What/Who is a Christian

[~TW~]

A Christian from the bible stand point is someone who has taken part in the first resurrection


                   Revelation 20; 6 Blessed and holy are those who share in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over them, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with him for a thousand years.


                ~TW~

[Gordon]

In practical terms how is this achieved?

[Étienne d'Angleterre]

A Christian from the bible stand point is someone who has taken part in the first resurrection


                   Revelation 20; 6 Blessed and holy are those who share in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over them, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with him for a thousand years.


                ~TW~

But the first resurrection, of ordinary people, won't happen till Christ returns.

1 Corinthians 15:23

 But each in turn: Christ, the firstfruits; then, when he comes, those who belong to him.

[~TW~]

But the first resurrection, of ordinary people, won't happen till Christ returns.

1 Corinthians 15:23

 But each in turn: Christ, the firstfruits; then, when he comes, those who belong to him.

 The first resurrection has already and is now taking place. Read Johns Gospel.
~TW~

[Étienne d'Angleterre]

The first resurrection has already and is now taking place. Read Johns Gospel.
~TW~

Which fits exactly with 1 Corinthians. Jesus first and then when he returns again the resurrection of the just will begin.

I assume with regards to John you are talking about.

John 14:1-3.

Well is this a spiritual or physical resurrection? If physical then clearly, according to you, only someone who has physically died can be a Christian. If spiritual how can you tell? How do you know that Christ has not returned to an individual to make them a Christian?

[~TW~]

In practical terms how is this achieved?

 Two types of resurrection are spoken of in scripture the Spiritual and the Physical for example the first is the new birth the second is the parousia . Paul was able to say.

 Eph 2;1  As for you, you were dead in your transgressions and sins, 2 in which you used to live when you followed the ways of this world and of the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who are disobedient.---and also Eph 2;4-6  4 But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, 5 made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved. 6 And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus,

 Col 2:13 When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made you[d] alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins,

 We add Johh 5:24-29  “Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life. 25 Very truly I tell you, a time is coming and has now come when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God and those who hear will live. 26 For as the Father has life in himself, so he has granted the Son also to have life in himself. 27 And he has given him authority to judge because he is the Son of Man.

28 “Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice 29 and come out—those who have done what is good will rise to live, and those who have done what is evil will rise to be condemned. 30 By myself I can do nothing; I judge only as I hear, and my judgment is just, for I seek not to please myself but him who sent me.

 And we see  regarding resurrection 1 one is present one is future   2 one is spiritual one is physical    3 one is restricted to believers the other includes everyone.

 Which is in agreement with      Revelation 20; 6 Blessed and holy are those who share in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over them, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with him for a thousand years.


                         ~TW~

[Étienne d'Angleterre]

Two types of resurrection are spoken of in scripture the Spiritual and the Physical for example the first is the new birth the second is the parousia . Paul was able to say.

 Eph 2;1  As for you, you were dead in your transgressions and sins, 2 in which you used to live when you followed the ways of this world and of the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who are disobedient.---and also Eph 2;4-6  4 But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, 5 made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved. 6 And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus,

 Col 2:13 When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made you[d] alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins,

 We add Johh 5:24-29  “Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life. 25 Very truly I tell you, a time is coming and has now come when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God and those who hear will live. 26 For as the Father has life in himself, so he has granted the Son also to have life in himself. 27 And he has given him authority to judge because he is the Son of Man.

28 “Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice 29 and come out—those who have done what is good will rise to live, and those who have done what is evil will rise to be condemned. 30 By myself I can do nothing; I judge only as I hear, and my judgment is just, for I seek not to please myself but him who sent me.

 And we see  regarding resurrection 1 one is present one is future   2 one is spiritual one is physical    3 one is restricted to believers the other includes everyone.

 Which is in agreement with      Revelation 20; 6 Blessed and holy are those who share in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over them, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with him for a thousand years.


                         ~TW~

So how do you tell who is a true Christian then?

[Gordon]

So, have all those who say they are Christians (you, Sass, Hope, Alan Burns etc) undergone this first resurrection as part of the definition of being a Christian?

[~TW~]

So how do you tell who is a true Christian then?

 Revelation 20:6   Revelation 20; 6 Blessed and holy are those who share in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over them, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with him for a thousand years.

 Those who have taken part in the first resurrection,now on another thread you stated you do not believe in the tri-omni God which means you are not a Christian and you experience the second death,also that which is flesh is flesh and that which is spirit is spirit as you are still in the flesh Paul says in Romans that this is foolishness for you a non-Spiritual person and difficult for you to understand.

   ~TW~

[bluehillside Retd.]

So, have all those who say they are Christians (you, Sass, Hope, Alan Burns etc) undergone this first resurrection as part of the definition of being a Christian?

Only in their heads Gordon, only in their heads.

Curiously, it seems that it's not part of the club's rules not to behave like a total scumbag...

...ah, it's all making sense now 

[~TW~]

So, have all those who say they are Christians (you, Sass, Hope, Alan Burns etc) undergone this first resurrection as part of the definition of being a Christian?

 John 3: Jesus replied, “Very truly I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God unless they are born again.[a]”   Which is the first resurrection so the answer is yes.

 There is only one way into the Kingdom.

 ~TW~

[Étienne d'Angleterre]

So how do you tell who is a true Christian then?

TW,

Genuinely then how would you tell? If someone had received the first resurrection, could/would they still steal, lie, murder for example?

[Gordon]

What does 'taken part in the first resurrection' actually mean though: you say 'taken part' so is it some kind of event (like a baptism or communion etc)?

 

[~TW~]

TW,

Genuinely then how would you tell? If someone had received the first resurrection, could/would they still steal, lie, murder for example?

 In my walk as a Christian I do not know any one who has murdered,the other questions are difficult to answer unless you are a mind reader.

 But I believe once saved always saved.

   ~TW~

[~TW~]

What does 'taken part in the first resurrection' actually mean though: you say 'taken part' so is it some kind of event (like a baptism or communion etc)?

 It means being born again.Being raised to spiritual life.

 ~TW~

[~TW~]

Also remember if you are not born again/first resurrection you have this great scripture which must be of great encouragement to you.Now you may not understand it but,it is in your favour.

    READ IT      20 And I saw an angel coming down out of heaven, having the key to the Abyss and holding in his hand a great chain. 2 He seized the dragon, that ancient serpent, who is the devil, or Satan, and bound him for a thousand years. 3 He threw him into the Abyss, and locked and sealed it over him, to keep him from deceiving the nations anymore until the thousand years were ended. After that, he must be set free for a short time.

    ~TW~   Must leave you now back later.

[Gordon]

It means being born again.Being raised to spiritual life.

 ~TW~

So is it more like a personal commitment: the likes of Hope and Sass would say/feel the same?

Luther Wesley Baxter, on the old BBC, used to talk about being born again 'from above' - is this the same thing as the spiritual resurrection you mentioned?

[Étienne d'Angleterre]

In my walk as a Christian I do not know any one who has murdered,the other questions are difficult to answer unless you are a mind reader.

 But I believe once saved always saved.

   ~TW~

Well, presumably you can read your own mind. So now you have been born again could/would/have you murdered, lied, stolen?

[~TW~]

Well, presumably you can read your own mind. So now you have been born again could/would/have you murdered, lied, stolen?

 A good question I would answer it like this.

       5 This is the message we have heard from him and declare to you: God is light; in him there is no darkness at all. 6 If we claim to have fellowship with him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not live out the truth. 7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus, his Son, purifies us from all sin.

8 If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word is not in us

 ~TW~

[Étienne d'Angleterre]

A good question I would answer it like this.

       5 This is the message we have heard from him and declare to you: God is light; in him there is no darkness at all. 6 If we claim to have fellowship with him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not live out the truth. 7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus, his Son, purifies us from all sin.

8 If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word is not in us

 ~TW~

So someone might be born again and still lie/steal but if they were truly born again they would confess? Seems to be what you are saying?

[~TW~]

So someone might be born again and still lie/steal but if they were truly born again they would confess? Seems to be what you are saying?

 When you are born again each day you are being sanctified and becoming a new creation in Christ it is one day at a time forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us,

                Must go back later.

   ~TW~

[Étienne d'Angleterre]

When you are born again each day you are being sanctified and becoming a new creation in Christ it is one day at a time forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us,

                Must go back later.

   ~TW~

So will you be confessing the lies you told on the other thread then? About nobody answering your question?

Either you are going to confess it or you are not born again, by your own definition.

[~TW~]

So will you be confessing the lies you told on the other thread then? About nobody answering your question?

Either you are going to confess it or you are not born again, by your own definition.

Well what ever I do one thing is for sure I am born again and I am miles ahead of you,so get some sleep and rest and try again.
~TW~

[Rhiannon]

TW, I get the impression you'd be gutted if any of us converted and you lost the satisfaction of contemplating our eternal torment.

[bluehillside Retd.]

Stephen,

I just typed "for sure I am born again" into Google Translate for T(roll)W to English, and it said: "I haven't got a freaking clue about this nonsense, and nor therefore do I have one shred of an iota of an argument to support it. It keeps me warm at night though to believe it to be true, and it arms me with the back up I need to be a thoroughly nasty bit of work whenever anyone has the temerity to ask me why I actually believe this steaming heap of unicorn dung to be true."

Just thought you'd like to know