Richmond By Election

[Jack Knave]

Please enumerate the constitutional changes. The fact is that I don't think you know what they were.

I have given you an outline of them as relayed by an constitutional commentator on the TV.

[jeremyp]

I have given you an outline of them as relayed by an constitutional commentator on the TV.

No you haven't, you have merely described what you believe to be their effect. You really have no idea what they are.

[Jack Knave]

What a pity that the Italians who took part in the referendum had no idea that this is what it was all about, Jack.

People should know by now that referendums are never voted on solely on the issue the referendum was set up ask. However, Renzi did put his head on the bloke with its resultant outcome and hey presto....

[Jack Knave]

No you haven't, you have merely described what you believe to be their effect. You really have no idea what they are.

So are you saying the commentator was lying then? And if so explain how.

[ProfessorDavey]

People should know by now that referendums are never voted on solely on the issue the referendum was set up ask.

I agree - but that is a big admission from you.

So clearly the EU referendum was the same - so you presumably recognise therefore that the wafer thin majority for Leave includes people voting on entirely unrelated issues to the issue the referendum was set up to ask.

[jeremyp]

So are you saying the commentator was lying then? And if so explain how.

No, I'm saying that you do not know what the referendum was about.

[Hope]

People should know by now that referendums are never voted on solely on the issue the referendum was set up ask. However, Renzi did put his head on the bloke with its resultant outcome and hey presto....

I'm fully aware of that, Jack - but the 'unexpected' comes from the voters, not those asking jhe referendum question - look at the way that Cameron ended up with egg on his face when it became clear that some people used the referendum to make a judgement on his premiership.  What yopu claim would have had to have been hidden within the question being asked - and I haven't heard a thing about anything you're suggesting from political commentators - either British and Italian.

[Jack Knave]

I agree - but that is a big admission from you.

So clearly the EU referendum was the same - so you presumably recognise therefore that the wafer thin majority for Leave includes people voting on entirely unrelated issues to the issue the referendum was set up to ask.

Well, one thing I do know is that all that mega project fear of what the pro lot claimed would happen if we voted for Brexit didn't put them off so they must have been really keen on it to vote that way. Yes it was a vote that includes a bash against the establishment and all their spin and lies and double dealings, which would of course include the EU. And I'm sure it included at bash against austerity, which would include the EU (look at Greece et al); and austerity being part of the Neo-Liberal project which the EU has signed up to. So what's your point?

[Jack Knave]

No, I'm saying that you do not know what the referendum was about.

And you do? Go on then!

[Jack Knave]

I'm fully aware of that, Jack - but the 'unexpected' comes from the voters, not those asking jhe referendum question - look at the way that Cameron ended up with egg on his face when it became clear that some people used the referendum to make a judgement on his premiership.  What yopu claim would have had to have been hidden within the question being asked - and I haven't heard a thing about anything you're suggesting from political commentators - either British and Italian.

So you haven't heard what I've heard. Who's fault is that?

So I'll ask you the same thing that I asked, Jeremy. What do you say the Italian referendum was about?

[jeremyp]

And you do? Go on then!

Why?

I'm not the one who falsely claimed it was about the EU.

[Jack Knave]

Why?

I'm not the one who falsely claimed it was about the EU.

What the hell are you talking about? Get a grip, Jeremy!!!

[jeremyp]

What the hell are you talking about? Get a grip, Jeremy!!!

You claimed the Italian referendum was about the EU.
I disputed your claim.
You failed to justify your claim.

Business as usual.

[Jack Knave]

You claimed the Italian referendum was about the EU.
I disputed your claim.
You failed to justify your claim.

Business as usual.

No I did not, not directly. I said that, besides other constitutional requirements, it was there to quicken things up parliamentary procedures so that measures to help keep the banks afloat could be brought into force more quickly else their banks will fail. This of course will help stop the Euro from crashing with the Italian economy.

I'm not sure how you can dispute this per se as Italy is in the Euro and so if it fails the Euro will fail, being that Italy is too big to bailout.

[Hope]

No I did not, not directly. I said that, besides other constitutional requirements, it was there to quicken things up parliamentary procedures so that measures to help keep the banks afloat could be brought into force more quickly else their banks will fail. This of course will help stop the Euro from crashing with the Italian economy.

I'm not sure how you can dispute this per se as Italy is in the Euro and so if it fails the Euro will fail, being that Italy is too big to bailout.

Having listened to a number of people with interests - family or otherwise - in Italy (mostly political commentators it must be said) I have heard zilch about this idea that the referendum was, in part, to do with keeping the banks afloat.  Yes, if the country can be made more stable, politically, it will help the economy which will help the banks - but then the same can be said about the UK, Germany or the Republic of Ireland.

[Jack Knave]

Having listened to a number of people with interests - family or otherwise - in Italy (mostly political commentators it must be said) I have heard zilch about this idea that the referendum was, in part, to do with keeping the banks afloat.  Yes, if the country can be made more stable, politically, it will help the economy which will help the banks - but then the same can be said about the UK, Germany or the Republic of Ireland.

I suggest you do your homework and be more vigilant about what's going on in the world. I also suggest your so called Italian political commentators are mere amateurs and incompetents.