

[Leonard James]

Sriram and Rose,

Don't take any of it too seriously! The human mind loves to romanticise  its existence, and stories like this (and religious stories) are much more romantic than believing that the universe/life is nothing more than the result of the properties of matter. 

[ekim]

Sriram and Rose
".... believing that the universe/life is nothing more than the result of the properties of matter."
Don't take this too seriously, it's only a belief of the dead playing with the dead.  Unless you become as a little child again ....... 

[bluehillside Retd.]

Sriram,

But he says there are other odd coincidences that go beyond mathematical possibility. You just can't explain them away. He says these strange stories reveal "the spectral presence" of some kind of energy that deliberately infiltrates people's daily lives.

Oh dear. What on earth would "go beyond mathematical possibility" even mean?

Fantastically unlikely things happen all the time - randomly deal out a standard pack of playing cards and the chances of the sequence you get is 52! (52 factorial, or one in 80658175170943878571660636856403766975289505440883277824000000000000, an astonishingly huge number}.

Sometimes we find things in our lives that we then retro-fit to these co-incidences, and then we fool ourselves that there must be some kind of ghost in the machine at work. When you dream about Aunt Nellie and she calls you the very next day, the more pertinent fact is to ask how many times you dreamed of people who did not call the next day.

CNN or not, there's some really poor thinking in the article.

[Leonard James]

Sriram and Rose
".... believing that the universe/life is nothing more than the result of the properties of matter."
Don't take this too seriously, it's only a belief of the dead playing with the dead.  Unless you become as a little child again ....... 

When I became a man, I put away the childish illusions that had been fed me by my parents and culture, and began to reason for myself.

It was  like being born again! 

[ekim]

When I became a man, I put away the childish illusions that had been fed me by my parents and culture, and began to reason for myself.

It was  like being born again! 

Wow, it took that long?!  I suppose that's nothing compared to the time it takes to put away the adult illusions fed to us by the reasoning rationalists to keep us more robot like. 

[Udayana]

"synchronicity" -- a meaningful coincidence.

But how can you get the "meaning" out of the coincidence? What does it mean that Joe walked in just as Burton was retelling the story? What does it mean that de Fortgibu may appear to be entangled with Deschamps  desire for plum pudding?

How do you get from events to something "meaningful"? If there are any unknown agents at work causing this, their activities seem irrational.

[Bubbles]

But how can you get the "meaning" out of the coincidence? What does it mean that Joe walked in just as Burton was retelling the story? What does it mean that de Fortgibu may appear to be entangled with Deschamps  desire for plum pudding?

How do you get from events to something "meaningful"? If there are any unknown agents at work causing this, their activities seem irrational.

Or something has a sense of humour 

[Leonard James]

Wow, it took that long?!  I suppose that's nothing compared to the time it takes to put away the adult illusions fed to us by the reasoning rationalists to keep us more robot like. 

It is unwise to adopt the opinions of anybody if you are able to work things out for yourself.

[Sriram]

Hi everyone,

To begin with, it is important that we stop labeling everything non material (or non sensory) as something supernatural or related to religion and God.   This misconception is the root of many problems.

Lots of things can and probably do exist that we cannot sense with our normal senses and  which are difficult to imagine or fit into our so called 'logic'.

Dark Energy and Dark Matter are believed to exist all around us but which we can only know through some odd occurrences and not in our day to day life.  Even the normal magnetic field of the earth cannot be sensed in our day to day lives though it is all around us.  Only through some special means can we identify it.

Similarly, certain other fields and forces (such as the biofield for example) can and do exist that pervade everywhere and connect all living beings.  Science just hasn't got there yet. That is all.

These common fields can influence our lives and connect seemingly unconnected people and events together. Synchronicity, telepathy, sudden cures of illnesses and so on can happen through such common fields.  It is natural and not supernatural.

It'll probably take a few more generations for all this to come out of the 'woo'  category that it has been relegated to by our  science folks.

Cheers.

Sriram

[Leonard James]

Hi Sriram,

If there is scientific evidence for the existence of something as yet unknown, then science will eventually find the explanation for it.

If there is no scientific evidence for a claimed phenomena, then that phenomena can only be imaginary.

[trippymonkey]

LJ
Are you assuming cos we don't know of it NOW, it doesn't exist??
WELL ??!?! THAT opens a nice BIG bag of worms eh, considering what we've learned to understand over the millenia Those things we either never knew about or knew of but didn't 'get'

Nick

[Hope]

LJ
Are you assuming cos we don't know of it NOW, it doesn't exist??
WELL ??!?! THAT opens a nice BIG bag of worms eh, considering what we've learned to understand over the millenia Those things we either never knew about or knew of but didn't 'get'

Nick

Precisely, Nick.  I'm afraid that Len and a few others sometimes make this kind of illogical statement.

[Red Giant]

But think of all the coincidences that don't happen.  I've lost count of how many times I've ordered plum pudding and nothing interesting has happened at all.

[bluehillside Retd.]

Sriram,

To begin with, it is important that we stop labeling everything non material (or non sensory) as something supernatural or related to religion and God.   This misconception is the root of many problems.

Lots of things can and probably do exist that we cannot sense with our normal senses and  which are difficult to imagine or fit into our so called 'logic'.

Dark Energy and Dark Matter are believed to exist all around us but which we can only know through some odd occurrences and not in our day to day life.  Even the normal magnetic field of the earth cannot be sensed in our day to day lives though it is all around us.  Only through some special means can we identify it.

Similarly, certain other fields and forces (such as the biofield for example) can and do exist that pervade everywhere and connect all living beings.  Science just hasn't got there yet. That is all.

These common fields can influence our lives and connect seemingly unconnected people and events together. Synchronicity, telepathy, sudden cures of illnesses and so on can happen through such common fields.  It is natural and not supernatural.

It'll probably take a few more generations for all this to come out of the 'woo'  category that it has been relegated to by our  science folks.

Here’s where you’ve gone wrong. First, you correctly note that “science” doesn’t know everything – nothing startling there as science makes no such claim, which is why people continue to do it.

Second though you posit a phenomenon – the “biosphere” – and claim that it exists, only science hasn’t caught up with it yet. How would you know that it exists? What data have you gathered? What experiments have you undertaken? What falsifiability test if there? What peer review has occurred?

See, here’s the thing: you can’t just claim as fact stuff you personally know but science hasn’t got around to yet. Either scientists have looked at the claim and found it wanting, or there’s not enough evidence so there’s nothing to investigate using the tools of science. At best all you have is a speculation or a conjecture, but that’s all you have. Just pointing at things that weren’t known before and are known now as some sort of guarantee that other conjectures will necessarily be proven in due course is poor reasoning.

[bluehillside Retd.]

trippy,

Are you assuming cos we don't know of it NOW, it doesn't exist??
WELL ??!?! THAT opens a nice BIG bag of worms eh, considering what we've learned to understand over the millenia Those things we either never knew about or knew of but didn't 'get'

That's not what Len said. Try reading his post again.

[bluehillside Retd.]

Hope.

Precisely, Nick.  I'm afraid that Len and a few others sometimes make this kind of illogical statement.

Wrong - read my last two posts and Len's post properly to see why. Something isn't a fact just because someone thinks it's a fact. Facts need validating with methods to be facts at all, and if not with the methods of science then with methods of some kind at least.

[Leonard James]

LJ
Are you assuming cos we don't know of it NOW, it doesn't exist??

Of course not ... I'm not stupid! When science finds evidence for something we didn't previously know about, it will try to find out what that 'something' is.

My beef is with people who claim something exists without the slightest scientifically testable evidence for it. They seem to think that 'feelings' are evidence.

[Leonard James]

trippy,

That's not what Len said. Try reading his post again.

It's a common fault of believers. They read things that aren't there and then criticise them. Whether it's deliberate or just carelessness I leave you to decide. 

[Shaker]

It's a common fault of believers. They read things that aren't there and then criticise them. Whether it's deliberate or just carelessness I leave you to decide. 

If I had a fiver for every time I've seen that ...

[jeremyp]

Hi everyone,

To begin with, it is important that we stop labeling everything non material (or non sensory) as something supernatural or related to religion and God.   This misconception is the root of many problems.

What should we label it then?

Lots of things can and probably do exist that we cannot sense with our normal senses and  which are difficult to imagine or fit into our so called 'logic'.

Of course, but if they are real, we can build instruments to helps detect them. If you can't detect something through your senses or technological enhancements to those senses, what's the point of pretending it is real?

Also, no need to put "logic" in scare quotes.

Dark Energy and Dark Matter are believed to exist all around us but which we can only know through some odd occurrences and not in our day to day life.  Even the normal magnetic field of the earth cannot be sensed in our day to day lives though it is all around us.  Only through some special means can we identify it.

But we can detect these phenomena.

Similarly, certain other fields and forces (such as the biofield for example) can and do exist that pervade everywhere and connect all living beings.  Science just hasn't got there yet. That is all.

But we can't detect these phenomena.

It'll probably take a few more generations for all this to come out of the 'woo'  category that it has been relegated to by our  science folks.

Nope. some things will be forever woo, on the grounds that they are imaginary.

[ippy]

Hi Sriram,

If there is scientific evidence for the existence of something as yet unknown, then science will eventually find the explanation for it.

If there is no scientific evidence for a claimed phenomena, then that phenomena can only be imaginary.

Try Jim Al-Khalili's lecture, on "Ted", about how Robins know how to fly south.

I think this is a marvelous example of the strength of science, compared to the silly religious approach to life.

I think this short lecture of good old Jim the, I think now, the ex President, of the BHA, it underlines the comment of yours in this post of yours.

ippy

[jeremyp]

Try Jim Al-Khalili's lecture, on "Ted", about how Robins know how to fly south.

I think this is a marvelous example of the strength of science, compared to the silly religious approach to life.

I think this short lecture of good old Jim the, I think now, the ex President, of the BHA, it underlines the comment of yours in this post of yours.

ippy

I thought robins didn't migrate.

[ekim]

The British birds don't but the European robins do.