Desperate? To get people in church

[Bubbles]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/article/36814165/man-in-new-zealand-quits-his-job-to-play-pokemon-go-full-time

A little off topic! The guy must have several screws loose!

It's not him that has several screws loose, but us reliable solid characters that go to work every day. ( or those of us that choose the safe, secure path)

It's not much different to when my youngest took a chance by leaving his employment to tour Europe with a friend for 3 months.
No responsibilities of a family yet, so why not?  He saved the money he needed himself.

When he came back they gave him a pay rise, and he got his old job back anyway.

Perhaps the man in the article has saved up enough to leave work to do what he wants to do, and he wants to play Pokemon.

Different things suit different people.

Wouldn't it be lovely to just go off and do something else for a bit?

We only live once, and we all hang onto security.............

But really, sometimes I don't think it's the best choice.

We all seem to live like we are going to always have time, and chances are we don't.

Sometimes it pays to go for it, take a chance, experience something.


I do wish I didn't always chicken out and go for the sensible path 

[Brownie]

There is still time Rose.

[~TW~]

Such as?

How about the whale once had legs then  evolved his legs off his body  and went into the sea.

 ~TW~

[Hope]

Please give their  names and locations and let's see how quickly we can get them sacked.

OK, here are a couple to be getting on with - Sir John Houghton, Dr Denis Alexander, Revd Dr John Weaver.

[Hope]

Come on Hope - names and addresses please!

Well, you only really need their names in most cases.  The 3 I've given you are easily found on the internet.

[bluehillside Retd.]

Hope,

OK, here are a couple to be getting on with - Sir John Houghton, Dr Denis Alexander, Revd Dr John Weaver.

First, here is your claim:

In that case, perhas you ought to inform the various scientists that I know and who tell me this kind of thing that they, too, are 'ID nut-cases'.  As I am not an expert in this particular field, I have to rely on those who are.

Which of these three do you “know" then?

Second, none of them are evolutionary biologists and so none of them are “experts in this particular field” as you put it.

Third, let’s see who they really are then:

John T. Houghton is the president of the John Ray Initiative, an organisation "connecting Environment, Science and Christianity", where he has compared the stewardship of the Earth, to the stewardship of the Garden of Eden by Adam and Eve.

Denis Alexander is the Emeritus Director of the Faraday Institute for Science and Religion at St Edmund's College, Cambridge, a molecular biologist and an author on science and religion. He is also an editor of Science and Christian Belief. He is an evangelical Christian.

John B. Weaver grew up in Goshen, Arkansas, the grandson of two Church of Christ preachers. He completed his undergraduate work at University of Arkansas. He completed his Ph.D. in 2004 at Emory University. He worked as a theological librarian before starting his career at Abilene Christian University in 2011. While at ACU, he has served as the dean of library services and educational technology. Weaver also served as the president of the American Theological Library Association. He has authored one book, Plots of Epiphany.

So rather than quote evolutionary biologists who will show you the overwhelming evidence for the process that led to the emergence of anatomically modern humans you rely instead on three practising Christians of varying degrees of evangelism and no apparent knowledge of the subject at hand to confirm your bias then.

Why not throw in Billy Graham while you're about it?

Good effort.

[bluehillside Retd.]

Hope,

Well, you only really need their names in most cases.  The 3 I've given you are easily found on the internet.

Unfortunately for you, yes they are.

[Owlswing]

Hope,

First, here is your claim:

Which of these three do you “know" then?

Second, none of them are evolutionary biologists and so none of them are “experts in this particular field” as you put it.

Third, let’s see who they really are then:

John T. Houghton is the president of the John Ray Initiative, an organisation "connecting Environment, Science and Christianity", where he has compared the stewardship of the Earth, to the stewardship of the Garden of Eden by Adam and Eve.

Denis Alexander is the Emeritus Director of the Faraday Institute for Science and Religion at St Edmund's College, Cambridge, a molecular biologist and an author on science and religion. He is also an editor of Science and Christian Belief. He is an evangelical Christian.

John B. Weaver grew up in Goshen, Arkansas, the grandson of two Church of Christ preachers. He completed his undergraduate work at University of Arkansas. He completed his Ph.D. in 2004 at Emory University. He worked as a theological librarian before starting his career at Abilene Christian University in 2011. While at ACU, he has served as the dean of library services and educational technology. Weaver also served as the president of the American Theological Library Association. He has authored one book, Plots of Epiphany.

So rather than quote evolutionary biologists who will show you the overwhelming evidence for the process that led to the emergence of anatomically modern humans you rely instead on three practising Christians of varying degrees of evangelism and no apparent knowledge of the subject at hand to confirm your bias then.

Why not throw in Billy Graham while you're about it?

Good effort.

Thanks Blue (are you a red-head?)

You have reached the same results and conclusions that I did but your summation as a post is rather more erudite and understandable than mine would ever have been so I have scrapped mine rather than show up my advancing senility!

[bluehillside Retd.]

Owls,

Thanks Blue (are you a red-head?)

Um, no!

You have reached the same results and conclusions that I did but your summation as a post is rather more erudite and understandable than mine would ever have been so I have scrapped mine rather than show up my advancing senility!

You're too kind. Hope may have been better advised citing, say, Michael Behe. OK, he's utterly discredited but at least he's popped up in various court cases on the subject at hand and so has some link to the subject, however hopeless his position.

[Owlswing]

Owls,

Um, no!

I had to ask, any Aussie who is nicknamed Blue has been so called because he/she is a red-head! Typical Aussie logic!

[Bubbles]

How about the whale once had legs then  evolved his legs off his body  and went into the sea.

 ~TW~

That's because when they look at the skeleton they can see what is left of the legs.

http://www.livescience.com/7564-early-whales-legs.html

It's a bit like Hippos getting more water orientated than they are now and them not using their legs ( your legs become weak if you don't use them)

I could accept that it may not be quite as some scientists describe it with the prewhale striding over the land, it could be more along the lines of crocodiles living near the water, having legs but swimming.

However I don't dismiss it out of hand just because it doesn't fit with one interpretation of the bible.

[Leonard James]

Hope,

Unfortunately for you, yes they are.

The gullible leading the even more gullible.

[Gordon]

How about the whale once had legs then  evolved his legs off his body  and went into the sea.

 ~TW~

So they did - this (from the Smithsonian) shows the evolutionary history of whales in graphic form.

http://ocean.si.edu/ocean-videos/evolution-whales-animation

[Walt Zingmatilder]

It's not him that has several screws loose, but us reliable solid characters that go to work every day. ( or those of us that choose the safe, secure path)

It's not much different to when my youngest took a chance by leaving his employment to tour Europe with a friend for 3 months.
No responsibilities of a family yet, so why not?  He saved the money he needed himself.

When he came back they gave him a pay rise, and he got his old job back anyway.

Perhaps the man in the article has saved up enough to leave work to do what he wants to do, and he wants to play Pokemon.

Different things suit different people.

Wouldn't it be lovely to just go off and do something else for a bit?

We only live once, and we all hang onto security.............

But really, sometimes I don't think it's the best choice.

We all seem to live like we are going to always have time, and chances are we don't.

Sometimes it pays to go for it, take a chance, experience something.


I do wish I didn't always chicken out and go for the sensible path 

Yes isn't he what is referred to as a man baby?

[floo]

How about the whale once had legs then  evolved his legs off his body  and went into the sea.

 ~TW~

Maybe they did.

[~TW~]

So they did - this (from the Smithsonian) shows the evolutionary history of whales in graphic form.

http://ocean.si.edu/ocean-videos/evolution-whales-animation

Is that after nothing went bang. 
~TW~

[Gordon]

Is that after nothing went bang. 
~TW~

Well after your unique take on the 'Big Bang' - by several billion years.

[jeremyp]

No more so than some of the hypothetical evolutionary stories that are taught in schools without any solid evidence.

Please name some of those hypothetical evolutionary stories that are taught in schools without any solid evidence.

[jeremyp]

Currently there is no definitive link between humanoids and other animals.  In schools, the idea is taught as fact,whereas it should be being taught as a hypothesis until such time as a link is actually found.

What do you mean by "definitive"?

Are you seriously trying to persuade us that humans are not animals? Because I can show you plenty of evidence that humans are mammals. Isn't the fact that we share over 95% of our DNA with chimpanzees enough for you?

[floo]

What do you mean by "definitive"?

Are you seriously trying to persuade us that humans are not animals? Because I can show you plenty of evidence that humans are mammals. Isn't the fact that we share over 95% of our DNA with chimpanzees enough for you?

Dear, dear, didn't you know humans descended from Adam and Eve, whom god sculptured in its own image. Oh blimey, I have to start pig counting again as they fly passed my window!  

[Brownie]

What do you mean by "definitive"?

Are you seriously trying to persuade us that humans are not animals? Because I can show you plenty of evidence that humans are mammals. Isn't the fact that we share over 95% of our DNA with chimpanzees enough for you?

I don't think he said that humans are not animals because he said, "...humanoids (meaning us) and other animals"'  he would have said, "...humanoids and animals", had he meant we are not part of the animal kingdom.

Hope has never said we are literally descended from Adam and Eve, floo.

[bluehillside Retd.]

Brownie,

I don't think he said that humans are not animals because he said, "...humanoids (meaning us) and other animals"'  he would have said, "...humanoids and animals", had he meant we are not part of the animal kingdom.

But what he did say was:

Currently there is no definitive link between humanoids and other animals.

There's so much wrong with that sentence that it's hard to know where to begin.

First, there's no "definitive" link between apples falling to the ground and gravity either (I'm assuming, perhaps naively, that he could even tell us what he means by "humanoid" here by the way). Science doesn't do definitives. What it does do though is to identify and test the overwhelming correlative evidence for evolution and gravity alike, and it develops its finding into theories: evolutionary theory; gravity theory; germs causing disease theory; babies coming from Mums' tummies rather than from storks flying through open windows theory etc.

Second, the "link"(s) between anatomically modern humans and other species are so strong that evolutionary theory is arguably better evidenced than, for example, the theory of gravity.

Third, Hope told us first that he knew "scientists" who deny evolutionary biology, then it seems that these supposed scientist weren't known to him at all, then it turns out that they were not in all cases scientists anyway (one is a librarian at a theological college for example), and then that they're not even specialists in the field in which Hope thinks them to be "experts".

Apparently oblivious to all that, Hope then told us that his three sources could be looked up on the internet!

Apart from that though... 

Still - there was one scrap of good news about his efforts: he managed to make a whole post without mentioning Nepal. Credit where credit's due I say.

[Enki]

I don't think he said that humans are not animals because he said, "...humanoids (meaning us) and other animals"'  he would have said, "...humanoids and animals", had he meant we are not part of the animal kingdom.

Hope has never said we are literally descended from Adam and Eve, floo.

Assuming that he meant human(meaning us) rather than humanoid(which has an entirely different meaning) and assuming that he meant that we are part of the animal kingdom(which you also assume he meant), then he has contradicted himself in that one sentence by suggesting that there is no definitive link between us and the other animals. The fact that we are part of the animal kingdom is in fact a major link which, if you are right, Hope entirely accepts and contradicts all at the same time.

I confess that I have no real idea what he is trying to say here. Perhaps he may attempt to elucidate.