Former President Trump

[Harrowby Hall]

I suppose that it is with some relief that I learn that he has at least allowed the Biden camp access to appropriate funds. This suggests that he has accepted the inevitable.

He has not, however, stopped maintaining he is the victim of an electoral fraud.

[Owlswing]

I suppose that it is with some relief that I learn that he has at least allowed the Biden camp access to appropriate funds. This suggests that he has accepted the inevitable.

He has not, however, stopped maintaining he is the victim of electoral fraud.

My first thought is by whom, and how, he was convinced of exactly what the 'inevitable' was?

Assuming, of course, that he is not just working out what his next move is to reverse the polls!

 Owlswing

)O(

[Roses]

Hopefully when Biden is president he will be able to drag the US out of sewer into which it descended under Trump's leadership.

[Nearly Sane]

My first thought is by whom, and how, he was convinced of exactly what the 'inevitable' was?

Assuming, of course, that he is not just working out what his next move is to reverse the polls!

 Owlswing

)O(

I think a lot of this is about getting himself a pardon

[Roses]

I think a lot of this is about getting himself a pardon

We I wouldn't have thought the way he is behaving is going to grant him that wish.

[Nearly Sane]

We I wouldn't have thought the way he is behaving is going to grant him that wish.

It's about being such a pain that the Republicans will agree to it to avoid him trashing the brand even more. He also has a set of many millions of loyal supporters who are loyal to him, not the Republicans, and yet they will want to keep those votes.

With the run offs for the crucial Georgia senate seats in January  he wants to make it as much about him as possible. A deal where he resigns and an outgoing President Pence gives him a pardon is easier for him to get if he continually reminds the Republicans that he's not bound by normal rules of behaviour. 'The squeaky wheel gets the oil'

[Owlswing]

 I think a lot of this is about getting himself a pardon

You really do not have a very high opinion of him at all, do you?

Owlswing

)O(

[jeremyp]

If he does not try to engineer a coup before that ...

He is trying to do that now. His legal challenges and other attempts to overthrow the election are a coup attempt. It looks like it's going to fail.

More seriously, however, if he makes no attempt to allow the Biden administration the opportunity to acclimatise itself to the realities of being the Executive branch in the US federal government his reputation - even among his own supporters - will be trashed.

There's good news on that front.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-us-2020-55052640

However, i must dispute the "even among his own supporters " part. I think they are more likely to be upset if he does cooperate in handing over power.

A thought that has occurred  to once or twice: is he sufficiently disturbed as to be likely to commit suicide?

No, but he might be in enough financial trouble to do that. Who owns the Lady Ghislaine? I wonder if the Trump family bought her.

[jeremyp]

With any luck...

That's sort of understandable given that he can still do a lot of damage until January 20th but, apart from the fact that I don't like to wish death on anybody, I do want to see him face justice for his crimes.

[jeremyp]

We I wouldn't have thought the way he is behaving is going to grant him that wish.

Since the person who grants pardons is the President of the United States, he could get a pardon before January 20th. Surprisingly, it is not a given that a president can't pardon himself under the US constitution.

ETA: NS speculates that he might resign and get a pardon from Pence. That is plausible and doesn't suffer from the constitutional uncertainty of a self pardon. Trump could effectively hold the GOP to ransom, because, if he starts pushing the narrative that they have behaved in a traitorous way towards him, his base will stop voting for them and that's a sizeable part of the GOP vote gone.

[Nearly Sane]

You really do not have a very high opinion of him at all, do you?

Owlswing

)O(

  At times, if I leave aside the question of morality, there is a sort of horrified admiration. I think people have and do underestimate him in terms of his ability to connect and to ignore how things are supposed to play. 

[Owlswing]

That's sort of understandable given that he can still do a lot of damage until January 20th but, apart from the fact that I don't like to wish death on anybody, I do want to see him face justice for his crimes.

Unless he is legally declared bankrupt, can you really see him not finding a way to buy his way out of any kind of legal action? You call the British government 'corrupt'! It has absolutely nothing within a thousand miles of the corruption of the American legal and political systems.

Even if he has to borrow from the Mafia - or sell his golf courses (all of them) to them.

Owlswing

)O(

[Nearly Sane]

Unless he is legally declared bankrupt, can you really see him not finding a way to buy his way out of any kind of legal action? You call the British government 'corrupt'! It has absolutely nothing within a thousand miles of the corruption of the American legal and political systems.

Even if he has to borrow from the Mafia - or sell his golf courses (all of them) to them.

Owlswing

)O(

That's true but he won't want to spend his time doing that. He will want to be making money from being the ex President, not spending time and effort and money avoiding being sent to jail.

[Owlswing]

That's true but he won't want to spend his time doing that. He will want to be making money from being the ex-President, not spending time and effort and money avoiding being sent to jail.

Publishing his memoirs with his version of the last four years and how great he is and the great possibilities the U S electorate has thrown way?

Owlswing

)O(

[Nearly Sane]

Publishing his memoirs with his version of the last four years and how great he is and the great possibilities the U S electorate has thrown way?

Owlswing

)O(

Absolutely. Also the possibility is launching his own TV channel.

[Owlswing]

Absolutely. Also, the possibility is launching his own TV channel.

First Series to be titled 'Lies Unlimited' presumably?

Owlswing

)O(

[Roses]

 

[ekim]

Which one is the turkey?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/world-us-canada-55064806

[Owlswing]

Which one is the turkey?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/world-us-canada-55064806

Neither!

The turkeys (multiple) are/were the people who voted for the (nearly) human one!

Owlswing

)O(l

[jeremyp]

Unless he is legally declared bankrupt, can you really see him not finding a way to buy his way out of any kind of legal action?

There is a possibility that he'll manage to stay out of jail, but he'll definitely escape justice if he commits suicide first.

You call the British government 'corrupt'!

Do I?

It has absolutely nothing within a thousand miles of the corruption of the American legal and political systems.

I don't think the US legal system or political system is any more corrupt than that of any other modern democracy. The biggest problem with both (as I see it from 3,000 miles away) is that they were designed in the expectation that politics would be less partizan and adversarial than it has become. 

[Gordon]

As NS mentioned earlier, I wonder if Trump will resign and Pence then becomes President for a few weeks in order to pardon Trump for any crimes he may have committed as President - I'm not sure whether or not any Presidential pardon would also cover Trump's personal, financial and business affairs.

After all it has happened before, and notably when Ford pardoned Nixon.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pardon_of_Richard_Nixon

If Trump is pardoned it will be interesting to see how this plays out in the two seats yet to be decided in Georgia, given that unless the Democrats can win both then the Republicans will no doubt frustrate Biden at every turn.   

[Roses]

Both Ford and Nixon were Republicans. I wonder have well it would go down with Biden's supporters if he pardoned Trump?

[Nearly Sane]

As NS mentioned earlier, I wonder if Trump will resign and Pence then becomes President for a few weeks in order to pardon Trump for any crimes he may have committed as President - I'm not sure whether or not any Presidential pardon would also cover Trump's personal, financial and business affairs.

After all it has happened before, and notably when Ford pardoned Nixon.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pardon_of_Richard_Nixon

If Trump is pardoned it will be interesting to see how this plays out in the two seats yet to be decided in Georgia, given that unless the Democrats can win both then the Republicans will no doubt frustrate Biden at every turn.   

I think any pardon will be after the Georgia run offs

[Nearly Sane]

Both Ford and Nixon were Republicans. I wonder have well it would go down with Biden's supporters if he pardoned Trump?

No one is saying Biden will pardon Trump.

[Roses]

No one is saying Biden will pardon Trump.

Did I suggest that they were? It was speculation on Gordon's part as it is on mine!