Sour Grapes All Round!

[Anchorman]

Dear Jack, Jim and Jeremyp, ( the three "J's" sounds like a soul band )

Well that is three names I will keep in mind when you all eat humble pie.

Gonaagle.

Sorry,

Gonnagle.

I am enjoying a large Bells or two, sue me.
[/quote







Bells?
Sue you?
Nope. Send you for a taste bud check, well, possibly.......

[Anchorman]

Dear Jack, Course he is, the media have told you Gonnagle.

- I might agree with a few of his policies; however, he needs to appeal, not only to his members (and unite them....which is an impossibility), but  also connect with those 'middle England' voters (horrible phrase) who lent their votes to elect Blair. He has virtually no chance. I'm no Labour supporter (who'd have guessed), but Corbyn has condemned britain to ten years of increasingly nasty Tory misrule. I really wish I was wrong about that.

[Harrowby Hall]

Indeed.

Jeremy Corbyn - allied with our lack of a more representative voting system and David Cameron's failure to consider any Constitutional review after the Scottish referendum - has ensured that the United Kingdom is effectively a one party state.

[ProfessorDavey]

That's not what I said.

In response to my statement that the only way that the rebate could be removed would be if the UK itself voted for its removal (as the budget must be agreed by all member states) you said that the EU doesn't follow it's own rules, so it is perfectly reasonable to ask you for an example where the EU has over-ruled a veto from a member state on an issue where all member states must agree for the issue to be passed.

Your evasion is noted, as, of course, you cannot give me an example.

[Jack Knave]

Dear Jack,

Course he is, the media have told you

Gonnagle.

No. Because I'm not blind. I know an idiot when I see one.

[Jack Knave]

In response to my statement that the only way that the rebate could be removed would be if the UK itself voted for its removal (as the budget must be agreed by all member states) you said that the EU doesn't follow it's own rules, so it is perfectly reasonable to ask you for an example where the EU has over-ruled a veto from a member state on an issue where all member states must agree for the issue to be passed.

Your evasion is noted, as, of course, you cannot give me an example.

I said they don't follow their own rules - that's all their rules, not just the ones with vetoes. I'm sure you know of some of their rules they have not kept to.

[Gonnagle]

Dear Jack,

No. Because I'm not blind. I know an idiot when I see one.

That's great, will you include Farage, Cameron and Blair when asked about idiots, just asking

Gonnagle.

[jeremyp]

I said they don't follow their own rules - that's all their rules,

Do you menthe follow none of their rules or some but not all of their rules.

not just the ones with vetoes.

You haven't yet shown that they don't honour vetoes yet.

[Jack Knave]

Dear Jack,

That's great, will you include Farage, Cameron and Blair when asked about idiots, just asking

Gonnagle.

I include those who are idiots not ones you think are ones. Cameron and Blair were not idiots just evil. Farage is a saint! 

[Jack Knave]

Do you menthe follow none of their rules or some but not all of their rules.

If the rules frustrate their wet dream of ever closer union or threaten to take it backwards then they ignore them and do what the will.

You haven't yet shown that they don't honour vetoes yet.

That's besides the point as I clearly explained. A few more turns of those bolts might just do it.

[jeremyp]

If the rules frustrate their wet dream of ever closer union or threaten to take it backwards then they ignore them and do what the will.

And yet you don't seem to be able to come up with any examples.

That's besides the point as I clearly explained. A few more turns of those bolts might just do it.

No it's exactly the point. Your claim was that we would lose our rebate because the EU would ignore our veto but you seem to be completely incapable of showing that they could do that.

[Jack Knave]

And yet you don't seem to be able to come up with any examples.

The 3% deficit rules of the Eurozone which both Germany and France broke in the first year and then carried on and did nothing to put their economies straight in regards to this. Hence the shit state of the Euro.

No it's exactly the point. Your claim was that we would lose our rebate because the EU would ignore our veto but you seem to be completely incapable of showing that they could do that.

That was not my claim. My claim was that they break their own rules when it suits them - or they would change them just to suit their delusional ideology.

[ProfessorDavey]

I said they don't follow their own rules - that's all their rules, not just the ones with vetoes. I'm sure you know of some of their rules they have not kept to.

So if they don't follow all their rules that would necessarily include vetoes.

So again I ask for an example where the EU has over-ruled a veto from a member state on an issue where all member states must agree for the issue to be passed.

[jeremyp]

The 3% deficit rules of the Eurozone which both Germany and France broke in the first year and then carried on and did nothing to put their economies straight in regards to this. Hence the shit state of the Euro.

The Eurozone is not the EU.

Whose veto did France and Germany ignore?

That was not my claim. My claim was that they break their own rules when it suits them - or they would change them just to suit their delusional ideology.

Your claim was that we would lose our rebate because the EU would ignore our veto. If you have conceded that that particular claim is false, that's fine by me.

[Jack Knave]

So if they don't follow all their rules that would necessarily include vetoes.

So again I ask for an example where the EU has over-ruled a veto from a member state on an issue where all member states must agree for the issue to be passed.

Moderator: content removed Your logic in this is nonsensical.

[Jack Knave]

The Eurozone is not the EU.

Whose veto did France and Germany ignore?
Your claim was that we would lose our rebate because the EU would ignore our veto. If you have conceded that that particular claim is false, that's fine by me.

They would find away. They would change the rules. Blackmail and the like. They don't play fair.

[ProfessorDavey]

Moderator: content removed Your logic in this is nonsensical.

No idea what comment was removed.

But of course my comment isn't nonsense. You claimed that the EU don't follow all their rules. So that must necessarily involve their rule of member state veto in certain decisions where all member states must agree.

So once again, an example please where the EU has over-ruled a veto from a member state on an issue where all member states must agree for the issue to be passed.

Of course you can't answer, because there never has been such a case.

[Jack Knave]

No idea what comment was removed.

But of course my comment isn't nonsense. You claimed that the EU don't follow all their rules. So that must necessarily involve their rule of member state veto in certain decisions where all member states must agree.

So once again, an example please where the EU has over-ruled a veto from a member state on an issue where all member states must agree for the issue to be passed.

Of course you can't answer, because there never has been such a case.

That's a straw man. If someone cheats in situation A you then will not trust them in situation B even though they may have never cheated in situation B. Your logic is flawed!!!

[jeremyp]

They would find away. They would change the rules. Blackmail and the like. They don't play fair.

No this is just paranoia on your part.

[ProfessorDavey]

That's a straw man. If someone cheats in situation A you then will not trust them in situation B even though they may have never cheated in situation B. Your logic is flawed!!!

No that is completely flawed thinking.

And by inference you seem to be accepting that they don't cheat in situation B, in other words over-ruling a veto from a member state in a decision which requires all member state to agree. Which is what would be required for the UK's rebate to be removed. Or rather it would require the UK to vote for its removal.

So thanks, via a rather oblique route, for confirming that the EU cannot remove the UK's rebate (unless the UK itself agrees).

[ProfessorDavey]

They would find away. They would change the rules. Blackmail and the like. They don't play fair.

Hmm - what a bit like a campaign that was entirely focussed on bringing back control to our sovereign parliament, and then denies that parliament any say or proper involvement in the most important decision facing the UK in most of our lifetimes.

I'd call that not playing fair.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Surely to goodness we don't need anymore evidence that Brexit crashed the car.
How can there not now be mass unemployment with such a rise in import prices.

[Jack Knave]

No this is just paranoia on your part.

No, it is back up by the EU's past performance.

[Jack Knave]

No that is completely flawed thinking.

And by inference you seem to be accepting that they don't cheat in situation B, in other words over-ruling a veto from a member state in a decision which requires all member state to agree. Which is what would be required for the UK's rebate to be removed. Or rather it would require the UK to vote for its removal.

So thanks, via a rather oblique route, for confirming that the EU cannot remove the UK's rebate (unless the UK itself agrees).

Learn how to read first before you try replying to forum posts!!!

[ProfessorDavey]

Learn how to read first before you try replying to forum posts!!!

I can and I do - but nice obfuscation - once again avoiding answering the question as to whether the EU has ever over-riddent a member state veto on an issue where all member states must agree.