Free school bus travel for the children of religious parents.

[ippy]

I note that infamous organisation the National Secular Society has had the cheek to challenge Flintshire council's discriminatory transport policy and in one of their articles they have said:

The National Secular Society has criticised a decision by Flintshire Council to discriminate against people without religious faith in its school transport arrangements.

Flintshire Council's cabinet voted on Tuesday to scrap free transport for pupils attending faith schools. However, under the controversial new policy, children who can prove their beliefs with such evidence as baptism certificates will be exempt from the cuts.
The Council has said that withdrawing the discretionary funding could save up to £100,000 a year.
The authority is one of the first in the UK to impose charges for transporting children who cannot prove they share the faith of the school.
A consultation on the proposals received 638 responses, with 542 (85%) strongly disagreeing with the Council's plans.
Stephen Evans, National Secular Society campaigns manager, said: "There is something morally repugnant about a policy that uses the religious beliefs of parents to single out specific children for discrimination in this way.
"Flintshire Council are callously exploiting exemptions to equality legislation that enables faith schools to operate with impunity.
"Their policy decision could result in children who live next door to each other, and travel to the same state funded school being treated unequally, purely on the basis of their parent's religious beliefs. Such discrimination should have no place in modern society.
"The Government must call an end to this discrimination by compelling local authorities to have equitable school transport policies, free from religious privilege, and fair to all families."

I suppose the religious believing parents of these children will be thinking it's the religious being persecuted by that nasty Secular Society again, what do you think?

ippy





 

[Humph Warden Bennett]

I suppose the religious believing parents of these children will be thinking it's the religious being persecuted by that nasty Secular Society again, what do you think?

ippy

I think that the council are trying to stop unscrupulous parents from taking advantage of faith schools by lying about their faith.





 

[floo]

Flintshire are pretty strapped for cash at present, they are making all sorts of cuts, and no doubt our council tax will soar!

[Hope]

September 2014!

http://www.secularism.org.uk/news/2014/09/anger-as-non-catholics-forced-off-the-school-bus

[L.A.]

I think, possibly on balance, it might be worth becoming a Catholic to get free school buses for your kids.

[Hope]

I think, possibly on balance, it might be worth becoming a Catholic to get free school buses for your kids.

But, LA, does the policy still exist, 20 months later?

[L.A.]

But, LA, does the policy still exist, 20 months later?

I suppose these offers do expire, but in principle - why not?

[Nearly Sane]

I think, possibly on balance, it might be worth becoming a Catholic to get free school buses for your kids.

The higher the benefit, the deeper the guilt

[Bubbles]

All children should get free transport to their school if there is no closer alternative.

After age 14 my school was 8 miles away and we did.  Religion didn't come into
 it.

With small schools having been closed and kids having to go further afield, the state should get them there, IMO.

The religion of the children or their parents is irrelevant.

[L.A.]

The higher the benefit, the deeper the guilt

I suppose that must be like when you take your family to a theme Park using Tesco points, then realise that the people you are talking to paid more than £100 to get in.

C'est la vie.

[Nearly Sane]

I suppose that must be like when you take your family to a theme Park using Tesco points, then realise that the people you are talking to paid more than £100 to get in.

C'est la vie.

Oh dear Dawkins,  no, it's like when you think that and then see your children burnt in front of you and fee like you and they deserve it

[Gonnagle]

Dear ippy,

http://www.shropshirestar.com/news/2016/05/09/non-church-pupil-told-he-cant-travel-on-school-bus/

The comments by some locals are interesting, land deals, Labour vanity project, will be an Academy, is not a Academy

Gonnagle.

[L.A.]

Oh dear Dawkins,  no, it's like when you think that and then see your children burnt in front of you and fee like you and they deserve it

No, I think that's when you get so indoctrinated that you lose all sense of reality.

[Nearly Sane]

No, I think that's when you get so indoctrinated that you lose all sense of reality.

there's a shop nearby, it sells a soh for a tanner.

[Hope]

The religion of the children or their parents is irrelevant.

It would be interesting to know (not merely surmising) where the idea for subsidising only the children of Catholic families came from.

[L.A.]

It would be interesting to know (not merely surmising) where the idea for subsidising only the children of Catholic families came from.

. . . and how you apply?

[ProfessorDavey]

I think that the council are trying to stop unscrupulous parents from taking advantage of faith schools by lying about their faith.





 

No they aren't because had they lied about their faith and therefore claimed that the were applying to that school for religious reasons then under these completely unacceptable and discriminatory rules they would have got free transport.

The point is that they didn't claim that they wanted to go to the school due to religious reasons - that's why they are being forced to pay, while those who play the religious card get it free.

Completely unacceptable - there must be a level playing field - either parents should get transport subsidised if they choose to send their children to a school which isn't their nearest, or they shouldn't. To allow them to on that basis of their religious is totally unacceptable and discriminatory.

[Gonnagle]

Dear Tuppence Worth,

I followed this story yesterday trying figure out the bottom line ( bottom line man ) what I take from most of the stories is pure discrimination ( there may be some politics involved ) but what I did read was that the Church ( RC, CoE ) were also condemning this, against Christian values, what I did not see was a dialogue between the Church and the NSS, after all the real bottom line is the kids, their future.

Gonnagle.

[ippy]

Dear Tuppence Worth,

I followed this story yesterday trying figure out the bottom line ( bottom line man ) what I take from most of the stories is pure discrimination ( there may be some politics involved ) but what I did read was that the Church ( RC, CoE ) were also condemning this, against Christian values, what I did not see was a dialogue between the Church and the NSS, after all the real bottom line is the kids, their future.

Gonnagle.

Well Gonners as you should know by now it's the NSS that always has been looking for a level playing field and it's the various religious organisations that want to continue with their long held privilege.

The bottom line as you say is the children's futures, the non-religious based schools take their fair share of children with special educational needs, unlike where the religion based schools do their best to avoid having the children that have to struggle to get through their education.

It's well known that the religion based schools avoid having the less able children and this is a part of their way of concentrating on the most able, which in turn would tend to lift their standards by being able to spend more of their time and money on the most able, instead of spending their time and money on the least able, which then again draws in more students, potential recruits, from elsewhere; such a charitable way of doing business, don't you think, Gonners.

When you think of that underhanded, unscrupulous bunch of secularists that want to offer all children equal opportunities to develop to their full educational potential.

ippy         

[Gonnagle]

Dear ipp's,

Fair enough old son, bad Christians! very bad Christians, nuthin! but Politicians the lot of em!

Gonnagle.

[Hope]

Well Gonners as you should know by now it's the NSS that always has been looking for a level playing field and it's the various religious organisations that want to continue with their long held privilege.

So why did the two major religious bodies suggest that the proposal was bad thinking?  Why don't the NSS ask religious bodies (and note that this might only apply to the Church of England as it is the only 'officially sanctioned' religious body in England) to have a debate on the issues?

The bottom line as you say is the children's futures, the non-religious based schools take their fair share of children with special educational needs, unlike where the religion based schools do their best to avoid having the children that have to struggle to get through their education.

It's well known that the religion based schools avoid having the less able children and this is a part of their way of concentrating on the most able, which in turn would tend to lift their standards by being able to spend more of their time and money on the most able, instead of spending their time and money on the least able, which then again draws in more students, potential recruits, from elsewhere; such a charitable way of doing business, don't you think, Gonners.

Is this why so many Church schools take less able, disabled and special needs pupils and are often to be found in the most rundown parts of the country?

When you think of that underhanded, unscrupulous bunch of secularists that want to offer all children equal opportunities to develop to their full educational potential.

The Church has been challenging more of them to come forward and partner with the Church, but where are they?

[ProfessorDavey]

Is this why so many Church schools take less able, disabled and special needs pupils and are often to be found in the most rundown parts of the country?

There is huge amounts of evidence to prove that faith schools take a lower proportion of kids with special needs than non faith schools. Indeed it is obvious within the admissions criteria of many of those schools.

So most non faith schools put the possession of a SEN statement at the top of their admissions criteria - trumping their 'main' criterion, which is usually distance. Faith schools tend to only prioritise SEN kids if they are of the appropriate faith, meaning that it doesn't trump their main criterion - in this case a particular religious faith.

So in a non faith school a SEN kids living miles away will get priority over a kid without SEN that lives next door. In a faith school a SEN kid of the 'wrong' faith won't get priority over a kid without SEN of the 'right' faith.

[Rhiannon]

I've witnessed first hand what happens when different factions within a church try to sort out their differences. I'm not holding my breath that a church talking to secularists would be any different.

[ippy]

So why did the two major religious bodies suggest that the proposal was bad thinking?  Why don't the NSS ask religious bodies (and note that this might only apply to the Church of England as it is the only 'officially sanctioned' religious body in England) to have a debate on the issues?
Is this why so many Church schools take less able, disabled and special needs pupils and are often to be found in the most rundown parts of the country?
The Church has been challenging more of them to come forward and partner with the Church, but where are they?

Proff D's got your answer Hope, I would only be repeating his words, more or less.

I would only add the religious see the young children as more potential delusion fodder and do whaterver they can to grab them, concious of not being to obvious about how they do it.

ippy.

[Gonnagle]

Dear Rhiannon,

I've witnessed first hand what happens when different factions within a church try to sort out their differences. I'm not holding my breath that a church talking to secularists would be any different.

Three things I find very important in life, communication, communication, communication.

church talking to secularists would be any different

Or secularists talking to Church.

But I will add, after reading ProfDaveys post, faith schools seem the wrong approach, I will think on.

Gonnagle.