Author Topic: Red on Red, Labour implode  (Read 44374 times)

L.A.

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Re: Red on Red, Labour implode
« Reply #25 on: June 27, 2016, 10:31:29 AM »
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Ohh they all keep bleating on about needing a more charismatic leader, not like the Miliband or Brown, but their hero Tory Blair.
I think they need a competent leader who commands the respect of the party and appears credible to the electorate. What they have at to moment is a guy who looks like a retired university professor who just seems to mutter endlessly about socialism. Very reassuring for Labours left wing no doubt - but to the rest of the world he is just a useless idiot.
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But have you noticed they haven't put forward an alternative candidate for the job?
Obviously, people are reluctant to be the one to 'weilds the dagger' - but it could happen.
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More importantly they have no significant support among the Labour party membership who elected Corbyn in the first place.
Good point: I think that there is good evidence that Corbyn only got in because of the 'The Three Quid Votes' that were available to all and sundry - including those who did not have the best interests of Labour at heart. I have heard of a number of Tories who voted.

But even amongst the genuine Labour supports who voted for Jeremy - a great number must by now be disappointed in him.
 
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This attempt to oust Corbyn right now reads like a childish attempt at bullying, at a time when their constituents and country desperately need them to think bigger and better.

It looks like a desperate attempt to save the Labour party from itself.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2016, 10:37:47 AM by L.A. »
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jakswan

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Re: Red on Red, Labour implode
« Reply #26 on: June 27, 2016, 10:49:12 AM »
Really... although to be fair it comes as no great surprise that the Thatcher loving/Tory coloured Blairite MPs, who have been sniping and attempting to undermining Jeremy Corbyn ever since he became party leader are now trying to oust him.

But you are right in your observation LA - What's astonishing is that they have chosen this moment, which calls for a time for unity and clear-headedness, to launch such an attempt.. WTF's wrong with these Blairite twats?

Ohh they all keep bleating on about needing a more charismatic leader, not like the Miliband or Brown, but their hero Tory Blair.

But have you noticed they haven't put forward an alternative candidate for the job?

More importantly they have no significant support among the Labour party membership who elected Corbyn in the first place.
 
This attempt to oust Corbyn right now reads like a childish attempt at bullying, at a time when their constituents and country desperately need them to think bigger and better.

I don't know why people have to be so toxic (note to self try not to be so toxic towards SNP). There are two schools of thought for Labour, do they pitch at the centre left or left left.

Clearly the membership wanted to go left left but the PLP more wants to go centre left. A split the only solution the battle is who gets to call themselves Labour. if Corbyn is to win then he has to do what Kinnock did in reverse.

As to the timing surely this is because they think an election is coming and the centre left fear they will lose it with Corbyn in charge.
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L.A.

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Re: Red on Red, Labour implode
« Reply #27 on: June 27, 2016, 11:34:56 AM »
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But have you noticed they haven't put forward an alternative candidate for the job?

 :)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36638041
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Nearly Sane

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Re: Red on Red, Labour implode
« Reply #29 on: June 27, 2016, 12:52:28 PM »

L.A.

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Re: Red on Red, Labour implode
« Reply #30 on: June 27, 2016, 02:10:58 PM »
Where does that put forward an alternative candidate?

No name appears but it says:

" . . deputy Labour Leader Tom Watson tells Jeremy Corbyn he faces a leadership challenge"
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jakswan

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Re: Red on Red, Labour implode
« Reply #31 on: June 27, 2016, 02:14:48 PM »
Funny old world

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/new-poll-puts-labour-ahead-of-tories-for-first-time-since-jeremy-corbyn-became-leader-a6937926.html

Weird as well the LibDems still dead in that poll but look likely to be the only party with "no Brexit" on their manifesto i can see them coming back.
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Humph Warden Bennett

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Re: Red on Red, Labour implode
« Reply #32 on: June 27, 2016, 02:24:42 PM »
I don't know why people have to be so toxic (note to self try not to be so toxic towards SNP). There are two schools of thought for Labour, do they pitch at the centre left or left left.

Clearly the membership wanted to go left left but the PLP more wants to go centre left. A split the only solution the battle is who gets to call themselves Labour. if Corbyn is to win then he has to do what Kinnock did in reverse.

As to the timing surely this is because they think an election is coming and the centre left fear they will lose it with Corbyn in charge.

Labour has been infiltrated by Dave Sparts from Militant/Socialist Party, Independent Workers of the World, IMG, and assorted 57 varieties of Stalinist/Trot types. They mostly don't care if they lose an election provided that the message is right.

Humph Warden Bennett

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Re: Red on Red, Labour implode
« Reply #33 on: June 27, 2016, 02:25:31 PM »
Weird as well the LibDems still dead in that poll but look likely to be the only party with "no Brexit" on their manifesto i can see them coming back.

Well here's hoping  :)

L.A.

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Re: Red on Red, Labour implode
« Reply #34 on: June 27, 2016, 02:30:29 PM »
Labour has been infiltrated by Dave Sparts from Militant/Socialist Party, Independent Workers of the World, IMG, and assorted 57 varieties of Stalinist/Trot types. They mostly don't care if they lose an election provided that the message is right.

Sounds like exactly the same tactics that were used in the 70's - Labour could be a long time in the wilderness.

Meanwhile, whatever the Tories are doing  (and even they don't seem to know) . . . they are facing no opposition.
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wigginhall

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Re: Red on Red, Labour implode
« Reply #35 on: June 27, 2016, 04:16:35 PM »
Well, the Blairites have been plotting since Corbyn was elected, and it looks like they have their man now.   I suppose they want a kind of liberal party, although I'm not sure what they have to say to the poor and disadvantaged, who have to an extent voted Brexit.    'We feel your pain', I suppose.   
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L.A.

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Re: Red on Red, Labour implode
« Reply #36 on: June 27, 2016, 04:23:23 PM »
Well, the Blairites have been plotting since Corbyn was elected, and it looks like they have their man now.   I suppose they want a kind of liberal party, although I'm not sure what they have to say to the poor and disadvantaged, who have to an extent voted Brexit.    'We feel your pain', I suppose.

They could hardly do less than a Corbynista Labour party whose chances of ever forming a government are slightly less than someone winning Euro Millions TWICE.
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wigginhall

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Re: Red on Red, Labour implode
« Reply #37 on: June 27, 2016, 04:33:10 PM »
They could hardly do less than a Corbynista Labour party whose chances of ever forming a government are slightly less than someone winning Euro Millions TWICE.

Don't really agree, but it's a pointless argument.  The Blairites look pretty determined to get rid of Corbyn.  Well, I'm out then.   Fuck, my family have been connected with Labour since the 1920s, ah well, it's over.
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L.A.

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Re: Red on Red, Labour implode
« Reply #38 on: June 27, 2016, 04:39:39 PM »
Don't really agree, but it's a pointless argument.  The Blairites look pretty determined to get rid of Corbyn.  Well, I'm out then.   Fuck, my family have been connected with Labour since the 1920s, ah well, it's over.

You don't think that there might be some advantage to having a party that was electable?
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Walt Zingmatilder

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Re: Red on Red, Labour implode
« Reply #39 on: June 27, 2016, 06:20:04 PM »
I think they need a competent leader who commands the respect of the party and appears credible to the electorate. What they have at to moment is a guy who looks like a retired university professor who just seems to mutter endlessly about socialism. Very reassuring for Labours left wing no doubt - but to the rest of the world he is just a useless idiot.Obviously, people are reluctant to be the one to 'weilds the dagger' - but it could happen.Good point: I think that there is good evidence that Corbyn only got in because of the 'The Three Quid Votes' that were available to all and sundry - including those who did not have the best interests of Labour at heart. I have heard of a number of Tories who voted.

But even amongst the genuine Labour supports who voted for Jeremy - a great number must by now be disappointed in him.
 
It looks like a desperate attempt to save the Labour party from itself.
Alas the country now needs leadership to send BoJo the clown into the ignominious early retirement. Labour do have one or two action men but alas (no Nicola or Ruth) and potential bruisers.

I'm not sure if BoJo was at panto rehearsal today?

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Re: Red on Red, Labour implode
« Reply #40 on: June 27, 2016, 07:42:43 PM »
Well, the Blairites have been plotting since Corbyn was elected, and it looks like they have their man now.   I suppose they want a kind of liberal party, although I'm not sure what they have to say to the poor and disadvantaged, who have to an extent voted Brexit.    'We feel your pain', I suppose.

I have no doubt that Momentum are plotting to get rid of many of the centre left MPs. I think Corbyn will win in the end, he spent years out in the cold its hardly a new experience for him.
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L.A.

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Re: Red on Red, Labour implode
« Reply #41 on: June 27, 2016, 08:18:48 PM »
I have no doubt that Momentum are plotting to get rid of many of the centre left MPs. I think Corbyn will win in the end, he spent years out in the cold its hardly a new experience for him.

I think that's probably what the tories are counting on.
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Jack Knave

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Re: Red on Red, Labour implode
« Reply #42 on: June 27, 2016, 08:53:44 PM »
I think the Blarites etc. have just handed Corbyn what he wants. All his friends etc. in the shadow cabinet, without much of a fuss. They can't challenge him to a leadership contest because they will lose. So now all the Labour lot on the right etc. of their party are out in the wilderness. But so too is Corbyn and Labour as he is unelectable.

Next the Tories kick the shit out of each other...

Nearly Sane

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Re: Red on Red, Labour implode
« Reply #43 on: June 28, 2016, 12:41:34 AM »
Weird as well the LibDems still dead in that poll but look likely to be the only party with "no Brexit" on their manifesto i can see them coming back.
only party? Shurely shome mishtake , ed?


And the position is they are assuming election post Brexit it, so re-entry
« Last Edit: June 28, 2016, 12:44:25 AM by Nearly Sane »

L.A.

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Re: Red on Red, Labour implode
« Reply #44 on: June 28, 2016, 08:46:07 AM »
. . .

Next the Tories kick the shit out of each other...

Hopefully they will just 'kick the shit' out of Boris and select May as PM.
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jakswan

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Re: Red on Red, Labour implode
« Reply #45 on: June 28, 2016, 11:10:17 AM »
only party? Shurely shome mishtake , ed?

And the position is they are assuming election post Brexit it, so re-entry

The only party that stands for all British people, divisive nationalists excluded.
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L.A.

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Re: Red on Red, Labour implode
« Reply #46 on: June 28, 2016, 11:20:00 AM »
The only party that stands for all British people, divisive nationalists excluded.

Whatever happened to the LibDems? Do they still exist?
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jeremyp

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Re: Red on Red, Labour implode
« Reply #47 on: June 28, 2016, 11:21:35 AM »
The only party that stands for all British people, divisive nationalists excluded.
That would be a problem since the divisive nationalists seem to have a 52% to 48% majority.
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jakswan

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Re: Red on Red, Labour implode
« Reply #48 on: June 28, 2016, 01:24:43 PM »
That would be a problem since the divisive nationalists seem to have a 52% to 48% majority.

In the region they represent. You can argue the Tories only stand for the rich, that Labour the unemployed and poor, both parties would argue otherwise, the SNP stand for Scottish people only.
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Re: Red on Red, Labour implode
« Reply #49 on: June 28, 2016, 05:21:34 PM »
Although Corbyn has lost the no confidence vote, 172 to 40 with 4 abstentions, he is still refusing to resign!