Magic

[Stranger]

I have already addressed that.  What 'trick' do you think Dynamo did while walking on the Thames? You would have no clue, I am sure.

Somebody says they are doing tricks, they do some tricks you can't explain and so you think it's real magic. As I said, beyond gullibility.

[Gordon]

I have already addressed that.  What 'trick' do you think Dynamo did while walking on the Thames? You would have no clue, I am sure.

My point is that something that is a 'trick' for Dynamo (or Jesus or Krishna) will not be a trick for you and me. It is something extraordinary.

But some of you will be unwilling to accept that there can be anything extraordinary or beyond natural laws that you cannot even understand. That is the problem.  You will continue to think in terms of trap doors, mirrors, glass platforms and so on....because that is all you know of.

What the real 'trick' is...you will not be able to understand.

Stage magic is a trick: for each trick there is an explanation but the audience don't know what it is - but they do know they are watching a trick. The likes of Penn & Teller come to mind, as do Paul Daniels and David Nixon (from my childhood) among others.

I was at a wedding recently and they hired a magician to mingle with the guests and do tricks to keep people entertained post-wedding and pre-meal. He sat at our table, and I watched him closely to try and spot the 'trick': I didn't, but was mesmerised by his skill and no doubt the props he used are part of this, such as when he produced a small plastic flower from my daughter-in-law's ear (which did surprise her).
 

[ekim]

Some might be interested in this site where magician's deceptions are revealed.   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JT4YFHB-mvc

[Sriram]

Somebody says they are doing tricks, they do some tricks you can't explain and so you think it's real magic. As I said, beyond gullibility.

I am not talking about children's party magic here.

I have provided two examples above. If you can explain them...fine.  Or if the word 'trick' 'explains everything' and makes you feel comfortable and secure...fine with me.

[ippy]

I see Sriram, the blue elephant man was someone dressed up like some of  the performers at a Disney land pleasure parks, I suppose some of the children would have thought that Micky Mouse was a real figure too, had he been around at that time?

ippy

[Sriram]

I see Sriram, the blue elephant man was someone dressed up like some of  the performers at a Disney land pleasure parks, I suppose some of the children would have thought that Micky Mouse was a real figure too, had he been around at that time?

ippy

You are back to your trolling, I see. Habits die hard!     Have fun!

[Gonnagle]

Dear Ekim,

The Masked Magician taking the magic out of magic, shame, we all need a little magic in our life's.

But I much prefer this guy ( I found him after watching Siriams original link )

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=peL1orGWPn8

This guy loves his magic but also puts the science into it.

Gonnagle.

[Gordon]

I am not talking about children's party magic here.

I have provided two examples above. If you can explain them...fine.  Or if the word 'trick' 'explains everything' and makes you feel comfortable and secure...fine with me.

The whole point, Sriram, is that while you can't explain them you know that there is an explanation: the trick involves the skill and deception needed to carry out what is explainable but in a manner that disguises what the explanation is. That magic is primarily a source of entertainment for a paying audience and income for the performer/promoter tends to suggest there is nothing unnatural about it.

[Sriram]

Dear Ekim,

The Masked Magician taking the magic out of magic, shame, we all need a little magic in our life's.

But I much prefer this guy ( I found him after watching Siriams original link )

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=peL1orGWPn8

This guy loves his magic but also puts the science into it.

Gonnagle.

I think your link is more about pyrotechnics used for special effects in movies than about magic. And ekim's link is about old style stage magic...and even that rather naive IMO.

If anyone can find an explanation for the above two videos I have given...please feel free.

[Sriram]

The whole point, Sriram, is that while you can't explain them you know that there is an explanation: the trick involves the skill and deception needed to carry out what is explainable but in a manner that disguises what the explanation is. That magic is primarily a source of entertainment for a paying audience and income for the performer/promoter tends to suggest there is nothing unnatural about it.

No...I don't think so. Its just a mindset. 'It can't be done....it can't be done....there must be some explanation....it's just a trick' etc.etc.

Party magic is different. I have bought my son a magic set many years ago. That's not what I am talking about. I am talking about walking on the Thames and pulling out printed selfies from an ipad.

[Gordon]

No...I don't think so. Its just a mindset. 'It can't be done....it can't be done....there must be some explanation....it's just a trick' etc.etc.

Party magic is different. I have bought my son a magic set many years ago. That's not what I am talking about. I am talking about walking on the Thames and pulling out printed selfies from an ipad.

That you can't figure it out doesn't mean it isn't a trick: the likes of Dynamo and Derren Brown are highly skilled at what they do.

Which is more likely: that the normal order of things can be suspended in selected cases only, and primarily for the purposes of entertainment, or that people who are self-identified tricksters are performing honest trickery for reward?

[jeremyp]

Magic is not always about sleight of hand, trap doors, hidden compartments, smoke and mirrors or something up the sleeve.  I have seen some amazing street magic in India. 

Today's  trend to show magic right in the middle of a crown, on a personal one to one basis and without elaborate costumes, is great and shows us that there are many things that we don't understand. Maybe even the magicians themselves don't fully understand what they are doing......

We may choose to dismiss these events as 'tricks', illusions or  a con. But fact is that they clearly defy our understanding of normal life and normal laws of nature.

Yeah...I've heard of James Randi and his 1 million prize....but regardless of that, magic goes on merrily, growing every day!

Perfect example of the argument from personal incredulity. Just because you can't figure out how street magicians do their tricks does not mean they aren't just tricks.

[Gonnagle]

Dear Siriam,

I think your link is more about pyrotechnics used for special effects in movies than about magic. And ekim's link is about old style stage magic...and even that rather naive IMO.

Pyrotechnics!! Magic old son but if you delve a little deeper you will find the mans history is steeped in good old fashioned stage magic, his mother and father have turned their basement into a museum of magic they also invented Hollywood fake blood used in so many hammer horror films.

Gonnagle.

PS: I honestly don't know what point you are trying to make in this thread although I have always enjoyed a bit of finger flinging or prestidigitation especially the history, Houdini being a favourite.

[Ricky Spanish]

As an aside. I used to religiously Watch Penn and Teller on the TV in the 90's in a programme called "The Unpleasant World of Penn & Teller."

I used to have this on VHS, sadly long gone now but is relevant to the topic: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H3FHytuCdHg

[Enki]

Harry Houdini's disappearing elephant trick was never explained until a few years after he had died, when his team chose to show the world how the trick was performed. Everyone knew it was a trick, but no one could say how it was done until the mechanics of it were revealed. Does this mean that up to that moment people should have believed that it was actual magic they were watching rather than a trick, simply because no one was able to explain it?

When my grand daughter was about 8, I used to perform all manner of magic tricks to her. She was mightily impressed. When I told her that they were all tricks, she flatly refused to believe me, because she much preferred the 'magic' element to be true. She only started to realise they were tricks when I showed her how they were done.

[Bubbles]

I am not talking about children's party magic here.

I have provided two examples above. If you can explain them...fine.  Or if the word 'trick' 'explains everything' and makes you feel comfortable and secure...fine with me.

It makes me uncomfortable that people can perform tricks, pass them off as real magic, and gain a kind of religious koudos off it while taking money off those they have duped.

In a way Sriram, my perception is that your culture leaves you vulnerable to this sort of thing. There are plenty of Gurus running around claiming all sorts.

 It's called being gullible, that because you can't see how it's done, you believe you can't be fooled, hence you believe it.

I've known a few people in RL who believe some Indian " guru" really leaves a trail of ash wherever he goes and i've also met a few people who also thought Paul Daniels was a " real" white magician. Paul Daniels doesn't claim to use real magic, just tricks but they ignore that.

[ippy]

You are back to your trolling, I see. Habits die hard!     Have fun!

Not really Sriram, if the cap fits wear it, would be a fair comment that relates to the overall sentiments you have been conveying on this thread of yours.

Comments don't necessarily need to be a dozen paragraphs long to be valid, as in my last post to you.

Like most of the ideas conveyed by religions they have some good ideas and some really bad ones that border on the idiotic; a considerable number on the idiotic as you must appreciate, even if you may prefer to not admit. 

I live a reasonably good ethical life, like anyone else nowhere perfect, all without believing in unsupportable knowledge such as many of the things claimed by your religion or anyone else's.

I would like to remind you that it's the religions that I've no time for, I'm not your enemy and you would be made most welcome here in my company any time.

ippy   

[Gonnagle]

Dear Ippy,

Like most of the ideas conveyed by religions they have some good ideas and some really bad ones that border on the idiotic; a considerable number on the idiotic as you must appreciate, even if you may prefer to not admit. 

Pejorative, is that the right word.

Gonnagle.

[Bubbles]

The secret of walking on water, explained.

https://youtu.be/dycpIPTFJ04

[Sriram]

Hi everyone,

I don't know what 'real magic' is and what 'artificial magic'  is. Yes...there is party magic with things stuffed up the sleeve, hidden compartments etc.

But there is also magic which cannot be explained by us or even by scientists. As you may know, I don't believe in the 'supernatural'.  Everything is natural, even particles influencing one another instantaneously across the universe. Now that is natural but it is also extraordinary and that's magic!

Reincarnation is magic! NDE's are magic! Spontaneous healing is magic! Premonitions are magic! There is plenty of magic if you want to see it. Our unconscious mind works lots of magic!

I prefer to acknowledge things that I don't understand.....and I don't need the reassurance that there is nothing extraordinary in the world. I don't have all the answers but I am happy with that.

I started this thread only to give people a little wonder....like when you watch something out of the ordinary. Its not for entertainment. Not for the claps.  Not for the laughs. Not for the explanations of 'its only this...its only that'.  Not to be brushed aside immediately to get back to our comfort zone. None of that.

Its for the question mark that it leaves us with.

Cheers.

Sriram 

[Bubbles]

iPad magic

http://www.simonpierro.com/iphone-magic-simon

[Bubbles]

As it's Easter.

Here's some magic, the chocolatey sort 

http://thekidshouldseethis.com/post/animated-chocolate-cake-zoetropes-by-alexandre-dubosc

[Gonnagle]

Dear Rose,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NPDo_xNcVus

Real or fake?

Maybe Our Lord was just a really fit guy.

Or, OR! Maybe Our Lord actually walked on the Dead sea.

http://twistedsifter.com/2012/06/10-things-you-didnt-know-about-the-dead-sea/

Gonnagle.

[SusanDoris]

Rose #43

Nice one!!

[jeremyp]

But there is also magic which cannot be explained by us or even by scientists.

Such as?

As you may know, I don't believe in the 'supernatural'.  Everything is natural, even particles influencing one another instantaneously across the universe. Now that is natural but it is also extraordinary and that's magic!

I think there's enough extraordinary stuff in the World without having to pretend there is magic too.

Reincarnation is magic!

Reincarnation is make believe.

NDE's are magic! Spontaneous healing is magic! Premonitions are magic!

All of these have prosaic explanations (the we may or may not know yet) except premonitions which are usually called "guessing".

I prefer to acknowledge things that I don't understand

I freely acknowledge there are many things in the World that I do not understand but I am not so arrogant as to believe anything I can't understand must be magic.