'Sin'

[Gordon]

Ippy, Leonard and Floo.

Congratulations on your conversion to theism or at least deism if you think a god could exist.

You are misrepresenting me, and I'll leave the others you mention to speak for themselves.

I haven't said that I think a god could exist: my position is quite simply that is I see no basis to consider it a valid proposition in the first place since; a) the arguments advanced in favour of 'God' by its supporters are all inherently fallacious in one way or another, and b) the idea of 'God is so poorly defined as to be meaningless. 

[Walt Zingmatilder]

You are misrepresenting me, and I'll leave the others you mention to speak for themselves.

I haven't said that I think a god could exist: my position is quite simply that is I see no basis to consider it a valid proposition in the first place since; a) the arguments advanced in favour of 'God' by its supporters are all inherently fallacious in one way or another, and b) the idea of 'God is so poorly defined as to be meaningless.

Add Be Rational to your list of people you are trying to pass off as one of my Straw me. He believes there is no God and would probably say that he knows it.

Let's face it you are trying to dodge and defy labelling or categorisation.......a common or garden pisstaker if you like.

[floo]

Ippy, Leonard and Floo.

Congratulations on your conversion to theism or at least deism if you think a god could exist.

That isn't converting anyone! Of course it is just possible a deity of some sort could exist somewhere, although I bet the one featured in the Bible isn't it, it is far too human.

[Gordon]

Add Be Rational to your list of people you are trying to pass off as one of my Straw me. He believes there is no God and would probably say that he knows it.

Let's face it you are trying to dodge and defy labelling or categorisation.......a common or garden pisstaker if you like.

Nope - I'm telling you, and quite clearly too, what I think: I'm sure BR doesn't need my help.

You can think what you wish about my reasons for adopting the views I have: I've set them out quite neatly a couple of posts or so ago.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Nope - I'm telling you, and quite clearly too, what I think: I'm sure BR doesn't need my help.

You can think what you wish about my reasons for adopting the views I have: I've set them out quite neatly a couple of posts or so ago.

So....are you an atheist or not?

[Leonard James]

Ippy, Leonard and Floo.

Congratulations on your conversion to theism or at least deism if you think a god could exist.

Congratulations on skinning your bear before you've caught it! 

[Gordon]

So....are you an atheist or not?

Of course I am - I don't hold any beliefs about 'Gods': it isn't rocket science, Vlad, or a game of 'Call My Bluff'.

[bluehillside Retd.]

Gordon,

I haven't said that I think a god could exist: my position is quite simply that is I see no basis to consider it a valid proposition in the first place since; a) the arguments advanced in favour of 'God' by its supporters are all inherently fallacious in one way or another, and b) the idea of 'God is so poorly defined as to be meaningless.

Quite (though there's a "not" missing in there somewhere). It's simple enough to conceptualise I'd have thought, though predictably I see that Trollboy has thrown various straw man versions at it. It can be set out even more clearly thus:

1. All fallacious arguments are necessarily wrong arguments

2. The only arguments presented here (and so far as I know anywhere else) for an objectively true god are fallacious

3. Therefore there is no reason to think that those arguments demonstrate "god"

QED

[BeRational]

Add Be Rational to your list of people you are trying to pass off as one of my Straw me. He believes there is no God and would probably say that he knows it.

Let's face it you are trying to dodge and defy labelling or categorisation.......a common or garden pisstaker if you like.

Why do you say that about me.

I have on many occations explicitly pointed out that NOT believing god is NOT the same as believing a god does not exist.

I do NOT believe a god exists. That's all.

Should you present evidence I could change my mind, but you never do, you just lie about other peoples actual position and what they have posted.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Gordon,

Quite (though there's a "not" missing in there somewhere). It's simple enough to conceptualise I'd have thought, though predictably I see that Trollboy has thrown various straw man versions at it. It can be set out even more clearly thus:

1. All fallacious arguments are necessarily wrong arguments

2. The only arguments presented here (and so far as I know anywhere else) for an objectively true god are fallacious

3. Therefore there is no reason to think that those arguments demonstrate "god"

QED

You called me Trollboy and got away with it...................a fine bit of pisstake on your part.......and they come away worshipping you too!!!

Part of me wants to give your chutzpah the full salute and part of me wants to tuck three fingers and the thumb of that salute leaving the middle finger.

[floo]

I found this on another forum. You don't have to be religious to be a bad person, but it certainly helps!

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2016/03/31/walter-white-lives-indiana-pastor-pleads-guilty-to-producing-almost-100-tons-of-synthetic-drugs/

A pastor in Indiana pleads guilty to producing synthetic drugs!

[Brownie]

Blimey, you'd think a pastor would at least be able to produce real ones.  Did his customers know they were getting polyester instead of silk?

[Rhiannon]

I really need to wear my glasses when on here. I thought this was a thread about Siri, which I would have joined with alacrity. We've managed to get him to sing If I Only from the Wizard of Oz.

[floo]

What I don't understand is why some Christians make excuses for the 'sins' god is supposed to have perpetrated, according to the Bible? If humans had committed them they would be rightly condemned by The Court of Human Rights, and an effort made to bring them to justice.

[Shaker]

What I don't understand is why some Christians make excuses for the 'sins' god is supposed to have perpetrated, according to the Bible? If humans had committed them they would be rightly condemned by The Court of Human Rights, and an effort made to bring them to justice.

It comes down to ultimate authority, I think, and the fact that in the mind of the theist there's nobody further up the food chain, no higher court than God.

It's a crazy situation, I agree. An analogous example would be capital punishment, where the state arrogates to itself the right to kill people ... for killing people.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

It comes down to ultimate authority, I think, and the fact that in the mind of the theist there's nobody further up the food chain, no higher court than God.

It's a crazy situation, I agree. An analogous example would be capital punishment, where the state arrogates to itself the right to kill people ... for killing people.

But we are all higher courtists that's why we are all functional moral numenists believing there is a right which we all hope we are on the right side of rather than the faulty moral judgment of an individual or committee or even concensus or, heaven forbid, a zeitgeist.

[Sebastian Toe]

But we are all higher courtists that's why we are all functional moral numenists believing there is a right which we all hope we are on the right side of rather than the faulty moral judgment of an individual or committee or even concensus or, heaven forbid, a zeitgeist.

I see that you are having another 'ist' attack again. 
Maybe best see someone about getting that fixed? 

[Walt Zingmatilder]

I see that you are having another 'ist' attack again. 
Maybe best see someone about getting that fixed? 

Best sort yourself out.

[Hope]

"Sin" is one of those words religites love using which don't actually refer to anything real or factual. 

There are plenty of words they use which fit this category.  Here are a few more:

Blaspheme
Grace
Holy Ghost
Spirit
Heaven
Hell
Supernatural
Jehovah
Satan
Damnation

Not to mention the other associated words like murder, lying, bullying, rape, cheating, fraud, infidelity, etc., etc.

[Shaker]

Not to mention the other associated words like murder, lying, bullying, rape, cheating, fraud, infidelity, etc., etc.

They're all demonstrably real things. You can tell because they exist within, or I should rather say between, other demonstrably real things, i.e. human beings.

[Hope]

They're all demonstrably real things. You can tell because they exist within, or I should rather say between, other demonstrably real things, i.e. human beings.

And you have evidence that the terms Khatru mentions aren't equally demonstrably 'real'?

[Étienne d'Angleterre]

And you have evidence that the terms Khatru mentions aren't equally demonstrably 'real'?

Bingo!!!!!!!

I've been waiting for the NPF, and here it is.

Where do I go to get my prize money?

[Shaker]

It was bound to come, Stephen; it was only a matter of when, not if

He just can't post without it, can he?

[Étienne d'Angleterre]

It was bound to come, Stephen; it was only a matter of when, not if

He just can't post without it, can he?

All he has to do is demonstrate them.

I think on the balance of probabilities I will get my apology from Sassy for her libel against me first.

[Shaker]

Ah, the optimism of youth