Are sins like homosexuality still condemned in the New Covenant of Christ?

[Sassy]

I am asking this question to see if the believers and all others, believe that homosexuality has an acceptance in the Kingdom of Heaven.


I believe that homosexuality is still a sin against God as it is forbidden for man to lie with another man as he would a woman.
This is about the bible content and nothing to do with personal beliefs and prejudices. So instead of calling people a bigot or anything else. Let us remember this is about the bible take on this matter. Please be free to tell us if you believe the bible still sees this as sin. Tell us and discuss if this a conflict in any church and why you think if a person is a practicing homosexual and a Christian why it is okay to be so.

I think it is a tough subject... So no insults to others let us be adult and discuss what is happening in the Church and world today.

[floo]

I am asking this question to see if the believers and all others, believe that homosexuality has an acceptance in the Kingdom of Heaven.


I believe that homosexuality is still a sin against God as it is forbidden for man to lie with another man as he would a woman.
This is about the bible content and nothing to do with personal beliefs and prejudices. So instead of calling people a bigot or anything else. Let us remember this is about the bible take on this matter. Please be free to tell us if you believe the bible still sees this as sin. Tell us and discuss if this a conflict in any church and why you think if a person is a practicing homosexual and a Christian why it is okay to be so.

I think it is a tough subject... So no insults to others let us be adult and discuss what is happening in the Church and world today.

Only a sick bigot believes there is anything wrong with homosexuality, as I have said many times before. If god exists and is such an evil bigot ALL humanity should be condemning it, not using the Bible as an excuse for their own bigotry.

[Sassy]

Only a sick bigot believes there is anything wrong with homosexuality, as I have said many times before. If god exists and is such an evil bigot ALL humanity should be condemning it, not using the Bible as an excuse for their own bigotry.

We are NOT DISCUSSING THE RIGHT OR WRONG OF HOMOSEXUALITY.
If you cannot stick to the discussion regarding just the question then don't post.

I am asking this question to see if the believers and all others, believe that homosexuality has an acceptance in the Kingdom of Heaven.


I believe that homosexuality is still a sin against God as it is forbidden for man to lie with another man as he would a woman.
This is about the bible content and nothing to do with personal beliefs and prejudices. So instead of calling people a bigot or anything else. Let us remember this is about the bible take on this matter. Please be free to tell us if you believe the bible still sees this as sin. Tell us and discuss if this a conflict in any church and why you think if a person is a practicing homosexual and a Christian why it is okay to be so.

I think it is a tough subject... So no insults to others let us be adult and discuss what is happening in the Church and world today.

It is clear that this is about the BIBLE and God. Not a platform for people with their own agenda like yourself Floo.

Either discuss the matter concerning the bible and God alone or don't post. I am reporting your post because I specifically asked people not to do what you did.

[Sassy]

I am asking this question to see if the believers and all others, believe that homosexuality has an acceptance in the Kingdom of Heaven.


I believe that homosexuality is still a sin against God as it is forbidden for man to lie with another man as he would a woman.
This is about the bible content and nothing to do with personal beliefs and prejudices. So instead of calling people a bigot or anything else. Let us remember this is about the bible take on this matter. Please be free to tell us if you believe the bible still sees this as sin. Tell us and discuss if this a conflict in any church and why you think if a person is a practicing homosexual and a Christian why it is okay to be so.

I think it is a tough subject... So no insults to others let us be adult and discuss what is happening in the Church and world today.

Would you please reply and give us your understanding on this matter without prejudice please. Thanks.

I really and sincerely want to know what people believe about this matter.  I feel that we should be able to discuss the matter as adults and see the thread for what it really is. Asking the questions that need to be asked to understand where it all came from and if it changed, how and when.

[Gordon]

Either discuss the matter concerning the bible and God alone or don't post. I am reporting your post because I specifically asked people not to do what you did.

Moderator:

If you wanted to limit this thread to theological points, Sass, then it should have been posted in the Faith Sharing Area. As it stands, in this Board, you aren't free to prescribe how members must respond where they do engage with or challenge your OP.

[Stranger]

I believe that homosexuality is still a sin against God as it is forbidden for man to lie with another man as he would a woman.
This is about the bible content and nothing to do with personal beliefs and prejudices. So instead of calling people a bigot or anything else. Let us remember this is about the bible take on this matter. Please be free to tell us if you believe the bible still sees this as sin.

Dunno, do you think Numbers 5:11-31 is still a good way to test for infidelity...?

[Sebastian Toe]

I am asking this question to see if the believers and all others, believe that homosexuality has an acceptance in the Kingdom of Heaven.


I believe that homosexuality is still a sin against God as it is forbidden for man to lie with another man as he would a woman.
This is about the bible content and nothing to do with personal beliefs and prejudices. So instead of calling people a bigot or anything else. Let us remember this is about the bible take on this matter. Please be free to tell us if you believe the bible still sees this as sin. Tell us and discuss if this a conflict in any church and why you think if a person is a practicing homosexual and a Christian why it is okay to be so.

I think it is a tough subject... So no insults to others let us be adult and discuss what is happening in the Church and world today.

Can I just check some things first please?

What do you mean by;
1. Homosexuality
2. a man to lie with another man as he would a woman
3. practising homosexual

[Sassy]

Dunno, do you think Numbers 5:11-31 is still a good way to test for infidelity...?

Is this related to the subject we are discussing?
Do they still do this today?
This was the covenant of the Israelites. However does infidelity apply today? It does, you can be divorced today as you were then for adultery. But that way was for those people of that covenant. It really is todays covenant with Christ we are discussing.
On par the sin adultery still exists but the punishment there and the punishment of homosexuality therein does not apply here today.

So Stranger what is your view on sins like homosexuality is it stilled condemned in the New Covenant of Christ?
We know adultery is still condemned. So can we have your view on this subject, please.

[Sassy]

Can I just check some things first please?

What do you mean by;
1. Homosexuality
2. a man to lie with another man as he would a woman
3. practising homosexual

Well, I can answer best this way.

Is theft a sin until you actually steal?
So what do you regard as 'homosexuality'?  Is the act of a man lying with a man as a woman an homosexual act?
If two men live together but have no sexual relationship are they practicing homosexuals?

The reason for the thread is to discuss what what is happening today. We have people who are practicing homosexuals and call themselves Christians and believe they are saved in the covenant of Christ.

[Sassy]

Moderator:

If you wanted to limit this thread to theological points, Sass, then it should have been posted in the Faith Sharing Area. As it stands, in this Board, you aren't free to prescribe how members must respond where they do engage with or challenge your OP.

Ethics or moral philosophy is the branch of philosophy that involves systematizing, defending, and recommending concepts of right and wrong conduct. The term ethics derives from the Ancient Greek word ἠθικός ethikos, which is derived from the word ἦθος ethos (habit, "custom").

Can you please explain Gordon why that is... WHY we are not free to ask member to engage only in what is asked in the thread? If you believe another section would prevent posts like Floo made, then please change it to that section.
But make sure you do not allow anyone else to do the same on this section in the future. You would not want to look bias, would you?

[Rhiannon]

I'd like definitions of God and Heaven too.

[Sebastian Toe]

Well, I can answer best this way.

Is theft a sin until you actually steal?
So what do you regard as 'homosexuality'?  Is the act of a man lying with a man as a woman an homosexual act?
If two men live together but have no sexual relationship are they practicing homosexuals?

The reason for the thread is to discuss what what is happening today. We have people who are practicing homosexuals and call themselves Christians and believe they are saved in the covenant of Christ.

I'm confused!

I asked

What do you mean by;
1. Homosexuality

and you reply

So what do you regard as 'homosexuality'?

So my reply therefore is,

Then what do you regard as 'homosexuality'?

[Gordon]

Moderator:

Can you please explain Gordon why that is... WHY we are not free to ask member to engage only in what is asked in the thread?

Because others may quite reasonably respond to your OP raising relevant points even if these aren't what you envisaged or would prefer: it is called debate. We created the FSA to provide a place to discuss faith issues from a faith perspective, but you didn't post this there.

If you believe another section would prevent posts like Floo made, then please change it to that section.

No - by all means re-post your OP there, but I can't move this because the legitimate replies here don't fit the ethos of the FSA and I'm not prepared to simply bin the valid points made by other members (which I'd have to do if I moved this thread to FSA).

But make sure you do not allow anyone else to do the same on this section in the future. You would not want to look bias, would you?

Should I feel I require modding lessons from you, Sass, I'll be sure to ask!

[SusanDoris]

I don't suppose there's any chance of changing the first word of the title to 'Are' is there?! The thing is, Sassy, that the only way I know what the topic title is is by listening to it, and 'Is sins..' does cause a wince every time Synthetic Dave reads it!!!

[floo]

Jesus never condemned homosexuality, and could even have been gay himself. Goodness knows what Sass is on about, even if it was a reasonable question, which I don't believe it is.

[Gonnagle]

Dear Sass,

Because you personally asked.

Matthew 22:36-40

36 “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?”

37 Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. 38 This is the first and greatest commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbour as yourself. 40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”

Matthew 7

7 “Do not judge, or you too will be judged. 2 For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.

3 “Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? 4 How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? 5 You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye.

Gonnagle.

[Sassy]

Moderator:

If you wanted to limit this thread to theological points, Sass, then it should have been posted in the Faith Sharing Area. As it stands, in this Board, you aren't free to prescribe how members must respond where they do engage with or challenge your OP.

As a moderator the fact my opening post contained this statement.

This is about the bible content and nothing to do with personal beliefs and prejudices. So instead of calling people a bigot or anything else. Let us remember this is about the bible take on this matter.

You should have moved the thread there automatically and said that it had been moved to ensure this could be done.
Why haven't you moved it, like you have moved other posters threads to enable them to keep in line with their requests?

It is your job when I request you to move it, that you do it.
Or am I not to be given equal treatment to other members?

[splashscuba]

As a moderator the fact my opening post contained this statement.

This is about the bible content and nothing to do with personal beliefs and prejudices. So instead of calling people a bigot or anything else. Let us remember this is about the bible take on this matter.

You should have moved the thread there automatically and said that it had been moved to ensure this could be done.
Why haven't you moved it, like you have moved other posters threads to enable them to keep in line with their requests?

It is your job when I request you to move it, that you do it.
Or am I not to be given equal treatment to other members?

Isn't this a bit off topic.......

I'll get my coat

[Leonard James]

As a moderator the fact my opening post contained this statement.

This is about the bible content and nothing to do with personal beliefs and prejudices. So instead of calling people a bigot or anything else. Let us remember this is about the bible take on this matter.

You should have moved the thread there automatically and said that it had been moved to ensure this could be done.
Why haven't you moved it, like you have moved other posters threads to enable them to keep in line with their requests?

It is your job when I request you to move it, that you do it.
Or am I not to be given equal treatment to other members?

Ooooh! Big red letters again! Sassy's cross! 

[Sassy]

Dear Sass,

Because you personally asked.

Matthew 22:36-40

36 “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?”

37 Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. 38 This is the first and greatest commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbour as yourself. 40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”

Matthew 7

7 “Do not judge, or you too will be judged. 2 For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.

3 “Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? 4 How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? 5 You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye.

Gonnagle.

Does the misuse of Scripture to misjudge and swerve the question make what the answer should be any less true?
Do you still go to hell for stealing or homosexuality?
No Gonnagle, you used this for your own escape. Will God not know your heart on judgement day?
When Jesus Christ said " Let he who is without sin cast the first stone" he was without sin and by law could cast that stone.
There is a difference between the 'right' to cast a stone and be in a right standing with God. Than to be in a wrong standing with God and cast the first stone.
The question is not about judgement as you full well know. It is about whether Adultery is still a sin whether you cast a stone or not. So is homosexuality still a sin in the covenant of Christ. Can you really obey the covenant of those two commandments and be a Christian?

Well I know you are a people pleaser. I also know you think that you can make up some excuse on judgement day to God, "Like I was trying to LOVE my neighbour" But are you loving your neighbour if you avoid the truth and they go to hell?

Well it is your choice Gonnagle. God and Truth don't change. Would Christ have been a sinner if homosexual and in a homosexual relationship?

Now go lick your wounds because not even you and your contempt for the truth of God can save you from this one.
I love my neighbour and I love all whether gay or straight. So to me that means telling them truth and loving each other whatever we believe about our sexuality and faith.

I do not hurt or harm anyone because of faith or sexuality. But I do love them enough to be honest before God and with them.
Because may be I will be hated for telling the truth. But they know I did it because I love them in the sense or wanting no harm to come to them. If you knew someone was about to fall into a trap would you think it love not to warn them?

I am trying to understand the world today about faith, homosexuality and people who face these difficult times.
The truth is you do no one a service but yourself with your answer.
God is not fooled and you should not act as if he can be.

[Sassy]

Isn't this a bit off topic.......

I'll get my coat

Aren't you a whole continent off topic... just as floos post was....

[Brownie]

People are not going to change their minds on this issue, it seems pointless to start up this thread - I already told Sass that was my opinion.

Having known Sassy for several years I do know very well that she has no personal prejudice, what she believes is Biblical by her interpretation.   She does not believe homosexuals are Hell bound any more than anyone else and has no dislike of anyone on grounds of their sexuality.  In the past I have seen really horrible posts from so called Christians, calling gays ''degenerate'' and goodness knows what else, displaying personal distaste.  Sass is not in that category.

I don't agree with Sassy at all about this, which she knows.   Jesus certainly never mentined the subject and the Old Testament teachings are, in my view, contextual and indicative of the culture at that time.   Had God not wanted there to be homosexuals he would not have created them.   

Everyone knows what I think about it all so I won't say any more.  However if someone has genuine religious objections to gay couples we can't do anything about it and accusing them of bigotry doesn't help.   We end up being equally bigoted.  We can ignore them.   Time will take care of all that, after we have left this life no-one will care about it any more.  Society, secular and religious, is moving that way thank goodness.

On this wet and windy Easter day it does not seem appropriate to me to bring up what is always a contentious subject.   Can't we think about something other than people's sex lives?  We could think about our own or lack of  .

[Sassy]

Ooooh! Big red letters again! Sassy's cross! 

Not cross Leonard, Just sick of the same old, same old bang wagon jumpers who want it to make it their own personal orange box stage bit, trying to make themselves look good.
I personally have no hang ups towards anyone who is homosexual in anyway.

My reason for this thread is because I care about those homosexuals who are members of a Church and that they do understand the truth of what the covenant of Christ really is.
I feel sometimes people are deceiving themselves and others just to stop rocking the boat.
I know most people here are not hung up as Christians or homosexuals on such things as the Church and homosexuality.
But you probably more than others that it is not a personal interested in that I have no prejudice.
But I do believe we cannot allow people to go to hell because someone ignores the truth.

I wanted this to be a sensible discussion not about homosexuality itself and right or wrong.
But about Christ, homosexuality and Christianity from biblical point of view.
You could be really helpful to this thread.
Do you believe you can have a true faith and be homosexual in Christ?
Your comments would be helpful on how you see homosexuality and the New Covenant of Christ.

Cheers

[Leonard James]

Does the misuse of Scripture to misjudge and swerve the question make what the answer should be any less true?
Do you still go to hell for stealing or homosexuality?
No Gonnagle, you used this for your own escape. Will God not know your heart on judgement day?
When Jesus Christ said " Let he who is without sin cast the first stone" he was without sin and by law could cast that stone.
There is a difference between the 'right' to cast a stone and be in a right standing with God. Than to be in a wrong standing with God and cast the first stone.
The question is not about judgement as you full well know. It is about whether Adultery is still a sin whether you cast a stone or not. So is homosexuality still a sin in the covenant of Christ. Can you really obey the covenant of those two commandments and be a Christian?

Well I know you are a people pleaser. I also know you think that you can make up some excuse on judgement day to God, "Like I was trying to LOVE my neighbour" But are you loving your neighbour if you avoid the truth and they go to hell?

Well it is your choice Gonnagle. God and Truth don't change. Would Christ have been a sinner if homosexual and in a homosexual relationship?

Now go lick your wounds because not even you and your contempt for the truth of God can save you from this one.
I love my neighbour and I love all whether gay or straight. So to me that means telling them truth and loving each other whatever we believe about our sexuality and faith.

I do not hurt or harm anyone because of faith or sexuality. But I do love them enough to be honest before God and with them.
Because may be I will be hated for telling the truth. But they know I did it because I love them in the sense or wanting no harm to come to them. If you knew someone was about to fall into a trap would you think it love not to warn them?

I am trying to understand the world today about faith, homosexuality and people who face these difficult times.
The truth is you do no one a service but yourself with your answer.
God is not fooled and you should not act as if he can be.

Good grief, Sass, you get deeper and deeper into the mire! And what is worse, you don't seem to be aware of how pompous and dictatorial you sound.

Wake up girl, and try to accept our differences instead of condemning us for them.

[Leonard James]

Do you believe you can have a true faith and be homosexual in Christ?
Your comments would be helpful on how you see homosexuality and the New Covenant of Christ.

Cheers

Many, many Christians are homosexual and their faith is as true as yours.

The encapsulation of the law by Jesus into two great commandments says it all.