But they are our murderous thugs

[Nearly Sane]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/saudi-arabia-executions-philip-hammond-condemned-by-rights-campaigners-for-excusing-mass-killings-a6802641.html

[jakswan]

Diplomacy is crazy, got to keep the Saudi regime happy if that place goes pop then it'll make IS look quite moderate.

[Nearly Sane]

Diplomacy is crazy, got to keep the Saudi regime happy if that place goes pop then it'll make IS look quite moderate.

Which is fine as long as we never then cite a moral reason for doing anything.

ETA actually scrub that last bit, it's incorrect. We can continue to argue for some form of situational Felicific Calculus approach but in doing so we need to not cite absolute morals against others.

The problem with the we would get something worse than IS argument is that it is to an extent our support for SA and the regime that has got us IS in the first place.

[ad_orientem]

Which is fine as long as we never then cite a moral reason for doing anything.

ETA actually scrub that last bit, it's incorrect. We can continue to argue for some form of situational Felicific Calculus approach but in doing so we need to not cite absolute morals against others.

The problem with the we would get something worse than IS argument is that it is to an extent our support for SA and the regime that has got us IS in the first place.

I agree. We shouldn't be dealing with the Saudis. Neither should we be dealing with the US, Israel or Turkey. They're all behind the scenes pulling the strings.

[Owlswing]

I agree. We shouldn't be dealing with the Saudis. Neither should we be dealing with the US, Israel or Turkey. They're all behind the scenes pulling the strings.

Whiuch "we"?

England/UK or Finland?

[Nearly Sane]

I agree. We shouldn't be dealing with the Saudis. Neither should we be dealing with the US, Israel or Turkey. They're all behind the scenes pulling the strings.

Ah the Jewish capitalist Wahabist conspiracy.

[ad_orientem]

Ah the Jewish capitalist Wahabist conspiracy.

Something like that.

[jakswan]

Which is fine as long as we never then cite a moral reason for doing anything.

ETA actually scrub that last bit, it's incorrect. We can continue to argue for some form of situational Felicific Calculus approach but in doing so we need to not cite absolute morals against others.

The problem with the we would get something worse than IS argument is that it is to an extent our support for SA and the regime that has got us IS in the first place.

Not saying I agree with it, pretty clear Western foreign policy is 'if they are not a threat let em be'.

[Nearly Sane]

Not saying I agree with it, pretty clear Western foreign policy is 'if they are not a threat let em be'.

Saddam wasn't a threat, neither was Afghanistan, and Al Qaeda and IS aren't significant ones but the extent that they are threats are because of places like SA

[Owlswing]

Something like that.

You really do not recognise when you are having the urine extracted do you?

[ad_orientem]

You really do not recognise when you are having the urine extracted do you?

I saw it but I was dead serious. Behind ISIS is the CIA and Mossad. This has been covered up by the western media.

[jakswan]

Saddam wasn't a threat, neither was Afghanistan, and Al Qaeda and IS aren't significant ones but the extent that they are threats are because of places like SA

I agree but the powers that be have to have a war now and then for their ego.

[Hope]

I saw it but I was dead serious. Behind ISIS is the CIA and Mossad. This has been covered up by the western media.

^{Citations required.}

[Owlswing]

I saw it but I was dead serious. Behind ISIS is the CIA and Mossad. This has been covered up by the western media.

You, Sir, have just made yourself a total laughing stock - even to the most die-hard conspiracy theorists!

If it were not for the fact that the Mods are trying to reduvce the amount of insults posted on here I would describe you more accurately!

IDIOT will do for now! The idea of Mossad supporting a murderous Islamic body is about as likely as Kim Jon-Un and Donald Trump being the bastard sons of Mother Teresa!

[ad_orientem]

Just try non-western media sources. RT is a good one. Anomymous has also digged up the dirt on the US and Israel.

[ad_orientem]

You, Sir, have just made yourself a total laughing stock - even to the most die-hard conspiracy theorists!

If it were not for the fact that the Mods are trying to reduvce the amount of insults posted on here I would describe you more accurately!

IDIOT will do for now! The idea of Mossad supporting a murderous Islamic body is about as likely as Kim Jon-Un and Donald Trump being the bastard sons of Mother Teresa!

You're the idiot. It's in Israel's interests to have a destabilised region. It takes the heat off them and they can go on building their greater Israel at the expense of the Palestinians.

[Owlswing]

You're the idiot. It's in Israel's interests to have a destabilised region. It takes the heat off them and they can go on building their greater Israel at the expense of the Palestinians.

NURSE - he's out of bed again!

[ad_orientem]

NURSE - he's out of bed again!

You shouldn't blindly trust the western mainstream media. It is easily manipulated by the powers. Try occasionally looking to alternative sources.

http://www.trueactivist.com/this-is-huge-evidence-builds-linking-israel-turkey-to-isis/

[Bubbles]

Saddam wasn't a threat, neither was Afghanistan, and Al Qaeda and IS aren't significant ones but the extent that they are threats are because of places like SA

IS sound like a threat to me, their last video said they were going to invade the UK and introduce their brand of sharia law. Given that there appear to be about a few hundred of their supporters living here, and people are still being arrested for planning suicide bombings, I find that very threatening.

[Rhiannon]

IS sound like a threat to me, their last video said they were going to invade the UK and introduce their brand of sharia law. Given that there appear to be about a few hundred of their supporters living here, and people are still being arrested for planning suicide bombings, I find that very threatening.

They are a threat insofar as they are likely to carry out terrorist attacks. But they aren't going to take over the country.

[Bubbles]

They are a threat insofar as they are likely to carry out terrorist attacks. But they aren't going to take over the country.

I sincerely hope not!

IMO they are pretty stupid to make such claims.

I guess they want a fight.

[Rhiannon]

I sincerely hope not!

IMO they are pretty stupid to make such claims.

I guess they want a fight.

They want to scare us.

[Owlswing]

You shouldn't blindly trust the western mainstream media. It is easily manipulated by the powers. Try occasionally looking to alternative sources.

http://www.trueactivist.com/this-is-huge-evidence-builds-linking-israel-turkey-to-isis/

You mean Conspiracy Theorist or (worldwide) Anti-Establishment sources.

[Owlswing]

They want to scare us.

That is why they are called "terrorists"!

[Hope]

You shouldn't blindly trust the western mainstream media. It is easily manipulated by the powers. Try occasionally looking to alternative sources.

http://www.trueactivist.com/this-is-huge-evidence-builds-linking-israel-turkey-to-isis/

And how trustworthy is this group, ad_o?  Do they have a track record of confirmed and well-evidenced and supported claims?  I ask as I've never heard of them.

I notice that, as soon as I open their site, I get interesting and somewhat suspicious adverts springing up all over the place.  Don't generally deem that kind of site as in any way trustworthy.