A theological question for Unitarians

[ippy]

You must think that this technique of yours is new ippy. It isn't. Just keep throwing the same objections without any consideration what-so-ever to the facts. By rights I should just ignore you but I have a big message to pass on and arguing the toss with snipers of the truth has a useful purpose for my Deity. It might just save one person from the inevitable distress that is getting closer as we argue.

It is an electric universe that triggers all science by way of the conflicts between this high-speed electric energy and the static universe that lies beneath it. This is why people speak of experiences whereby time slips...or they travel hundreds of miles in minutes without any obvious reason...or how space craft can perform amazing maneuvers...or even what causes the gravity manipulations attached to the poltergeist effect...and much more besides.

It's of no consequence to me who are saved and who isn't...I just try to make everyone aware so that those saved will know there is plenty more to the science than just resurrection...and that they have earned the right to that science because of their faith in Jesus Christ.

Now...you might just fool me by saying something different than...yerrrr...but ow does that prove the bible exists wiv owt using the bible.

I've got the first part of your message that you don't answer the questions asked of you, you're democratic I'll give you that, democratic in so much as you don't answer anyone properly, you don't reserve your non-answers for me alone.

If you were to think things out carefully, if, as you say, you're trying to pass over some obscure message, it might lend some credibility to your cause if occasionaly your replies, replies a loose term in your case, were at least relevent to the questions asked.

At the moment your answers are so far away and irrelevent, you spoil your own case, so if as it seems and you say you have an agenda, frankly the words you use where it should be you answering someones legitimate question come over  as another load of silly meaningless words and again you can't be taken seriously because you've sabotaged your own your own agenda, by not having the decency to give a straight answer.

Take us seriously and you never know Nick, we'll probably start to take you seriously it should work both ways Nick.

ippy

[NicholasMarks]

I arrived at that conclusion from the POV of a disabled Christian who has read Scriptures - accurately - without trying to throw in language which has not a jot or tittle to do with either Scripture or science, NM.
Simple.

The accurate teaching of Jesus Christ is what he said and did...not me, Anchorman. I could go out on a limb and show you how iniquity harnesses the good will of many but in fact is feeding the creators of iniquity...but I wont.

There is no reason why you can't look for that truth in parallel with others who are not seeking that level of accuracy but as our own righteous spirit is needed for all righteous improvement we must all try for it because no righteous spirit means no resurrection to everlasting life...and the alternative isn't anything I would wish on anyone.

 

[NicholasMarks]

I've got the first part of your message that you don't answer the questions asked of you, you're democratic I'll give you that, democratic in so much as you don't answer anyone properly, you don't reserve your non-answers for me alone.

If you were to think things out carefully, if, as you say, you're trying to pass over some obscure message, it might lend some credibility to your cause if occasionaly your replies, replies a loose term in your case, were at least relevent to the questions asked.

At the moment your answers are so far away and irrelevent, you spoil your own case, so if as it seems and you say you have an agenda, frankly the words you use where it should be you answering someones legitimate question come over  as another load of silly meaningless words and again you can't be taken seriously because you've sabotaged your own your own agenda, by not having the decency to give a straight answer.

Take us seriously and you never know Nick, we'll probably start to take you seriously it should work both ways Nick.

ippy

On no ippy...I wasn't trained in seeing through the evil art of circular argument not to see it when it is being used against me. It is a significant point to make here because I have a wider interest in this tactic.

We each have a level of emotional/electric/nervous/spiritual strength...but when it is lost we are depressed and our health begins to malfunction and the more it goes on the  more serious those health problems become...I witnessed this in an industrial environment and realised in a way that was proven over and over again that this electric force is robbed by bully's. Every single person who has been on the receiving end of a bully knows how they argue round and round in circles wielding spiteful and nasty remarks until they have sapped their victim of all their strength. Wife beating is one form of it but it get's much worse as the Jews know to their bitter experience. But here is the novel bit...by this experience I know that the cancer cell behaves in exactly the same way as the bully...wildly sending out short sharp shock waves to cause distress, feeding their own wild replication processes in the same way...it seems that Jesus  Christ knows all this as well else why is his teaching telling us how to avoid such bullying...both internally and externally??

 

[ippy]

On no ippy...I wasn't trained in seeing through the evil art of circular argument not to see it when it is being used against me. It is a significant point to make here because I have a wider interest in this tactic.

We each have a level of emotional/electric/nervous/spiritual strength...but when it is lost we are depressed and our health begins to malfunction and the more it goes on the  more serious those health problems become...I witnessed this in an industrial environment and realised in a way that was proven over and over again that this electric force is robbed by bully's. Every single person who has been on the receiving end of a bully knows how they argue round and round in circles wielding spiteful and nasty remarks until they have sapped their victim of all their strength. Wife beating is one form of it but it get's much worse as the Jews know to their bitter experience. But here is the novel bit...by this experience I know that the cancer cell behaves in exactly the same way as the bully...wildly sending out short sharp shock waves to cause distress, feeding their own wild replication processes in the same way...it seems that Jesus  Christ knows all this as well else why is his teaching telling us how to avoid such bullying...both internally and externally??

 

I'm not arguing with you Nick, so there's no circular argument; what is it that makes you so reluctant to give anyone a straight answer to any question you're asked?

You've gone off on a tangent to the question I've asked you, again, what has that lot got to do with you providing verifiable evidence that would support the magical, mysterious and superstition based sections of your bible?

We're  not going around in circles by me asking you to answer my question, all you have to do is answer me, it'difficult to understand why the things you think are answers have nothing to do with my question.

Once you give me this verifiable evidence you say you have I will convert to christianity, obviously I'd need to check that your knowledge can be verified before I was to convert.

I look forward to seeing this verifiable evidence of yours Nick.

ippy

[NicholasMarks]

I've got the first part of your message that you don't answer the questions asked of you, you're democratic I'll give you that, democratic in so much as you don't answer anyone properly, you don't reserve your non-answers for me alone.

If you were to think things out carefully, if, as you say, you're trying to pass over some obscure message, it might lend some credibility to your cause if occasionaly your replies, replies a loose term in your case, were at least relevent to the questions asked.

At the moment your answers are so far away and irrelevent, you spoil your own case, so if as it seems and you say you have an agenda, frankly the words you use where it should be you answering someones legitimate question come over  as another load of silly meaningless words and again you can't be taken seriously because you've sabotaged your own your own agenda, by not having the decency to give a straight answer.

Take us seriously and you never know Nick, we'll probably start to take you seriously it should work both ways Nick.

ippy

It must be obvious to you by now ippy that I have no andwer suitable for you but I do have an answer for all those who might feel depressed, lonely, offended, bullied, without hope, emotionally distressed, etc ect...It is all down to how we handle our spiritual strength...and often it is at the hands of bullying...bullying isn't always obvious. It can take many forms but the thing to look out for is constant and continual attacks on your nervous strength. It gets worse and worse until they are hitting you square on the nose with no fear of redress because you are totally spent. Now....the point of this is that Jesus Christ taught us to harness that inner strength and I can tell you it works...don't take my word for it...take Jesus'...who also teaches us how to repair from very serious conditions using the same science.

Sorry ippy but my message can't wait for obstructers.

 

[Brownie]

It must be obvious to you by now ippy that I have no andwer suitable for you but I do have an answer for all those who might feel depressed, lonely, offended, bullied, without hope, emotionally distressed, etc ect...It is all down to how we handle our spiritual strength...and often it is at the hands of bullying...bullying isn't always obvious. It can take many forms but the thing to look out for is constant and continual attacks on your nervous strength. It gets worse and worse until they are hitting you square on the nose with no fear of redress because you are totally spent. Now....the point of this is that Jesus Christ taught us to harness that inner strength and I can tell you it works...don't take my word for it...take Jesus'...who also teaches us how to repair from very serious conditions using the same science.

Sorry ippy but my message can't wait for obstructers.

You don't understand clinical depression, Nicholas.

All anyone who is depressed wants are a few simple, kind words  &  a bit of quiet, not  preaching and teaching.

Give it a rest man.

[Anchorman]

Yep. One may add depression to the list of things NM has problems comprehending - a list which includes cancer, illness and disability, and which seemingly increases each day. I agree, Brownie; clinical depression is a medically diagnosed condition with many contributing factors, and needs to be treated medically and with sensitivity. Faith DOES help - I hve experience of those for whom faith was an anchor in a sea of blankness - but this condition is medical.

[Walter]

It must be obvious to you by now ippy that I have no andwer suitable for you but I do have an answer for all those who might feel depressed, lonely, offended, bullied, without hope, emotionally distressed, etc ect...It is all down to how we handle our spiritual strength...and often it is at the hands of bullying...bullying isn't always obvious. It can take many forms but the thing to look out for is constant and continual attacks on your nervous strength. It gets worse and worse until they are hitting you square on the nose with no fear of redress because you are totally spent. Now....the point of this is that Jesus Christ taught us to harness that inner strength and I can tell you it works...don't take my word for it...take Jesus'...who also teaches us how to repair from very serious conditions using the same science.

Sorry ippy but my message can't wait for obstructers.

dear oh dear, as long as you're happy!

[Anchorman]

I get the bit about lonliness - since I accepted Christ as Lord I can truly say I've never felt alone, or abandoned, regardless of the situation. I'd add bullying to the list of Stuff NM struggles with. Believe me, when you're a partially sighted teenager whose schoolbag has been stuffed full of human excrement and thrown down a flight of stairs after you have proceded it in the same manner, you know what bullying is.

[NicholasMarks]

I get the bit about lonliness - since I accepted Christ as Lord I can truly say I've never felt alone, or abandoned, regardless of the situation. I'd add bullying to the list of Stuff NM struggles with. Believe me, when you're a partially sighted teenager whose schoolbag has been stuffed full of human excrement and thrown down a flight of stairs after you have proceded it in the same manner, you know what bullying is.

I would say that NM seems to know an awful lot about bullying and oppression...It may be cus he saw a factory full of women herded like animals and saw the impact on their health that maybe he saw it as wrong and tried to do something about it...and perhaps you are getting the benefit of it here.

Perhaps, even...NM   sees the same evil policy being played out world wide and wants you all to know about it before it's too late...but obstructers will block the way if we aren't careful.

The accurate teaching of Jesus Christ is all we need which tells us to upbuild a righteous spirit and by its strength and our correct thinking all the hormones produced by our healthier thought processes will slowly kick back into life...that's what I have gleaned from Jesus' teaching anyway...and much more besides.

[ippy]

I would say that NM seems to know an awful lot about bullying and oppression...It may be cus he saw a factory full of women herded like animals and saw the impact on their health that maybe he saw it as wrong and tried to do something about it...and perhaps you are getting the benefit of it here.

Perhaps, even...NM   sees the same evil policy being played out world wide and wants you all to know about it before it's too late...but obstructers will block the way if we aren't careful.

The accurate teaching of Jesus Christ is all we need which tells us to upbuild a righteous spirit and by its strength and our correct thinking all the hormones produced by our healthier thought processes will slowly kick back into life...that's what I have gleaned from Jesus' teaching anyway...and much more besides.

I would say that N M doesn't know any more about bullying and opression than any of the rest of us here on this forum.

Secularism doesn't seek to obstruct religions other than to put them into their place on a level with all the rest of us, without any of the special privileges they have gained for themselves in the past.

While I'm sure you believe in these supossed acurate teachings of this Jesus of yours, but it is only a belief, that certainly doesn't have a schred of verifiable evidence that would support any single part of its magical, mystical or superstitious content

At least Nick you seem to have given up on your rather silly the bible supplies the evidence for the words in the bible nonsense; that rather minor victory took some conciderable effort to acheive, stil,l I'll settle for that.

Try putting the lectern away for some of the time Nick, lighten up a bit, just because people like me see your religion stuff as absolute nonsense doesn't mean we're all mass murderers.

ippy

[Brownie]

'Lightening up' sounds good to me, ippy!

However we can't blame Nicholas for talking his stuff on a Religion and Ethics forum, there aren't many places where that can be done  .

I hope you have a very happy Christmas, Nicholas (everyone else too of course but I gave Nick a bit of a hard time earlier).  Hope Santa leaves you something special  .

[ippy]

'Lightening up' sounds good to me, ippy!

However we can't blame Nicholas for talking his stuff on a Religion and Ethics forum, there aren't many places where that can be done  .

I hope you have a very happy Christmas, Nicholas (everyone else too of course but I gave Nick a bit of a hard time earlier).  Hope Santa leaves you something special  .

Thanks for that Brownie, a happy Newtons day to you.

ippy

[Brownie]

I had to look that up ippy!  Didn't know Sir Isaac was (probably) born on 25th.
Hee hee, thought it might have something to do with Newton & Ridleys but my mind often works in peculiar ways.

[ippy]

I had to look that up ippy!  Didn't know Sir Isaac was (probably) born on 25th.
Hee hee, thought it might have something to do with Newton & Ridleys but my mind often works in peculiar ways.

You've got it.

ippy

[Sassy]

NM: I've had dealings with Christian denominations from Orthodox to Pentecostals. I've dialogued with groups such as the JWs, Mormons and Unitarians, who claim to be Christian, but are not, by any definition I recognise, believers. Your take on the Scripture is unique. Throwing stuff like 'electric', 'dynamic', 'scientific' etc, into every sentence - when they are not in any recognised Scripture or translation, makes your argument mot only incomprehensible, but useless as a tool of evangelism. I honestly do not know where your ideas come from - but they do not accord in any way with Scripture or Christian apologetics as we know them. You seem incapable of examining the possibility of the personhood of the Holy Spirit, the divinity of Christ, etc - mainstream Christian doctrines for millennia, every one of them.

Being a Christian is believing Christ is the Son of God and died for your sins and was resurrected from the dead.

There are many aspects of beliefs from certain Christian religions which I personally do not agree with. But clearly we are to examine our own conscience. If you do something you personally believe to be wrong then you sin.

True worshipers worship God in Spirit and Truth. We are not to judge who will and will not be saved. For only God and the Lord Jesus know these things.

If they personally through their faith believe something is wrong and do it, then they sin.
Not because it really is wrong but they deem it to be so and so would be sinning against God.

Two commandments sum them all up. Do we love our neighbour if we judge and condemn them?

[Anchorman]

'judge' and 'condemn; are not the same as 'dispute', 'refute', 'reject' or 'oppose'. It is possible to engage in the latter four without employing the first two terms.

[Sassy]

'judge' and 'condemn; are not the same as 'dispute', 'refute', 'reject' or 'oppose'. It is possible to engage in the latter four without employing the first two terms.

 I've dialogued with groups such as the JWs, Mormons and Unitarians, who claim to be Christian, but are not, by any definition I recognise, believers

It is what it is. No fork tongues allowed and no twisting of what you clearly said.

Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.

Christ does not make exceptions by what one persons faith allows them to do and what it doesn't allow them to do.

The fact is that not all are who call Jesus Lord will he know. But those who obey his words and who have known he and the Father.

I have had a complete stranger walk up to me and ask if I was a believer as they had felt the God tell them I was.  The same as I have been told someone else was a believer and they confirmed it to me.

You see God gives us confirmation in ways that are not of man but in the Spirit world.
You have no right to judge anyone regardless of their religious Christian order.
A man born of Spirit and Truth is not about tenets of a church or faith. It is about the truth of Christ and how we receive those truths. Christ is the Son of God. He died and was raised to life by God the Father that we may in turn have life through him.

Faith, hope and Love. The greatest of these is LOVE.

We must live in truth and accept the truth walking in Gods word and Spirit of Truth.

[Anchorman]

Well, at least some of that wasn't from the KJV. I suppose that's progress.

[Sassy]

Well, at least some of that wasn't from the KJV. I suppose that's progress.

The WORD is in some of us.... You see the passages I give you I am given.
I sometimes have to look up the words and the give you the passages for you to follow.

God gives me what I need to say, as I need it.
That is what being a believer is all about.  Some I know by passage but God I trust to guide me and he always has.

[Walter]

The WORD is in some of us.... You see the passages I give you I am given.
I sometimes have to look up the words and the give you the passages for you to follow.

God gives me what I need to say, as I need it.
That is what being a believer is all about.  Some I know by passage but God I trust to guide me and he always has.

He's not very strong on the English language then.

[Shaker]

He's not very strong on the English language then.

Definitely dropped off since the 17th century ...

[Walter]

Definitely dropped off since the 17th century ...

actually they still talk like that in Barnsley 

[Sassy]

He's not very strong on the English language then.

He created the English language, it is just men who are not strong on understanding the word of God, especially ATHEIST.

[floo]

He created the English language, it is just men who are not strong on understanding the word of God, especially ATHEIST.

Now where in the Bible does it say god created the English language, I must have missed that bit?