Are atheists jealous of homosexuals who have faith and count themselves as...

[Sassy]

loved and belonging to God?

In my minds eye, I have no difficulty believing a person who is homosexual can see the love of God in Christ and know that they are loved by God. I have no difficulty in believing the atheists do not like this and so try and separate those who believe from Gods love by threads such as the homophobic views thread.

What I find strange and would love on this board is homosexuals who believe in Jesus to speak out and let the atheists know why they believe in God being true and Jesus Christ. Our sexuality does not and should not decide what we believe to be truth.
Atheism should keep their nose out of things that do not concern them.

I believe all Christians regardless of their sexuality believe God is love and loves them. It is love that counts so why do atheist seem so keen to rock the boat for believers regardless of sexuality. Christians love one another, we even love the atheists...

[Étienne d'Angleterre]

loved and belonging to God?

No. Well not this one anyway. I can't speak for others.

In my minds eye, I have no difficulty believing a person who is homosexual can see the love of God in Christ and know that they are loved by God. I have no difficulty in believing the atheists do not like this and so try and separate those who believe from Gods love by threads such as the homophobic views thread.

The homophobic view thread was started by me in response to a statement that you made. Namely that I was on the only one who thought some of the homophobic views expressed on this board were vile.

As you can see the poll did it's job in demonstrating your statement to be wrong.

I know you will never admit to being wrong but it is there for all to see.

What I find strange and would love on this board is homosexuals who believe in Jesus to speak out and let the atheists know why they believe in God being true and Jesus Christ. Our sexuality does not and should not decide what we believe to be truth.

I have never said that being gay or not is an indicator of the whether or not God exists. I don't know anyone who has either.

Atheism should keep their nose out of things that do not concern them.

Discrimination against people based on their sexuality does concern me

Talking of discrimination, you have had a whole week to come up with that apology. You really don't need to make such a big deal of it. A single sentence would be fine.

[Leonard James]

...we even love the atheists...

So you should! We are nothing if not lovable. 

[Aruntraveller]

loved and belonging to God?

In my minds eye, I have no difficulty believing a person who is homosexual can see the love of God in Christ and know that they are loved by God. I have no difficulty in believing the atheists do not like this and so try and separate those who believe from Gods love by threads such as the homophobic views thread.

What I find strange and would love on this board is homosexuals who believe in Jesus to speak out and let the atheists know why they believe in God being true and Jesus Christ. Our sexuality does not and should not decide what we believe to be truth.
Atheism should keep their nose out of things that do not concern them.

I believe all Christians regardless of their sexuality believe God is love and loves them. It is love that counts so why do atheist seem so keen to rock the boat for believers regardless of sexuality. Christians love one another, we even love the atheists...

Oh Sass such a confusing post.

But to take this part:

Our sexuality does not and should not decide what we believe to be truth.

I don't think anybody, whatever their sexuality is, does that. My lack of belief in God isn't down to my being gay - if anything it's down to my inability to suspend my disbelief. I know many gay Christians who are happy and secure in their belief - good luck to them. But me I just don't believe it and that disbelief is entirely separate to issues around sexuality.

[Enki]

loved and belonging to God?

In my minds eye, I have no difficulty believing a person who is homosexual can see the love of God in Christ and know that they are loved by God. I have no difficulty in believing the atheists do not like this and so try and separate those who believe from Gods love by threads such as the homophobic views thread.

What I find strange and would love on this board is homosexuals who believe in Jesus to speak out and let the atheists know why they believe in God being true and Jesus Christ. Our sexuality does not and should not decide what we believe to be truth.
Atheism should keep their nose out of things that do not concern them.

I believe all Christians regardless of their sexuality believe God is love and loves them. It is love that counts so why do atheist seem so keen to rock the boat for believers regardless of sexuality. Christians love one another, we even love the atheists...

I have no difficulty at all in accepting that anyone, not just homosexuals, can believe anything they want. Why on earth should I be jealous? I also believe that there is still considerable prejudice against homosexuals and homosexual behaviour in this world, although it does seem to be waning, especially in what I would call the more enlightened countries. I think this prejudice is mistaken, harmful and therefore wrong. This has nothing to do with atheism at all, in my view.

I think that it is also true that, in part, Christianity and Islam, have encouraged that prejudice, although I would agree with you that many Christians have shaken off that shackle.

As far as me being an atheist is concerned, this has no bearing at all on my conviction that discrimination and bias against homosexuals is wrong, so your idea that "Atheism should keep their nose out of things that do not concern them." is quite meaningless for me.

As far as your last paragraph goes, my response would be that my care, respect, friendship and love for others does not depend on whether they are Christian/non Christian, homosexual, heterosexual, atheist/ non atheist. Why should it?

Far more important to me is how we express that bond between us as human beings.

[floo]

Being loved by god, if it exists and is as portrayed in the Bible, it would be like being 'loved' by Hitler. 

[Leonard James]

I have no difficulty at all in accepting that anyone, not just homosexuals, can believe anything they want. Why on earth should I be jealous? I also believe that there is still considerable prejudice against homosexuals and homosexual behaviour in this world, although it does seem to be waning, especially in what I would call the more enlightened countries. I think this prejudice is mistaken, harmful and therefore wrong. This has nothing to do with atheism at all, in my view.

I think that it is also true that, in part, Christianity and Islam, have encouraged that prejudice, although I would agree with you that many Christians have shaken off that shackle.

As far as me being an atheist is concerned, this has no bearing at all on my conviction that discrimination and bias against homosexuals is wrong, so your idea that "Atheism should keep their nose out of things that do not concern them." is quite meaningless for me.

As far as your last paragraph goes, my response would be that my care, respect, friendship and love for others does not depend on whether they are Christian/non Christian, homosexual, heterosexual, atheist/ non atheist. Why should it?

Far more important to me is how we express that bond between us as human beings.

I think I just fell in love ... again! 

[Enki]

Oh dear, Len. I'm afraid I'm spoken for, and have been for the last 51 years.  Still, while there's life, there's hope.

[Leonard James]

Oh dear, Len. I'm afraid I'm spoken for, and have been for the last 51 years.  Still, while there's life, there's hope.

It's OK lover, just platonic will do ... and your vow never to give up posting good sense. 

[Enki]

 

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Being loved by god, if it exists and is as portrayed in the Bible, it would be like being 'loved' by Hitler. 

By the same logic then would you say that being loved by a secular humanist is like being loved by Stalin?

[Aruntraveller]

By the same logic then would you say that being loved by a secular humanist is like being loved by Stalin?

Not logical Jim.

[floo]

By the same logic then would you say that being loved by a secular humanist is like being loved by Stalin?

A daft post, why should humanists support a nasty guy like Stalin?

[Walt Zingmatilder]

A daft post, why should humanists support a nasty guy like Stalin?

Not really. Ponder this interpretation of RE by the British Humanist Association.

 ''atheism taught about clearly when beliefs about god are being taught,''

That suggests that anything said about God must be ringfenced by an atheist counter...and that is Stalinism.

[Shaker]

Sure about that, Vlad?

[Rhiannon]

Not really. Ponder this interpretation of RE by the British Humanist Association.

 ''atheism taught about clearly when beliefs about god are being taught,''

That suggests that anything said about God must be ringfenced by an atheist counter...and that is Stalinism.

It's not though, is it?

Forget using words that you don't understand, find a cogent argument (if one exists) and try again.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Sure about that, Vlad?

What else does it mean?

[horsethorn]

Not really. Ponder this interpretation of RE by the British Humanist Association.

 ''atheism taught about clearly when beliefs about god are being taught,''

That suggests that anything said about God must be ringfenced by an atheist counter...and that is Stalinism.

Let's look at the whole paragraph in context, shall we?

"In practice, our work in RE focuses on ensuring non-religious perspectives are included (e.g. atheism taught about clearly when beliefs about god are being taught, and Humanism taught about as a non-religious approach to life) and opposing any confessional teaching in state schools, where pupils are instructed in a particular religion and denied their entitlement to a balanced and objective syllabus."

ht

[Brownie]

I'm sure if we googled we would find a message board with a significant number of Christian homosexuals.  The fact that there don't appear to be any on here isn't important as this is not the only forum on the 'net.  In fact I am going to google now and see what I can find.  Iirc, on the old Premier Radio forum there were a couple of gay men and they were hounded off by Christians -I don't remember all the details but it was pretty awful, all he said was, ''I am gay'' and was accused of promoting a gay agenda;  the most recent version of the PR forum had at least one Christian homosexual and he stuck around.  I don't quite know what I will put in the search engine but will be back if/when I've found something.

Found this:  https://beta.gaychristian.net/community/

I haven't studied it and won't join because what I do already on forums is enough for me but it may be interesting for those who want to interract with gay Christians.

Later: Having had me lunch, I decided to peruse the gaychristian forum, I specifically looked at threads on the 'Thoughts and Discussion' section.  I have to say, from what I've seen, it is really lovely.  I don't even feel guilty about 'voyeuring' on it because they all seem terribly nice and interesting and am sure they wouldn't mind me looking; it is public, ie you don't have to be a member to look.  Some of things discussed on there could easily be transplanted to here but that would be a step too far for me.  However it is worth looking at.

I can't imagine any atheist would be 'jealous' of people on that forum, they are seeing things from a different perspective but would still find certain issues and values in common.

[Sassy]

So you should! We are nothing if not lovable. 

Well it made me smirk...

[Sassy]

Oh Sass such a confusing post.

But to take this part:
I don't think anybody, whatever their sexuality is, does that. My lack of belief in God isn't down to my being gay - if anything it's down to my inability to suspend my disbelief. I know many gay Christians who are happy and secure in their belief - good luck to them. But me I just don't believe it and that disbelief is entirely separate to issues around sexuality.

I believe you and what you have shared with us, Trent.
I wish everyone was as sincere as you have shown yourself to be. I believe you are one of the few people here who accept me for who I am with my beliefs. I also feel, that like myself you are at peace with what you believe.

[Sassy]

I have no difficulty at all in accepting that anyone, not just homosexuals, can believe anything they want. Why on earth should I be jealous?

I believe the difficulty is accepting Christian hetrosexual and Christian homosexual can actually believe and share the truth about God is what I am suggesting atheists have difficulty in. If alright about homosexuals having faith then why are we constantly on this forum being bombarded with Christians being accused of not loving those who are homosexual Christians?
What has homophobic views to do with Christians who are heterosexual and homosexual here?

I also believe that there is still considerable prejudice against homosexuals and homosexual behaviour in this world, although it does seem to be waning, especially in what I would call the more enlightened countries. I think this prejudice is mistaken, harmful and therefore wrong. This has nothing to do with atheism at all, in my view.

How does that relate to homosexuals who have faith?
I asked are atheists jealous of homosexuals who have faith etc. You are talking about homophobia I am talking about jealousy.
Homosexuals believe they have found truth about God regardless of sexuality. Trent understood what I was saying.
He is an atheist but he also made a good point. That his sexuality had no bearing on not being able to believe in God.
I believe him and I still ask are atheist Jealous of those who have found faith in God and Christ?

I think that it is also true that, in part, Christianity and Islam, have encouraged that prejudice, although I would agree with you that many Christians have shaken off that shackle.

Whatever you believe, about the above it really does not refer to atheists being jealous of homosexuals who have found faith and count themselves loved by God. This is not about prejudice in religion.

As far as me being an atheist is concerned, this has no bearing at all on my conviction that discrimination and bias against homosexuals is wrong, so your idea that "Atheism should keep their nose out of things that do not concern them." is quite meaningless for me.

As far as your last paragraph goes, my response would be that my care, respect, friendship and love for others does not depend on whether they are Christian/non Christian, homosexual, heterosexual, atheist/ non atheist. Why should it?

Far more important to me is how we express that bond between us as human beings.
[/quote]

Again... the question is:-

Re: Are atheists jealous of homosexuals who have faith and count themselves as...

Are atheist jealous of homosexuals who have found faith... You appear stuck in the land of homophobia?

[jeremyp]

loved and belonging to God?

Why would I be jealous of anybody - gay or straight - who counts themselves as loved by a fictional being? Why would I be jealous of anybody - gay or straight - who counts themselves as being a possession of anybody fictional or real?

[Maeght]

Are atheist jealous of homosexuals who have found faith...

Jealous of what? If finding faith, why limit this to homosexuals? Not really sure what you are asking.

[Khatru]

No

An individual's sexual orientation matters not a jot and whether someone is heterosexual or homosexual is neither here nor there.

Nor, come to mention it, does the god(s) they have chosen to worship.  There are plenty of other gods out there for people to worship and although I don't believe in any of them, I respect their choice(s) as it really doesn't bother me.

Can you homestly say the same?