Why did Jesus disappear up to heaven?

[Shaker]

That's a step on the way to John Shelby Spong

Oh, ad_o will be pleased.

I know I am 

[ad_orientem]

That's a step on the way to John Shelby Spong, who thinks that the Resurrection and the Ascension were originally one 'metaphorical' event, which later became differentiated and given literal narratives.

Not at all. All I'm saying is that something can be both literal and an allegory or metaphor. This has been the approach from the very beginning. Therefore one can view the flood, for example, as being a real event but also see it as an allegory for baptism and the Church.

[floo]

Not at all. All I'm saying is that something can be both literal and an allegory or metaphor. This has been the approach from the very beginning. Therefore one can view the flood, for example, as being a real event but also see it as an allegory for baptism and the Church.

I don't get that?

[ad_orientem]

 

[Rhiannon]

Not at all. All I'm saying is that something can be both literal and an allegory or metaphor. This has been the approach from the very beginning. Therefore one can view the flood, for example, as being a real event but also see it as an allegory for baptism and the Church.

Well one could, but it'd be a bit of a stretch.

[ad_orientem]

Well one could, but it'd be a bit of a stretch.

Not really. St. Paul does exactly that.

[floo]

Not really. St. Paul does exactly that.

Stretching the truth, you mean?

[Rhiannon]

Stretching the truth, you mean?

In Paul's case it seems he added his own hellenic-inspired theological take on the life of Jesus to the OT stories.

[Humph Warden Bennett]

In Paul's case it seems he added his own hellenic-inspired theological take on the life of Jesus to the OT stories.

Ever read the Epistle of James? It has a quite different message to Paul's epistles.

It is traditionally considered to be the work of James the Righteous, brother of Jesus.

[floo]

Ever read the Epistle of James? It has a quite different message to Paul's epistles.

It is traditionally considered to be the work of James the Righteous, brother of Jesus.

That is only a tradition with nothing to back it up.

[Dicky Underpants]

Ever read the Epistle of James? It has a quite different message to Paul's epistles.

It is traditionally considered to be the work of James the Righteous, brother of Jesus.

Quite a thorn in Luther's flesh. All about works, and Paul all about faith.

[Dicky Underpants]

Not really. St. Paul does exactly that.

St Peter, wasn't it?  St Paul thought the Israelites passing through the Dead Sea unscathed prefigured baptism (though since the point of the OT story was that they didn't get a good old soaking, the allegory seems quite loose).

[trippymonkey]

MMM
Well... there's never ever been ANY proof of Jesus even existing so to send him off to 'heaven' is the final nail in the coffin, so to speak.

Although there never WAS a coffin !!! LOL

[Nearly Sane]

MMM
Well... there's never ever been ANY proof of Jesus even existing so to send him off to 'heaven' is the final nail in the coffin, so to speak.

Although there never WAS a coffin !!! LOL

You mean to use evidence here instead of proof and in terms of the existence of  a preacher called Jesus in early CE around the 'Holy Land', then the NT does amount to evidence.

[Owlswing]

Not really. St. Paul does exactly that.

Now how about a comment from a Christian on the "Charlie Grad and God" thread? 

[Owlswing]

You're always whingeing about God not helping out and when God does your whinge about that too.

Goddodging Shakes?

Now how about a comment from a Christian on the "Charlie Grad and God" thread? 

[Nearly Sane]

Now how about a comment from a Christian on the "Charlie Grad and God" thread?

Not going to happen in near future

http://www.religionethics.co.uk/index.php?topic=6939.50

[Nearly Sane]

Now how about a comment from a Christian on the "Charlie Grad and God" thread?

just to note that you have had 2 comments from Christians on that thread.

[Owlswing]

 just to note that you have had 2 comments from Christians on that thread.

Which two?

If one was Spud I am still awaiting his explanation of an extremely cryptic (to me anyway) comment.

[Nearly Sane]

Which two?

If one was Spud I am still awaiting his explanation of an extremely cryptic (to me anyway) comment.

Spud and Robinson

[trippymonkey]

You mean to use evidence here instead of proof and in terms of the existence of  a preacher called Jesus in early CE around the 'Holy Land', then the NT does amount to evidence.

So the Quran proves all of Islam is true because IT exists ?!!?!?

[Nearly Sane]

So the Quran proves all of Islam is true because IT exists ?!!?!?

No. Can I be the first to congratulate on the new board record on the biggest strawman post?

[Robbie]

If the less than credible story of the resurrection of Jesus is true, why didn't he stay down here on earth instead of disappearing skywards?

If only the 'saved' go to heaven, and the rest end up burning in the fires of hell for all eternity, surely it is most unfair of Jesus not to be doing his bit down here convincing everyone he is all that the gospel writers claim he is.

I have asked this question many times over the years, but have never had a sensible answer from Biblical literalists.

Christians believe, according to the Gospels, Jesus said the Holy Spirit would come, so he is with us, & that happened at Pentecost.

From John 14
 However, the helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you everything. He will remind you of everything that I have ever told you.

So the Quran proves all of Islam is true because IT exists ?!!?!?

Evidence not proof !!@***

[Nearly Sane]

Evidence not proof !!@***

It isn't evidence that 'all' Islam is true either. It is evidence to historic events, as in the methodological naturalistic approach of the study of history. In the absence of a methodology for supernatural claims or moral pronouncements, it isn't evidence for those.

[Robbie]

Yes indeed.