Theology at Universities?

[Brownie]

If belief is declining, surely the study of theology will decline naturally and eventually it will become a small part of another discipline, as you suggest it should be.  I haven't put that well and hope you know what I mean.

It strikes me that, as interest in any subject fades, academic study of it will fade too.  Eventually, universities will no longer have theology as a main subject because there will be little interest.  It will all happen quite naturally.

[ippy]

If belief is declining, surely the study of theology will decline naturally and eventually it will become a small part of another discipline, as you suggest it should be.  I haven't put that well and hope you know what I mean.

It strikes me that, as interest in any subject fades, academic study of it will fade too.  Eventually, universities will no longer have theology as a main subject because there will be little interest.  It will all happen quite naturally.

I thought that was what I was saying Brownie, with, admittedly, perhaps a little impatience on my part, where I'd like to kick things like theology having a place in the forefront into touch as soon as, if not sooner.

ippy

[Brownie]

Maybe ippy but however any of us feel about it, if people of faith are declining then study of the subject will decline.  I don't understand why you feel so strongly about it but I'm not you.

People of faith are declining on this forum, I didn't really notice until just before going to bed last night;  very soon there will be no-one left to be pounced on, moaned at and scapegoated.  Then the forum can be renamed Ethics rather than Religion and Ethics.  I'm wondering what I can do to be permanently banned, I'd be in good company.

[Nearly Sane]

Moderator posts solely discussing the banning of members have been removed as a derail.

[Shaker]

If belief is declining, surely the study of theology will decline naturally and eventually it will become a small part of another discipline, as you suggest it should be.  I haven't put that well and hope you know what I mean.

It strikes me that, as interest in any subject fades, academic study of it will fade too.  Eventually, universities will no longer have theology as a main subject because there will be little interest.  It will all happen quite naturally.

This is exactly what I was going to say - that in the course of things, if interest in theology dwindles below the point where it's no longer viable to offer it (probably financially), universities will quietly retire it.

[Brownie]

Moderator posts solely discussing the banning of members have been removed as a derail.

I missed that, suppose I kicked it off but am not going to apologise.

Shaker:  This is exactly what I was going to say - that in the course of things, if interest in theology dwindles below the point where it's no longer viable to offer it (probably financially), universities will quietly retire it.

Quietly retiring is far better than being quashed, not only in the context of university courses.

It sounds like a contrasting mixture of peace and defeatism - I could say "Hopeless".

[ippy]

Maybe ippy but however any of us feel about it, if people of faith are declining then study of the subject will decline.  I don't understand why you feel so strongly about it but I'm not you.

People of faith are declining on this forum, I didn't really notice until just before going to bed last night;  very soon there will be no-one left to be pounced on, moaned at and scapegoated.  Then the forum can be renamed Ethics rather than Religion and Ethics.  I'm wondering what I can do to be permanently banned, I'd be in good company.

Ethics as a title?That shouldn't be so surprising other than, he opinions of all should be taken into consideration and that would have to include believers, even though religious belief isn't really that necessary in a discussion about ethics.

I don't really mind the religious view it's more to do with any one point of view automaticaly assuming it has the right to the front foot position, like titling a university course theology when all theology should be is a small part of an overall course on philosophy let's all start from a level playing field with no one case placed in a position of accendency.

ippy

[Brownie]

I'm all for level playing fields, Ippy.

[SusanDoris]

Maybe ippy but however any of us feel about it, if people of faith are declining then study of the subject will decline.  I don't understand why you feel so strongly about it but I'm not you.

to the first part of this paragraph: on the contrary, the study of a subject called theology should continue but with a growing understanding of how all the people who have ever written, lectured and philosophised about it were talking about thousands of years of belief in something which has zero evidence for it. The credit for all the words, thoughts, ideas and opinions would then, correctly, be ascribed to human beings.
As to the second part,  , however strongly one feels about it, it is going to take a long time to change and in the meantime millions of children will be indoctrinated into belief in God/god/s, however, lovingy such teaching is done.

ETA to correct spelling of were. Cojuldn't do it earlier - went to haridresser's!]

[Brownie]

Yeah well people are indoctrinated into all sorts of things, every day.   Those who do the indoctrinating don't realise they are doing it and, anyway, they think they are right.

Kids are pretty astute nowadays and generally have more confidence than in times past.  They don't mind speaking out against ideas that adults express.

There are families who adhere to an exclusive type of closed religion which they believe they are duty bound to pass on to the next generation.  That sort of things is more worrying to me and I've no idea what anyone can do about it.

[SusanDoris]

Yeah well people are indoctrinated into all sorts of things, every day.   Those who do the indoctrinating don't realise they are doing it and, anyway, they think they are right.

Can you name any other subject for indoctrination which resembles religious beliefs in any way?

]

[Nearly Sane]

Can you name any other subject for indoctrination which resembles religious beliefs in any way?

]

Ethics, politics

[SusanDoris]

Ethics, politics

But they do not have a god belief at their source and are understood for what they are - human ideas.

[ippy]

Yeah well people are indoctrinated into all sorts of things, every day.   Those who do the indoctrinating don't realise they are doing it and, anyway, they think they are right.

Kids are pretty astute nowadays and generally have more confidence than in times past.  They don't mind speaking out against ideas that adults express.

There are families who adhere to an exclusive type of closed religion which they believe they are duty bound to pass on to the next generation.  That sort of things is more worrying to me and I've no idea what anyone can do about it.

One thing for a start would be to stop giving undue prominence to religious ideas, such as having a university subject headed as theology, when theology should come under the general heading of philosophy.

Brownie what is it you can't see about how religious indoctrination works, a major part of it is little and often; small schools with a bloody great cross nailed in a prominent position, oh, it's only a nativity play, the C of E has more infant schools than others, why?  Theology not philosophy, etc etc

Your R C lot have seminaries, why not keep your theology there?

ippy

[Nearly Sane]

But they do not have a god belief at their source and are understood for what they are - human ideas.

that would mean you were asking which beliefs other than beliefs that have god at their core have god at their core, which is nonsensical. People can be told that there are absolute ethical and political goods not dependent on gods, and that there are absolute ethical and political goods (and wrongs) even if they are only human derived.
 

[Udayana]

One thing for a start would be to stop giving undue prominence to religious ideas, such as having a university subject headed as theology, when theology should come under the general heading of philosophy.
...

Theology could be seen as a branch of philosophy, or philosophy could be seen as an offshoot of theology. Why don't you go the whole hog and ask for it to be renamed "God bothering"?

[wigginhall]

Theology could be seen as a branch of philosophy, or philosophy could be seen as an offshoot of theology. Why don't you go the whole hog and ask for it to be renamed "God bothering"?

Or: 'ideas I don't like, and therefore should be banned'.

[Nearly Sane]

Theology could be seen as a branch of philosophy, or philosophy could be seen as an offshoot of theology. Why don't you go the whole hog and ask for it to be renamed "God bothering"?

Mmm perhaps because while I am not sure exactly what ippy's position is, that doesn't seem to be it?

[Udayana]

Seems to me that he just doesn't want anyone taking it seriously?

[Nearly Sane]

Seems to me that he just doesn't want anyone taking it seriously?

mmm tbf I think he just wants to make sure it isn't taught as 'fact' and doesn't get special privileges, one of which he sees is it as having a separate faculty anywhere

[SusanDoris]

that would mean you were asking which beliefs other than beliefs that have god at their core have god at their core, which is nonsensical. People can be told that there are absolute ethical and political goods not dependent on gods, and that there are absolute ethical and political goods (and wrongs) even if they are only human derived.

Apologies, NS, but even with the speed slowed down, I can't hold all of that in my head and sort it out at the same time!!

[Nearly Sane]

Apologies, NS, but even with the speed slowed down, I can't hold all of that in my head and sort it out at the same time!!

This could run to ten pages BUT what are your criteria for things that 'are subject to indoctrination which resembles religion'? You seemed to suggest that the things put up didn't have 'god' in them, which is surely then mostly a tautology?

[SusanDoris]

This could run to ten pages BUT what are your criteria for things 'are subject to indoctrination which resembles religion'? You seemed to suggest that things put up didn't have 'god' in them, which is surely then more stly a tautology?

Okay! First, is there a word missing between 'things' and 'are'? Do you mean  'more style than tautology'?

[Nearly Sane]

Okay! First, is there a word missing between 'things' and 'are'? Do you mean  'more style than tautology'?

Modified the post so hope it makes more sense.

[ippy]

Or: 'ideas I don't like, and therefore should be banned'.

Bannning theology, nothing to do with anything I have written on this thread ?

ippy