Brexit - the next steps

[Gordon]

It is being reported, in the Guardian live blog quoting Stella Creasy,  that part of the price the government would pay to get DUP support for their EU deal would be to find a way to stop the imminent changes to abortion and SSM law in NI - if true, this would be shameful.

There is a story on this on the BBC, which suggests it is unlikely there is now enough time to prevent the changes to abortion and SSM law that are due to kick-in next week.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-50062998

[Nearly Sane]

And meanwhile in Labour



https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-50077384

[Gordon]

Interesting move from one of the lawyers involved in winning the prorogation case in the Court of Session - he's going back to the same court to seek an interdict to prevent Johnson putting his 'deal' to the vote in the HoC saying it would be illegal, though he can know this for certain without seeing the detail isn't clear.

Still - it all adds to the entertainment produced by Brexit (which is, of course, a farce).

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-50076186

[Gordon]

Seems the DUP won't play ball, so no doubt Johnson will by now be dipping into his wallet.

From the Guardian Live politics blog.

The DUP has issued a statement from Arlene Foster and Nigel Dodds saying that “as things stand, we could not support what is being suggested on customs and consent issues and there is a lack of clarity on VAT.

“We will continue to work with the Government to try and get a sensible deal that works for Northern Ireland and protects the economic and constitutional integrity of the United Kingdom.”

Now reported on the BBC.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-50077760

[Nearly Sane]

Interesting move from one of the lawyers involved in winning the prorogation case in the Court of Session - he's going back to the same court to seek an interdict to prevent Johnson putting his 'deal' to the vote in the HoC saying it would be illegal, though he can know this for certain without seeing the detail isn't clear.

Still - it all adds to the entertainment produced by Brexit (which is, of course, a farce).

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-50076186

I know many supporting Brexit see the use of the courts as bad, but I am sort of with them on this one - it feels wrong to stop something being put to the Commons.

[Udayana]

Seems the DUP won't play ball, so no doubt Johnson will by now be dipping into his wallet.

From the Guardian Live politics blog.

Now reported on the BBC.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-50077760

In truth I have not understood why the DUP should/would prefer the new proposal over the May WA - they would have been better off under that - with longer term arrangements more carefully thought out.

[Nearly Sane]

A L Kennedy's take in the form of a parody of Jolene - Arlene


https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1184580848185761805.html

[Gordon]

A L Kennedy's take in the form of a parody of Jolene - Arlene


https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1184580848185761805.html

Love it.

[Udayana]

A L Kennedy's take in the form of a parody of Jolene - Arlene


https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1184580848185761805.html

Clearly Arlene will only have him back if she can stuff the deal through the shredder the morning after ...

[jeremyp]

Maybe, but the bragging is still out of order, I don't like it.

Do you not understand that a lot of people are very angry about what the Brexiteer leaders have done to this country?

[jeremyp]

Seems the DUP won't play ball, so no doubt Johnson will by now be dipping into his wallet.

He'll being dipping into all of our wallets.

[Nearly Sane]

He'll being dipping into all of our wallets.

While it has been said of some of the Ulster Unionist that they are more loyal to the half crown than the Crown, this seems a difficult one to get them to agree to - I can't see that they accept the proposal without fundamentally going back on their previous position.

[Roses]

He'll being dipping into all of our wallets.

Mine has got barbed wire wrapped around it.

[Spud]

Do you not understand that a lot of people are very angry about what the Brexiteer leaders have done to this country?

Yes. I did actually shout "stop Brexit" outside the houses of parliament a few weeks ago (but quietly as I'm a bit shy). Back to the caller Martin: I think what he meant was that once free movement of labour ends, they'll have to invest more in training nurses, they won't have any choice. And to be honest, I think a lot of the work could be done by carers.

[Nearly Sane]

I think Johnson is a dangerous lying narcissist but I have to say the production of a deal which he can claim is different enough to May's is an achievement. It doesn't mean it will get passed and given the DUP's refusal, which doesn't seem surprising, it will need a substantial number of Labour rebels to get it through but I think it puts Johnson in a stronger position as with any defeat he will have enough bogey people to blame. And then onto an election.

The possibility of a referendum with no option to stay still seems unlikely to make it. I don't think enough of the DUP/Tory Rebels/Tories without the whip would vote for it.     

[Nearly Sane]

I see the Letwin amendment allowing more discussion and amendments to be tabled has passed in the eight defeat for the govt since Johnson became PM. This makes the vote more likely I suspect for the deal to be voted down, as it waters down any argument based on deal or no deal. Also I see Sinn Fein supporting it which because they won't actually vote must make the passing less likely. A hardline Tory is not going to be comfortable going for a deal that is supported by Sinn Fein, and opposed by the DUP - even if other unionists support it.

[Christine]

Brexiteers?  Spartans?  We should all stop playing their game and call them what they are: right-wing sociopaths who've bled every penny they can out of the public purse for the last 10 years for their own benefit and are now using Brexit to game the international money markets for their own benefit while we suffer.

https://fullfact.org/economy/pound-fallen-since-brexit/
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/10/08/brexit-latest-news-boris-johnson-no-deal-parliament-prorogation/

I picked the Telegraph because I wouldn't like to be accused of bias.

Spud's posts about nurses demonstrate nicely how some people in this country have been deceived.  Don't like something?  Anything? It's the EU's fault.  Johnson has been telling these lies for decades.  He likened it to throwing rocks over a wall and hearing glass smash. 

Anyone who thinks the Barclay brothers or Rupert Murdoch or Lord Rothermere are not "the elite" hasn't been paying attention.  It doesn't take Miss Marple to work out where their interests lie and it certainly isn't the same place as mine. 

I heard this morning someone on R5 talking about, basically, getting rid of the BBC.  Murdoch might at last get what he's always wanted.  Nice going. 

Of course all this pales into insignificance against the threat posed by having Jeremy Corbyn as a temporary Prime Minister. 

[Robbie]

Excellent.

[ippy]

It is being reported, in the Guardian live blog quoting Stella Creasy,  that part of the price the government would pay to get DUP support for their EU deal would be to find a way to stop the imminent changes to abortion and SSM law in NI - if true, this would be shameful.

There is a story on this on the BBC, which suggests it is unlikely there is now enough time to prevent the changes to abortion and SSM law that are due to kick-in next week.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-50062998

The BBC the Guardian.

Regards, ippy.

[Gordon]

The BBC the Guardian.

Regards, ippy.

Both excellent sources of information and comment in order to provide a basis for thoughtful review and assessment: you should give it a go, ippy.

[Nearly Sane]

So Juncker say there won't be an extension and Farage tweets "So an unelected, retiring bureaucrat says: No extension, take this new treaty or just leave. He is overriding the Benn Act. The EU shows itself to be a thuggocracy - power without accountability. Appalling people."

Guess it isn't the Surrender Act now.

[Nearly Sane]

Why an extension isn't ruled out.

https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk/2019/10/has-eu-really-ruled-out-another-article-50-extension

[Spud]

Currently trying to understand this new deal. Looks like it may be just the thing.

[bluehillside Retd.]

Spud,

Currently trying to understand this new deal. Looks like it may be just the thing.

Only if you think amputating just one leg rather than both legs is "just the thing".

[Spud]

Spud,

Only if you think amputating just one leg rather than both legs is "just the thing".

I only said "may". And it's the Irish border problem in particular. So instead of paying duty at the north-south border, it would be paid at ports in northern Ireland. But then they'll have to track the goods to see where they end up. Hm