Author Topic: FLDS  (Read 8625 times)

Sriram

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FLDS
« on: February 26, 2016, 01:02:57 PM »
Hi everyone,

Here is an article from CNN about FLDS and Willie Jessop who has changed sides and is now the prime witness for the prosecution.

http://us.cnn.com/2016/02/25/us/jessop-flds-warren-jeffs-short-creek/index.html

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As "Thug Willie," he defended his prophet with pit-bull ferocity. But by the time we meet in a fourth-floor hallway at the Sandra Day O'Connor federal courthouse, Willie Jessop has changed sides. He's the star government witness, testifying on behalf of outsiders he once considered his enemies.

He carries himself like a man determined to unburden his conscience even if it means turning against everyone and everything he once believed in.

Jessop spent more than a decade as security chief and spokesman for the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, a polygamous sect that split from the mainstream Mormon church at the turn of the last century. As head of the "God Squad," he was perhaps the highest profile FLDS member -- with the exception of its prophet, Warren Jeffs.

At the civil trial, expected to go to the jury next week, the government is alleging that the FLDS runs Jessop's hometown like a theocracy, controlling virtually every aspect of life in Hildale, Utah, and its neighbor, Colorado City, Arizona.

Jessop's split from his church began in 2011 when authorities in Texas slipped him an audiotape of Jeffs sexually assaulting a 12-year-old girl in an FLDS temple.

The tape brought Jessop's world crashing down. He could no longer brush aside the investigations and sex charges as evidence of the government's religious persecution. He couldn't heed or protect a spiritual leader he considers a pervert. So he spoke out.

"People feel betrayed that their marriage was based on a fraud," Jessop says. "Here is somebody who says he speaks for God, and you find out he didn't. How do you deal with that?"

Many people leave with a heavy feeling of betrayal, Jessop says. "They're asking, 'Why did God let this guy do this to us? We trusted God.' Well, no we didn't. We trusted Warren."

Over the years, as men left or were driven off, women and children routinely were shuffled around.

"They've lost their identity; Warren Jeffs took away even their identity," Jessop says. "Do you go by your mother's name, your father's name, your church name? Who are you?"

"This indictment is not about religion," said U.S. Attorney John Huber in Salt Lake. "This indictment is about fraud."

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For information

Cheers.

Sriram

Leonard James

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Re: FLDS
« Reply #1 on: February 26, 2016, 01:11:56 PM »
So what's new? Pretty well all religions are a fraud.

2Corrie

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Re: FLDS
« Reply #2 on: February 26, 2016, 01:53:41 PM »
Why is this even on the Christian thread  :o anyone here break bread with the Mormons ?
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Brownie

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Re: FLDS
« Reply #3 on: February 26, 2016, 01:56:55 PM »
I agree that there is nothing new about this, they are a horrible lot!
I can't help feeling a bit sorry for the mainstream LDS church who seem to be decent people but tend to be lumped together, in the minds of the ignorant at least, with the polygamous breakaway sects.

Just seen 2Corrie's post.  The LDS do consider themselves to be a Christian group Corrie though I know many other Christians don't think so (my opinion: I don't know or particularly care).  If enough posters feel strongly enough I suppose this thread could be moved to the Religion and Ethics bit.  I'm happy enough for it to stay here.
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Khatru

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Re: FLDS
« Reply #4 on: February 26, 2016, 02:16:39 PM »
He probably wasn't wearing his magic underwear.
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SweetPea

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Re: FLDS
« Reply #5 on: February 26, 2016, 02:53:30 PM »
Sad, reading this stuff, Sriram. Such sects are so lost.... and a million miles away from the teaching and Truth of Yeshua.
For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power and of love and of a sound mind ~ 2 Timothy 1:7

Shaker

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Re: FLDS
« Reply #6 on: February 26, 2016, 02:59:42 PM »
Sad, reading this stuff, Sriram. Such sects are so lost.... and a million miles away from the teaching and Truth of Yeshua.
But of course they say exactly the same about you.
Pain, or damage, don't end the world. Or despair, or fucking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man, and give some back. - Al Swearengen, Deadwood.

Brownie

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Re: FLDS
« Reply #7 on: February 26, 2016, 03:10:21 PM »
Mormons do not believe that everyone else will be damned.  That may have been taught at one time but certainly isn't part of their teaching now.
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Leonard James

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Re: FLDS
« Reply #8 on: February 26, 2016, 03:12:19 PM »
Why is this even on the Christian thread  :o anyone here break bread with the Mormons ?

Like it or not, Corrie, they are as much Christians as you are. They follow their interpretation of what the Bible teaches just as you do. You Christians are a motley crew!  :)

SweetPea

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Re: FLDS
« Reply #9 on: February 26, 2016, 03:15:50 PM »
But of course they say exactly the same about you.

Knew I shouldn't have come on 'ere.... I'm in 'nap' mode!
For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power and of love and of a sound mind ~ 2 Timothy 1:7

Rhiannon

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Re: FLDS
« Reply #10 on: February 26, 2016, 04:36:55 PM »
Knew I shouldn't have come on 'ere.... I'm in 'nap' mode!

It's true though, SP.

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Re: FLDS
« Reply #11 on: February 26, 2016, 05:20:44 PM »
Like it or not, Corrie, they are as much Christians as you are. They follow their interpretation of what the Bible teaches just as you do. You Christians are a motley crew!  :)
Actually, Len, they don't follow "their interpretation of what the Bible teaches just as you do".  They follow ther interpretation of the Book of Mormon which, save for mentioning Jesus at a couple of points, is as close to the BhavadGita as it is the Bible.
Are your, or your friends'/relatives', garages, lofts or sheds full of unused DIY gear, sewing/knitting machines or fabric and haberdashery stuff?

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Leonard James

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Re: FLDS
« Reply #12 on: February 26, 2016, 05:52:27 PM »
Actually, Len, they don't follow "their interpretation of what the Bible teaches just as you do".  They follow ther interpretation of the Book of Mormon which, save for mentioning Jesus at a couple of points, is as close to the BhavadGita as it is the Bible.

Look here :-

https://www.mormon.org/what-do-mormons-believe

This plainly states that they follow the teachings of Jesus Christ, and therefore they are Christians.

Shaker

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Re: FLDS
« Reply #13 on: February 26, 2016, 05:57:21 PM »
Actually, Len, they don't follow "their interpretation of what the Bible teaches just as you do".  They follow ther interpretation of the Book of Mormon which, save for mentioning Jesus at a couple of points, is as close to the BhavadGita as it is the Bible.
Couple of points?

The number of references to Jesus clocks in at a little under 4,000. I'd love to know how many references there are to Jesus in the Bhagavad Gita [sic]. Given that the Gita was composed between two and five centuries before the alleged era of Jesus none would be a fair bet, but then, there's always the retro-fitting of prophecy, isn't there? ::)

They regard themselves as Christians believing in/following a Christian religion. That you don't recognise them as such is an irrelevance - they doubtless say about you what you say about them. That's Christianity for you - the one true faith of thirty-odd thousand denominations based on a story its alleged central figure couldn't get straight.

Pretty shoddy work for the so-called Almighty, I'd say - two thousand years of witless No True Scotsmanism. Poor show.
« Last Edit: February 26, 2016, 06:31:21 PM by Shaker »
Pain, or damage, don't end the world. Or despair, or fucking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man, and give some back. - Al Swearengen, Deadwood.

2Corrie

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Re: FLDS
« Reply #14 on: February 26, 2016, 06:26:07 PM »
The True Scotsman are known by the Lord  ;D
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Shaker

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Re: FLDS
« Reply #15 on: February 26, 2016, 06:27:25 PM »
The True Scotsman are known by the Lord  ;D
But that's what they all say, sunshine ;)

That's why religion - not universally; monotheism has always been the worst offender - has been one long round of "No, I'm Spartacus", only with even more swords than the film. And a far greater willingness to use them.
« Last Edit: February 26, 2016, 06:39:31 PM by Shaker »
Pain, or damage, don't end the world. Or despair, or fucking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man, and give some back. - Al Swearengen, Deadwood.

2Corrie

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Re: FLDS
« Reply #16 on: February 26, 2016, 06:28:31 PM »
I agree that there is nothing new about this, they are a horrible lot!
I can't help feeling a bit sorry for the mainstream LDS church who seem to be decent people but tend to be lumped together, in the minds of the ignorant at least, with the polygamous breakaway sects.

Just seen 2Corrie's post.  The LDS do consider themselves to be a Christian group Corrie though I know many other Christians don't think so (my opinion: I don't know or particularly care).  If enough posters feel strongly enough I suppose this thread could be moved to the Religion and Ethics bit.  I'm happy enough for it to stay here.

why don't you care? Aren't we to contend for the faith  :(
"It is finished."

Bubbles

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Re: FLDS
« Reply #17 on: February 26, 2016, 06:47:20 PM »
Why is this even on the Christian thread  :o anyone here break bread with the Mormons ?

Jesus probably would have.

He did things like that ;

The equivalent in his day, was the Samaritans.

 ;D

Gordon

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Re: FLDS
« Reply #18 on: February 26, 2016, 07:04:16 PM »
The True Scotsman are known by the Lord  ;D

Not this one!

Brownie

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Re: FLDS
« Reply #19 on: February 26, 2016, 07:58:14 PM »
why don't you care? Aren't we to contend for the faith  :(

I didn't say that I don't care about anything, I do not care about whether or not the LDS are true Christians.  There's no point, imho.
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Shaker

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Re: FLDS
« Reply #20 on: February 26, 2016, 08:38:16 PM »
A bit more working together for the common good, and a lot less wibble about real believers v. false ones and one-true-wayism, and we'd have been living in a different world these past couple of millennia.
Pain, or damage, don't end the world. Or despair, or fucking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man, and give some back. - Al Swearengen, Deadwood.

Bubbles

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Re: FLDS
« Reply #21 on: February 26, 2016, 08:41:40 PM »
I didn't say that I don't care about anything, I do not care about whether or not the LDS are true Christians.  There's no point, imho.

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Brownie

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Re: FLDS
« Reply #22 on: February 26, 2016, 10:29:00 PM »
Thanks Rose.  I'll put them in water before I go to bed.
Let us profit by what every day and hour teaches us

Leonard James

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Re: FLDS
« Reply #23 on: February 27, 2016, 06:00:24 AM »
Christians, collectively, do more harm to Christianity than atheists can ever do.

floo

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Re: FLDS
« Reply #24 on: February 27, 2016, 08:47:02 AM »
Sad, reading this stuff, Sriram. Such sects are so lost.... and a million miles away from the teaching and Truth of Yeshua.

There is NO evidence that any dogma, doctrine, sect or cult has the 'truth' including Christianity.