2nd Indy Referendum?

[Walter]

Really? You want Brexit to hurt everybody?

only the sanctimonious

[jakswan]

I could mention the Poll Tax, the 'bedroom tax', what they are doing here right now with regard to Job Centre closures - plus the fact that we didn't vote for them: I'm now required by convention to note that there are more Pandas in Edinburgh Zoo than there are Tory MPs in Scotland.

Those are policies not ethos. So an independent Scotland will never elect a party whose policies you disagree with?

I think its a solid argument to say that the electorate in Scotland would not elect a centre-right party but always go for centre\hard left and its out of kilter with rUK, i.e. the political compass or political ethos as you put it.

I think it would be a poor argument to claim that the electorate in Scotland will only ever elect a party that has policies you agree with.

[Walter]

Poor Walter appears to be one of those poor little englanders who think they are a cut above the rest.

I am what I am
Don't want praise don't want pity......


have a laugh Floo 

[jakswan]

Mostly I agree but Nicola had offered discussions about leavingthe EU and staying in UK,  turned down, offers to discuss the timing of this referendum, turned down. It creates a narrative that plays well.

I think Sturgeon wanted one foot in both unions that way at a later date she could easily drop out of one. If she gets dragged out of EU then she will have to reapply making independence a harder sell.

If May's play is to keep Scotland in the union its not a bad punt to do exactly as she is doing, Sturgeon will whine and throw a tantrum but what is new about that!

[Walt Zingmatilder]

I think Sturgeon wanted one foot in both unions that way at a later date she could easily drop out of one. If she gets dragged out of EU then she will have to reapply making independence a harder sell.

If May's play is to keep Scotland in the union its not a bad punt to do exactly as she is doing, Sturgeon will whine and throw a tantrum but what is new about that!

I take it May will only start consulting people or bringing people on board WHEN brexit goes tits up and she needs suckers to act as a lightening rod for her in the ensuing shit storm.

[Nearly Sane]

I think Sturgeon wanted one foot in both unions that way at a later date she could easily drop out of one. If she gets dragged out of EU then she will have to reapply making independence a harder sell.

If May's play is to keep Scotland in the union its not a bad punt to do exactly as she is doing, Sturgeon will whine and throw a tantrum but what is new about that!

I think you have a certain amount of personal animosity which has lead to your portrayal of Nicola here.

[Walter]

I think you have a certain amount of personal animosity which has lead to your portrayal of Nicola here.

I know its wrong
but when she appears on telly all I see is Little Jimmy Krankie.

[Aruntraveller]

I think you have a certain amount of personal animosity which has lead to your portrayal of Nicola here.

Yes it's interesting how much vitriol seems to be directed at her South of the border. My cousin, usually the mildest mannered of women, posted a meme thingie on FB that had two photos one of Nicola Sturgeon and one of Jimmy Crankie (the similarity is there and is mildly amusing), but then referred to a ginger twat.

I was a little shocked. Maybe I shouldn't be, maybe it is just an indicator of the depths that public discourse has sunken to in these disunited islands.

But to me thoroughly depressing.

[Anchorman]

I know its wrong
but when she appears on telly all I see is Little Jimmy Krankie.

-
You see a Scottish nationalist politician as a Unionist member of the Conservative party?
Wow!

[Walter]

-
You see a Scottish nationalist politician as a Unionist member of the Conservative party?
Wow!

I have no idea what you're talking about 

[Anchorman]

I have no idea what you're talking about 

-
Obviously - otherwise you wouldn't see Nicola Sturgeon as Jimmy Krankie.

[Walter]

-
Obviously - otherwise you wouldn't see Nicola Sturgeon as Jimmy Krankie.

you can't deny the visual similarity though 

I have no interest in politics, especially the yappy kind you have in Scotland!

[Walt Zingmatilder]

you can't deny the visual similarity though 

Yes she lacks the fragrance and wan Victorian beauty of Theresa May, but while Krankie reminds our Rose of England that her turdpolishing of Brexit will not go uncommented on.....It's fandabadozee!!!!!!!!!

[Gordon]

Those are policies not ethos. So an independent Scotland will never elect a party whose policies you disagree with?

I think its a solid argument to say that the electorate in Scotland would not elect a centre-right party but always go for centre\hard left and its out of kilter with rUK, i.e. the political compass or political ethos as you put it.

I think it would be a poor argument to claim that the electorate in Scotland will only ever elect a party that has policies you agree with.

I'd have thought policies would be driven by ethos, and I've never said Scotland would only elect parties whose policies I agree with. It may well be that in an independent Scotland there would be some realignment of existing political parties.

[Nearly Sane]

Yes it's interesting how much vitriol seems to be directed at her South of the border. My cousin, usually the mildest mannered of women, posted a meme thingie on FB that had two photos one of Nicola Sturgeon and one of Jimmy Crankie (the similarity is there and is mildly amusing), but then referred to a ginger twat.

I was a little shocked. Maybe I shouldn't be, maybe it is just an indicator of the depths that public discourse has sunken to in these disunited islands.

But to me thoroughly depressing.

Of course, it's depressing but the cause of it is interesting. Anyway this piece is quite good on the abuse and the tediousness of the Jimmy Krankie thing. That an op ed piece from the Telegraph called metaphorically for Nicol's head this week is sad.

To be fair, there was similar expressions about Thatcher, with even Elvis Costello singing about Tramping the Dirt Down, so the discourse has been depressing for some time.


http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/stop-hatred-towards-scots-after-10047185

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Don't forget there's the Northern Irish and Brexit too....and even Brexitland is pitching up at Phil Hammond's with the begging bowl for more money for Department for the exit from the European union and entry of the rectal fundament.

[wigginhall]

Interesting that Sturgeon cited the Claim of Right in her conference speech, which presumably refers to that of 1989, signed by Labour politicians, among others.   But also referring to the Claim of Right of 1689, upon the accession of William and Mary.  I think the latter is an important constitutional document which enshrines the sovereignty of the Scottish people, at the expense of the royal prerogative.   Granted, I do not understand the relation of this to the Union, and the UK, and Scotland's place within those.   But presumably the Scottish parliament is about to state that that the rights of the Scottish people supercede all?  Or, if you like, take back control.

[Bubbles]

Looking back on the political gambles of May and Sturgeon
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-39302141

On the end of the article it talks about SNP members who want to leave the EU.

So the plan is to get the Scots worked up about leaving the EU( so they vote for independence) , only to raise the issue after independence to leave the EU anyway?

That's politics for you!

🙄

[Nearly Sane]

Looking back on the political gambles of May and Sturgeon
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-39302141

On the end of the article it talks about SNP members who want to leave the EU.

So the plan is to get the Scots worked up about leaving the EU( so they vote for independence) , only to raise the issue after independence to leave the EU anyway?

That's politics for you!

🙄

No, while there are members of the SNP who don't want to be in the EU, they are in a minority, and the party policy is to stay.

[jakswan]

I think you have a certain amount of personal animosity which has lead to your portrayal of Nicola here.

No I have a great deal of respect for her as a politician, she portrays herself in rUK as a bit of a dick because that serves her purpose.

[Nearly Sane]

No I have a great deal of respect for her as a politician, she portrays herself in rUK as a bit of a dick because that serves her purpose.

having respect does not preclude animosity which is again apparent in your post.

[Bubbles]

No, while there are members of the SNP who don't want to be in the EU, they are in a minority, and the party policy is to stay.

Nothing would surprise me with politicians.

[jeremyp]

only the sanctimonious

How are you going to make sure it only hurts the sanctimonious?

[jeremyp]

Yes it's interesting how much vitriol seems to be directed at her South of the border.

Yes because those people north of the border never direct vitriol at anybody.

That was sarcasm, by the way.

IIRC Jakswan is both pro Brexit and pro Scottish independence. He's just arguing from the facts in this case.

My cousin, usually the mildest mannered of women, posted a meme thingie on FB that had two photos one of Nicola Sturgeon and one of Jimmy Crankie (the similarity is there and is mildly amusing), but then referred to a ginger twat.

I was a little shocked. Maybe I shouldn't be, maybe it is just an indicator of the depths that public discourse has sunken to in these disunited islands.

But to me thoroughly depressing.

What is depressing to me is that the idea of being compared to a member of a successful comedy act is considered to be an insult.

[Nearly Sane]

Yes because those people north of the border never direct vitriol at anybody.

That was sarcasm, by the way.

IIRC Jakswan is both pro Brexit and pro Scottish independence. He's just arguing from the facts in this case.
What is depressing to me is that the idea of being compared to a member of a successful comedy act is considered to be an insult.

Good use of the tu quoque fallacy.