Evangelising young children

[BeRational]

I am, yes.

Is it by personal revelation, in which case that only applies to you, or do you have good evidence to support your belief?

If your reasons for believing can be picked apart to be shown to have fallacies or assertions, would you then question your belief?

[Walt Zingmatilder]

I lack belief as that is the default position (for everyone)

The question is ALWAYS, why DO you believe.

Do you believe a god exists?

Unfortunately, for you, if you concede that God is a possibility you must also explain why you lack belief in him.
Even worse than that is that possible answers of explanation for your lack of belief can be put forward quite logically.

You use the word default position shamanically.  Again your POV is opinion.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Is it by personal revelation, in which case that only applies to you, or do you have good evidence to support your belief?

If your reasons for believing can be picked apart to be shown to have fallacies or assertions, would you then question your belief?

Everything held must be because it has been revealed to one personally.

How can you explain why you are arguing that Christianity is unique to me when it is held by others.


In terms of picking the reasons for belief apart you as a mere uncommitted agnostic have less cause to have attempt a picking apart of personal experience than I have unless you are a stinking lying atheist of the type who pretends to a lack of belief.

 The picking apart has been picked apart.

[BeRational]

Unfortunately, for you, if you concede that God is a possibility you must also explain why you lack belief in him.
Even worse than that is that possible answers of explanation for your lack of belief can be put forward quite logically.

You use the word default position shamanically.  Again your POV is opinion.

You are wrong.

Everything is a possibility, but I do not have to answer to an infinite number of things that might be true.
The way it works, is that you have to explain and have evidence for the stuff you DO believe to be true.

The default position for everyone is to NOT belief a position until such time as that position is supported by compelling evidence.

What evidence compels you to believe in a god?

[BeRational]

Everything held must be because it has been revealed to one personally.

How can you explain why you are arguing that Christianity is unique to me when it is held by others.


In terms of picking the reasons for belief apart you as a mere uncommitted agnostic have less cause to have attempt a picking apart of personal experience than I have unless you are a stinking lying atheist of the type who pretends to a lack of belief.

 The picking apart has been picked apart.

I do not believe that  all Christians believe the same thing at all. They just have the same name for the belief set.
In fact I do not believe there are 2 Christians as I think they all believe something different and personal to them. Find 5 people that call themselves Christian, and you have found 5 christianities, each one personal.


I lack believe in your and in fact every body elses god, and that is not a lie, why would you think it would be.

I have not had a personal revelation, and I have seen no evidence up to the job of convincing me there is a god.

To date, no god believer has put forward any evidence that is no logically flawed or full of assertions.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

You are wrong.

Everything is a possibility, but I do not have to answer to an infinite number of things that might be true.
The way it works, is that you have to explain and have evidence for the stuff you DO believe to be true.

The default position for everyone is to NOT belief a position until such time as that position is supported by compelling evidence.

What evidence compels you to believe in a god?

If everything is possible then some things are going to be contradictory.

For now let's leave aside your contention that atheism is the default and the necessity for you to establish that positive assertion.

You are not yet an atheist if you believe that God is possible but an agnostic. By definition you cannot lack a belief in God since you consider God a possibility.

You cannot therefore lack belief in God.

We are left then to ponder your commitment to atheism.

No doubt your justification for lacking belief in God in the face of God being a possibility is due to compelling evidence.....or should that be a lack of compelling evidence? In which case you have to at least explain how compelling the evidence needs to be.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

I do not believe that  all Christians believe the same thing at all. They just have the same name for the belief set.
In fact I do not believe there are 2 Christians as I think they all believe something different and personal to them. Find 5 people that call themselves Christian, and you have found 5 christianities, each one personal.


I lack believe in your and in fact every body elses god, and that is not a lie, why would you think it would be.

I have not had a personal revelation, and I have seen no evidence up to the job of convincing me there is a god.

To date, no god believer has put forward any evidence that is no logically flawed or full of assertions.

Again, your five different christianities is merely an opinion. Demonstrate you are not exaggerating the differences at the expense of the similarities.

[Maeght]

By definition you cannot lack a belief in God since you consider God a possibility.

You cannot therefore lack belief in God.

Of course you can.

[BeRational]

If everything is possible then some things are going to be contradictory.

For now let's leave aside your contention that atheism is the default and the necessity for you to establish that positive assertion.

You are not yet an atheist if you believe that God is possible but an agnostic. By definition you cannot lack a belief in God since you consider God a possibility.

You cannot therefore lack belief in God.

We are left then to ponder your commitment to atheism.

No doubt your justification for lacking belief in God in the face of God being a possibility is due to compelling evidence.....or should that be a lack of compelling evidence? In which case you have to at least explain how compelling the evidence needs to be.

My lawn has either an odd number or even number of blades of grass. This is a simple fact.

I do not believe it has an even number, and nor do I believe it has an odd number.

I have no evidence to form a belief one way or another, so I lack a belief in the odd or evenness of the number.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Of course you can.

Why...of course?

I think it's commitment you lack......with a bit of a reverse Pascal's wager thrown in.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

My lawn has either an odd number or even number of blades of grass. This is a simple fact.

I do not believe it has an even number, and nor do I believe it has an odd number.

I have no evidence to form a belief one way or another, so I lack a belief in the odd or evenness of the number.

In other words you are agnostic about it.


Also you have said you do not believe in God but the God Free status quo of the universe.....and yet you consider God to be a possibility.......You have therefore committed to the universe being God free. Why have you done this? and how is it indeed possible if you consider God to be a possibility.

Sounds like you want your cake and eat it.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

My lawn has either an odd number or even number of blades of grass. This is a simple fact.

I do not believe it has an even number, and nor do I believe it has an odd number.

I have no evidence to form a belief one way or another, so I lack a belief in the odd or evenness of the number.

Get out and count them you lazy b*****.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Sorry to bring this up Be Rational but earlier on you did say that Atheism was the default position.

Could you now justify that positive assertion.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

My lawn has either an odd number or even number of blades of grass. This is a simple fact.

I do not believe it has an even number, and nor do I believe it has an odd number.

I have no evidence to form a belief one way or another, so I lack a belief in the odd or evenness of the number.

You believe that they could be either odd or even.
So you have a belief about the oddness and evenness of the number.

[BeRational]

Sorry to bring this up Be Rational but earlier on you did say that Atheism was the default position.

Could you now justify that positive assertion.

Not believing things is the default position.
So atheism is the default position on the existence of gods.
Simple. This is basic logic.

[BeRational]

You believe that they could be either odd or even.
So you have a belief about the oddness and evenness of the number.

I believe that one will be true, but I have no way to form a believe about which one.

In the same way your god either exists or it does not, a bit like the odd or even situation.

Again, I have no data or evidence to come down on one position so I do not believe either.

So should you, unless you have compelling evidence which cannot be shown to be logically flawed.

Do you have such evidence?

[Sebastian Toe]

In other words you are agnostic about it.


Also you have said you do not believe in God but the God Free status quo of the universe.....and yet you consider God to be a possibility.......You have therefore committed to the universe being God free. Why have you done this? and how is it indeed possible if you consider God to be a possibility.

Sounds like you want your cake and eat it.

You seem to have committed to a one God universe. Is that correct?

[BeRational]

Get out and count them you lazy b*****.

At least that is possible, and then I would believe.

What can I do to determine god?

[Spud]

At least that is possible, and then I would believe.

What can I do to determine god?

Read the Bible?

[BeRational]

Read the Bible?

Ok why would that help?
I assume you know there are other holy book for other gods, but that has not persuaded you, so the existence of a book is not the driver.

Why would I believe stuff written in a book.

That is not evidence of a god, that is evidence that people believed in a god.

I already know that people believe in a god, I just cannot understand why.

[Maeght]

Why...of course?

I think it's commitment you lack......with a bit of a reverse Pascal's wager thrown in.

I'm sure you do, but that's not the case. I have absolutely no belief in god or Gods, but accept I could be wrong and gods or God may exist, I just don't currently have a belief in any. You cannot prove a negative so cannot say with certainty that there is no God or gods but I certainly have no belief in any.

[Spud]

Ok why would that help?

Because unbelief is not the default position until you check out possible evidence.

[Étienne d'Angleterre]

......unless you are a stinking lying atheist of the type who pretends to a lack of belief.

So not an atheist then. Just a dishonest believer.

Come on then mane names. Who are the dishonest believers around here?

[ippy]

Sorry Brownie, I didn't notice, been a bit on the busy side, I was only trying to have a little gentile fun with Floo, nothing sinister.

Haven't you ever noticed how Jewish men don white scarves for all sorts of religious occasions and ceremonies, only Floo you did mention your husbands circumstance.

ippy
   

[Étienne d'Angleterre]

Because unbelief is not the default position until you check out possible evidence.

So do you personally hold mutually contradictory views as true until you have reviewed the evidence?