Immigration

[Walter]

Survival of the fittest comes to mind. how's that for an idea

[Nearly Sane]

Survival of the fittest comes to mind. how's that for an idea

Does gravity make dying if you fall out. 12th story window make it 'right'?

[Walter]

Why do you think right (or wrong) comes into it.
eggs are egg shaped because round ones fall out of nests easier

[The Accountant, OBE, KC]

Survival of the fittest comes to mind. how's that for an idea

Not exactly a vote winner. Maybe we should do away with governments...anarchy and survival of the fittest sounds like those countries the immigrants are running away from.

[Walter]

maybe we should get rid of party politics and replace government with individuals . Oh and I was responding to your bleeding heart emotional description of  the NHS, old people, and schools. And those people would not be running away if their own countries were not controlled by religious medieval nutters who have repressed human endeavour in order to keep so called learned people in power. I despise them.

[The Accountant, OBE, KC]

maybe we should get rid of party politics and replace government with individuals . Oh and I was responding to your bleeding heart emotional description of  the NHS, old people, and schools. And those people would not be running away if their own countries were not controlled by religious medieval nutters who have repressed human endeavour in order to keep so called learned people in power. I despise them.

Bleeding heart? Which part specifically in my description was bleeding heart?

You don't seem to be in denial that we have an aging population. You don't seem to be in denial that there is pressure on public services. That makes you a bleeding heart as well for acknowledging those facts. Your solution is survival of the fittest, which the voters don't like because the rich benefit.

Also, last time I checked Assad and the Russians who are bombing their own people, resulting in the mass exodus, are not religious medieval nutters. Your simplistic slogans are a complete waste of time in the face of complex international problems.

[Walter]

So whats wrong with the rich benefitting, I'm one of them.
and regarding whats happening in the  the middle east, I don't care

[The Accountant, OBE, KC]

There are more poor people than rich people so a government with your proposed slogan would not get elected. Bit like Corbyn's problems.

While our economy is propped up by arms sales and Middle East money and oil, and you probably do care.

[Walter]

If I said what I really think I would be in prison before I'd finished typing

[Hope]

So whats wrong with the rich benefitting, I'm one of them.

In global terms, we are all amongst the rich - which is why most of us don't seem to care

... and regarding whats happening in the  the middle east, I don't care

I suspect that you do care far more than you care to let on - after all, what is happening in the Middle East effects fuel prices, energy prices, food prices, ....

[Hope]

maybe we should get rid of party politics and replace government with individuals . Oh and I was responding to your bleeding heart emotional description of  the NHS, old people, and schools. And those people would not be running away if their own countries were not controlled by religious medieval nutters who have repressed human endeavour in order to keep so called learned people in power. I despise them.

Many of said emigrants are escaping from poverty that, whilst excerbated by poor governments (by no means all of them "religious medieval nutters who have repressed human endeavour"), can be laid directly or indirectly at the feet of European and perhaps especially British imperialism.  In a different post, you say that you are one of the wealthy - how much of that wealth has ultimately come from the historical subjugation of other nations?

[Walter]

Hope,
its across I have to bear.

[Hope]

Hope,
its across I have to bear.

What's a cross you have to bear?

[The Accountant, OBE, KC]

Hope,
its across I have to bear.

Glad you are taking that attitude Walt - part of the cross the wealthy have to bear is that the wealthy people need workers to do all the work wealthy people either don't want to do, are too stupid to do, or where it will be more profitable if they paid someone else to do it, such as paying the salaries of politicians to form a government to run the country. If those politicians decide to let in lots of immigrants, then that too is a cross the wealthy have to bear, though I doubt having access to cheap labour is that much of a hardship for wealthy people.

Of course if they don't like it, the wealthy people are more than welcome to form a political party and try to convince the electorate that said wealthy people are not too stupid to run the country and are worth electing.

More importantly, as a wealthy person you have nothing to whinge about  - private health care is affordable, helping you by-pass any immigration-fuelled NHS waiting lists and giving you access to private hospitals; private schools are affordable, so no problem about pressure on the State school system from too many immigrants; better chance of getting into a Russell Group university given the head start from attending a private school; well-paid job attainable given the good school and university qualifications; home ownership in a relatively safe affluent area is affordable, given the good job, as are private pensions; and at least 2 or 3 long-haul holidays a year in fairly exclusive destinations to get away from immigrants also possible for the wealthy.

Walt - you must consider yourself a fortunate person to be living in the U.K. today.

[Harrowby Hall]

What Gabriella said.

[Walter]

Glad you are taking that attitude Walt - part of the cross the wealthy have to bear is that the wealthy people need  electorate
More importantly, as a wealthy person you have nothing to whinge about  - private health care is affordable, helping you by-pass any immigration-fuelled NHS waiting lists and giving you access to private hospitals; private schools are affordable, so no problem about pressure on the State school system from too many immigrants; better chance of getting into a Russell Group university given the head start from attending a private school; well-paid job attainable given the good school and university qualifications; home ownership in a relatively safe affluent area is affordable, given the good job, as are private pensions; and at least 2 or 3 long-haul holidays a year in fairly exclusive destinations to get away from immigrants also possible for the wealthy.

Walt - you must consider yourself a fortunate person to be living in the U.K. today.

I have every right to be here and yes all of the above applies thank you.

[The Accountant, OBE, KC]

Every right to be where? No one said you don't have a right - all I said was that you don't really have anything to whinge about if you are wealthy. But you have a right to whinge anyway - absolutely - if that's what you meant by "here". I am quite enjoying your whinging to be honest.

[Walter]

Aww that's nice,  I love you too, mwah

[floo]

Many of said emigrants are escaping from poverty that, whilst excerbated by poor governments (by no means all of them "religious medieval nutters who have repressed human endeavour"), can be laid directly or indirectly at the feet of European and perhaps especially British imperialism.  In a different post, you say that you are one of the wealthy - how much of that wealth has ultimately come from the historical subjugation of other nations?

Good post.

[ad_orientem]

Hi everyone,

In the context of increasing resistance to immigration in Europe and other countries, I have never really understood what these developed countries hope to achieve by allowing literally millions of migrants into their country.

If it is about humanistic policies and a wish to alleviate their suffering, then...how many more of such millions are they going to allow in the future?  There are literally billions of very poor people in developing/underdeveloped countries. Are all these people going to be allowed over the years? Does this actually help these migrants and the locals?  Is it merely to find people to do the low level jobs that the locals don't want to do? 

I can understand temporary refugees being allowed because of war or natural disasters and who would be sent back once the situation improves. But taking in migrants just on the basis of poverty is dysfunctional.   

I would have thought that sending in expert teams and investing lots of money in these poor countries to help them change their economic conditions would have been more useful and more workable in the long run.

Any views?

Cheers.

Sriram

The mass immigration we see today is the work of the neo-liberal globalist elite and even darker forces intent on eradicating any last vestige of a Christian and ethnic Europe, forces which I won't mention here.

[Anchorman]

"Christian and ethnic Europe"? Is that the same Christian Europe which has actually READ the Gospels, ad-o? Dunno about you, but my New Testament has some rather uncomfortable things to say about neighbours (and I don't mean the soap opera), strangers, the hungry, naked, sick, prisoners, enemies, etc. Every time I read it, I'm challenged to see just how open to the Gospel I am - and sometimes that's not as open as I should be.

[ad_orientem]

"Christian and ethnic Europe"? Is that the same Christian Europe which has actually READ the Gospels, ad-o? Dunno about you, but my New Testament has some rather uncomfortable things to say about neighbours (and I don't mean the soap opera), strangers, the hungry, naked, sick, prisoners, enemies, etc. Every time I read it, I'm challenged to see just how open to the Gospel I am - and sometimes that's not as open as I should be.

What is happening has nothing to do with love thy neighbour. Importing people from poor countries is solely about obtaining a workforce who will work for peanuts.

[Walter]

"Christian and ethnic Europe"? Is that the same Christian Europe which has actually READ the Gospels, ad-o? Dunno about you, but my New Testament has some rather uncomfortable things to say about neighbours (and I don't mean the soap opera), strangers, the hungry, naked, sick, prisoners, enemies, etc. Every time I read it, I'm challenged to see just how open to the Gospel I am - and sometimes that's not as open as I should be.

be open . say what you think. give it a go

[Anchorman]

Be open? OK...... With apologies to Ad-O, it has everything to do with love, in its' most practical form. Many of these people need our help - whether that is in relocating, rehabilitating, education, whatever. We cannot in conscience simply ignore them if they come here. We might want to - and I've felt resentment and the occasional 'Why us' rising to the surface. Call it conscience, or call it the Holy Spirit you don't accept's prompting, but the answer "Why not us? Why shouldn't we be the ones to help" sometimes trumps it (And that's 'trump' with a small 't')

[Gonnagle]

Dear Jim,

"Christian and ethnic Europe"? Is that the same Christian Europe which has actually READ the Gospels, ad-o? Dunno about you, but my New Testament has some rather uncomfortable things to say about neighbours (and I don't mean the soap opera), strangers, the hungry, naked, sick, prisoners, enemies, etc. Every time I read it, I'm challenged to see just how open to the Gospel I am - and sometimes that's not as open as I should be.

Amen.

Some read the Gospel others breathe the Gospel.

Gonnagle.