Spirituality is a Science

[Sriram]

Hi everyone,

Spirituality is a Science. This is a Truism...though some people might balk at the idea.     Perhaps the oldest Science too!

Certain people might perhaps start wondering how to measure spiritual phenomena or how to detect them or what instrument to use or which method of mathematical analysis to use or how to conduct a double blind clinical test .....etc. etc. 

Science is a broad term, a spectrum in fact....but many people tend to confuse it with Physics.  Physics is a subset of science and all sciences are not physics.

Some science are exact sciences like Physics, mathematics.  Everything is very precise. Chemistry is not as exact as the other two. Biology and Medicine are even less so. Measurements and predictions are never very precise.    Then come Psychology, Sociology and other sciences that are far from exact but are Sciences nevertheless. 

Spirituality takes off from where Psychology ends. Nothing very exact or measurable or predictive.... but there is still a system, there are certain methods and techniques... using which certain results can be achieved and certain broad predictions can be made.

Yoga, Pranayama, Meditations, Chantings, rituals and even prayers are some of the systems and methods using which certain mental states can be achieved and a great degree of peace, happiness and hope can be achieved. In some cases, even certain physical results in the form of curing illnesses, greater physical and mental energy and motivation can be achieved.

Greater awareness, greater feeling of love and universality can be reached. Greater wisdom and understanding of other people, their motivations, their inner compulsions and so on can also be easily achieved.  People can lose fear of death and look forward to the future even in old age.  Loneliness can be  overcome.

All these are no mean achievements by the way!! They are priceless! The benefits are immense.  Most people would give anything to acquire these benefits.

Purely through physical means or medicines or by visiting a shrink  these mental and emotional conditions cannot be achieved.

Religions btw are the most popular methods of achieving spiritual maturity....though they also serve other social and cultural purposes.

The secular methods as mentioned above (Yoga etc) are now becoming more popular worldwide, though some people use them parallely with religious methods. Most non religious people use such secular methods to acquire spiritual knowledge and stability. Our atheist friends can too!

Just some thoughts.

Cheers.

Sriram
 

[torridon]

And Sparkler claims righteousness is a science 

Science is successful, so everyone wants to bathe in its glory, not always realising the punishing discipline involved.

[splashscuba]

Science - The intellectual and practical activity encompassing the systematic study of the structure and behaviour of the physical and natural world through observation and experiment.

I think you are stretching the definition to a point where it's meaningless woo

[SusanDoris]

Spirituality is a group of letters forming a word to describe, not absolutely precisely, but near enough, an aspect of human traits, or characteristics, or whatever synonym is appropriate.

It is not a science.

[wigginhall]

This is the old sense of 'science', isn't it?  It used to mean knowledge, (German: Wissenschaft), so theology was ranked as a science.  Well, OK, if you are a devotee of Aquinas, maybe.   Otherwise, a pointless use of the word.

[john]

WHAT SUSAN SAID
 

[Sriram]

Any systematic knowledge of principles ...is Science. Any activity or method which employs a systematic preset series of steps and stages... and which results in predictable outcomes ...is Science.

Physical exercises, dieting, cooking and many other such systematic and regulated  activities are all Sciences. Yoga, Pranayama and Meditations are also such systematic and well understood regimens that produce predictable results.  They are definitely Sciences.   

There are social sciences, management sciences and many other.  Spirituality is also one such! There is no doubt about that.

Problem is that many  people confuse Spirituality with religion and get carried away with mythology and legend.     

[SusanDoris]

Any systematic knowledge of principles ...is Science. Any activity or method which employs a systematic preset series of steps and stages... and which results in predictable outcomes ...is Science.

None of this applies to karma.

Physical exercises, dieting, cooking and many other such systematic and regulated  activies are all Sciences.

They all involve physical materials, and can be studied objectively.

Yoga, Pranayama and Meditations are also such systematic and well understood regimens that produce predictable results.  They are definitely Sciences.

They are not sciences in themselves, although the human body's reactions, chemical changes, etc can be measured by scientists and predictions made.

There are social sciences, management sciences and many other.

These are behavioural skills and the human mind learns how to use them.

Spirituality is also one such! There is no doubt about that.

Oh, really! Please explain - or rather try to, although I don't think you will succeed.

Problem is that many  people confuse Spirituality with religion and get carried away with mythology and legend.     

The trouble is that religions think they have a monopoly on the word spiritual, but they are wrong in thinking so.

[Maeght]

It doesn't follow the scientific method so isn't a science, unless you are going with a different definition of the term than is currently used which would render the word pretty meaningless.

[floo]

Science is defined as  the intellectual and practical activity encompassing the systematic study of the structure and behaviour of the physical and natural world through observation and experiment.

That doesn't apply to spirituality.

[Hope]

It is also defined as

A systematically organized body of knowledge on a particular subject

and

Knowledge of any kind

Floo,  (though I appeciate that this latter is deemed 'archaic' by the Oxford Dictionary)

[Enki]

Sriram,

I suppose you are talking about how science was regarded long ago when you suggest that 'Spirituality is a Science. This is a Truism.'. I don't think that spirituality is regarded so in modern science , so I would suggest that it would be an inaccurate statement, rather than a blindingly obvious statement.

Of course scientists may well observe protestations of spirituality, attempt to analyse their characteristics etc., even come to provisional conclusions as to their causes and effects.

As regards physics, this discipline underlies all the other sciences, such as biology, chemistry etc. because it deals with the underlying laws which affect all forms of matter.

As far as the demarcation between true sciences and pseudo/non sciences are concerned there is considerable debate here, so I suggest that to assert some sort of hierarchical view, in which you, rather conveniently, insert spirituality is simply your way of looking at it, and would, I suggest, be highly contested by others.

See what karl Popper thought about demarcation, for instance, or, in contrast, any of the Logical Positivists.

Or, indeed, this article:

https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/pseudo-science/


You suggest that spirituality is a system, employing methods and techniques. So are many other practices which are not normally regarded as sciences at all, even if you think they are, although they may well involve the use of science at various points. E.G. ballet dancing, painting, plumbing, athletics. Your use of science, here, seems to demote the modern sense of the term to merely practising various disciplines.

The second part of what you say is associated with the benefits of the various disciplines you enumerate. With this part I would tend to agree with you. However this has nothing at all to to do with whether 'spirituality' is a science or not.

Just some thoughts.

[SusanDoris]

Hope

How can anyone have a 'body of knowledge' about something that is entirely imaginary?

[Nearly Sane]

Hope

How can anyone have a 'body of knowledge' about something that is entirely imaginary?

How do you evidence that claim?

[Sriram]

Sriram,

I suppose you are talking about how science was regarded long ago when you suggest that 'Spirituality is a Science. This is a Truism.'. I don't think that spirituality is regarded so in modern science , so I would suggest that it would be an inaccurate statement, rather than a blindingly obvious statement.

Of course scientists may well observe protestations of spirituality, attempt to analyse their characteristics etc., even come to provisional conclusions as to their causes and effects.

As regards physics, this discipline underlies all the other sciences, such as biology, chemistry etc. because it deals with the underlying laws which affect all forms of matter.

As far as the demarcation between true sciences and pseudo/non sciences are concerned there is considerable debate here, so I suggest that to assert some sort of hierarchical view, in which you, rather conveniently, insert spirituality is simply your way of looking at it, and would, I suggest, be highly contested by others.

See what karl Popper thought about demarcation, for instance, or, in contrast, any of the Logical Positivists.

Or, indeed, this article:

https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/pseudo-science/


You suggest that spirituality is a system, employing methods and techniques. So are many other practices which are not normally regarded as sciences at all, even if you think they are, although they may well involve the use of science at various points. E.G. ballet dancing, painting, plumbing, athletics. Your use of science, here, seems to demote the modern sense of the term to merely practising various disciplines.

The second part of what you say is associated with the benefits of the various disciplines you enumerate. With this part I would tend to agree with you. However this has nothing at all to to do with whether 'spirituality' is a science or not.

Just some thoughts.

enki,

First of all....what you understand by 'spirituality' is not clear. If it is about religion, God, heaven etc. ....then that is not what I consider as Spirituality (though those things may well be true and meaningful).

Spirituality for me is about Self Development. I have written about this rather extensively on here.  It is about eliminating animal tendencies and acquiring more and more of  'human' or 'divine' qualities such as Love, selflessness, altruism, wisdom, universality etc.

If by following certain methods, techniques and systems we can predictably increase such qualities in ourselves...it is a 'Science'. 'Science' is not just about the study of material things.  Any systematic knowledge gained is 'Science'. Any method or system by which certain predetermined results can be achieved is 'Science'.

Many fields start off being 'Art' in the sense that only some gifted people can do certain things. This could be dance, cooking, music, athletics etc.

However, if by understanding the basic principles involved, we are able to train people in these fields such that we achieve certain desired results....then all these areas could move from 'Art' to 'Science'.

It is the same with Self Development and being civilized....which is the aim of Spirituality. (I have already written about the role of religions in this)

People can be trained to discipline their mind, control their animal impulses and behave in certain acceptable ways. It may not be possible to the same extent equally with everyone....but in general, certain broad predictable results can be achieved.   This is what I call a 'Science'.

Cheers.

Sriram






 

[floo]

Hope

How can anyone have a 'body of knowledge' about something that is entirely imaginary?

How indeed!

[jeremyp]

How do you evidence that claim?

It was a question, not a claim.

[Nearly Sane]

It was a question, not a claim.

Which contains a claim about spirituality being entirely imaginary.

[floo]

Spirituality doesn't exist outside the human mind.

[jeremyp]

Which contains a claim about spirituality being entirely imaginary.

What was the claim that the question contained? I don't see one.

[Nearly Sane]

What was the claim that the question contained? I don't see one.

That spirituality, the subject of the thread, is entirely imaginary

[Nearly Sane]

Spirituality doesn't exist outside the human mind.

and your evidence for this claim is?

[floo]

and your evidence for this claim is?

Well can you prove it does?

[Nearly Sane]

Well can you prove it does?

I didn't make any claim. You did, your burden of proof. You are merely using the negative proof fallacy so beloved of Hope.

[Enki]

Sriram,

In response to your post 14:

First of all....what you understand by 'spirituality' is not clear. If it is about religion, God, heaven etc. ....then that is not what I consider as Spirituality (though those things may well be true and meaningful).

I find that the word 'spirituality' is such a vague word that I am loathe to use it about myself. It seems to be some sort of expansive concept, often relating to something deep and meaningful in what is popularly called the human psyche. The only thing I could possibly say about it of any significance is that it seems to relate to the human mind.

Spirituality for me is about Self Development. I have written about this rather extensively on here.  It is about eliminating animal tendencies and acquiring more and more of  'human' or 'divine' qualities such as Love, selflessness, altruism, wisdom, universality etc.

Self development is fine and can be/is achieved in a variety of ways, although I would strongly disagree with your idea that the qualities that you list are particularly human in origin. There is plenty of evidence which clearly suggests that such things as 'Love, selflessness, altruism, wisdom, universality' are present to a greater or lesser degree in many animal species, which seems to make sense as we are an animal species too. Many animals too show elements of self control, which seems to have some correlation to the size of their brains.

http://www.livescience.com/44993-bigger-brained-animals-have-more-self-control.html

If by following certain methods, techniques and systems we can predictably increase such qualities in ourselves...it is a 'Science'. 'Science' is not just about the study of material things.  Any systematic knowledge gained is 'Science'. Any method or system by which certain predetermined results can be achieved is 'Science'.

Peeling an apple or vacuuming a carpet are techniques which have predetermined results. These are not classed as the sciences of decorticatiomalum and vacutapetum.  If you are using the word 'science' in such a loose way then almost anything is applicable. However what I understand by exact science is summed up admirably in this description by the Science Council:

http://sciencecouncil.org/about-us/our-definition-of-science/

and the above, of course, includes, the important systematical methodology of science.

Many fields start off being 'Art' in the sense that only some gifted people can do certain things. This could be dance, cooking, music, athletics etc.

However, if by understanding the basic principles involved, we are able to train people in these fields such that we achieve certain desired results....then all these areas could move from 'Art' to 'Science'.

It is the same with Self Development and being civilized....which is the aim of Spirituality. (I have already written about the role of religions in this)

Actually, intuitive and creative ability are of great importance in producing works of artistic merit, but much can be learned using both training and technique in executing the skills needed to produce such works. Ditto with athletics, which isn't usually called an art form. You seem to be simply talking about taking on skills which aid in the execution of the desired goal. This says nothing as to what is a science at all.

People can be trained to discipline their mind, control their animal impulses and behave in certain acceptable ways. It may not be possible to the same extent equally with everyone....but in general, certain broad predictable results can be achieved.   This is what I call a 'Science'.

Yes, people can be trained to discipline their minds, control some of their destructive impulses and behave in acceptable ways according to their cultural/social aspirations, and, in evolutionary terms, this may well have broadly predictable results. However, not only is this just one idea(your idea) of what 'spirituality' means, in no way does this constitute a science in its own right, and nor does it employ the methodologies inherent in modern science to any notable degree.