Linguistic peculiarity

[Harrowby Hall]

Staring at the ceiling at 3.15am, wondering what had happened to the comfort of sleep, brings all sorts of thoughts into the foreground.

Why is it that garments worn below the waist are plural but those above the waist are singular? Has anyone seen a knicker? Or an underpant? Or a tight? Or a trouser? Socks and shoes I can accept but, why else is anything which comes in contact with the leg considered to be a plurality?

Shirt, vest, jacket, blouse ... even brassiere  ... are all singular.

[Maeght]

Odd things go through the mind in the wee small hours don't they!

Originally trousers were in two parts, one for each leg tied together at the waist, so related items have tended to be referred to in the plural.

[Owlswing]

Odd things go through the mind in the wee small hours don't they!

Originally trousers were in two parts, one for each leg tied together at the waist, so related items have tended to be referred to in the plural.

I thought that was lady's drawers rather than trousers.

I thought that the precursor of trousers were breeches or somesuch.

[Maeght]

I thought that was lady's drawers rather than trousers.

I thought that the precursor of trousers were breeches or somesuch.

I think the history and naming of trousers etc is a quite intersesting  but seems that in the 16th century pantaloons were as I described hence the use of plural for trouser like things after that.

[Udayana]

Pants?

[Nearly Sane]

Are spectacles plural for a similar reason I.e. that they used to be separate?

Tweezers, Binoculars?

[Harrowby Hall]

Originally, wasn't an eyeglass a single lens held on a little stick which was held up to the eye? So, two, joined together became eyeglasses - a pair of glasses.

Binocular is a rather strange one. It means "two eyes" - so a pair of binoculars must be required by someone who has four eyes.




Edited to remove erroneous statement

[Nearly Sane]

I suppose you also get monoculars and they are when there is one of them single.

Interesting about spectacles being a brand.

[Harrowby Hall]

Isn't the usual term for half of a "pair" of binoculars" telescope"?

[bluehillside Retd.]

HH,

Just moving the conversation along a little if I may, I like the explanation for why men's shirts have the buttons on the right but women's shirts/blouses have them on the left.

As most people are right-handed it's easier to grip buttons with the right hand than with the left, so on men's shirt the buttons are on the right. Women though would traditionally have had maids to do up their buttons for them, so the maids facing their ladies would have wanted the buttons to be on their right.

And so it remains to this day even though, with the exceptions perhaps of Rhiannon and the Queen, almost no-one now has a maid.   

[Maeght]

HH,

Just moving the conversation along a little if I may, I like the explanation for why men's shirts have the buttons on the right but women's shirts/blouses have them on the left.

As most people are right-handed it's easier to grip buttons with the right hand than with the left, so on men's shirt the buttons are on the right. Women though would traditionally have had maids to do up their buttons for them, so the maids facing their ladies would have wanted the buttons to be on their right.

And so it remains to this day even though, with the exceptions perhaps of Rhiannon and the Queen, almost no-one now has a maid.

What about valets for men?

[bluehillside Retd.]

Maeght,

What about valets for men?

Lower incidence of valets for men than of maids for women.

[Maeght]

Maeght,

Lower incidence of valets for men than of maids for women.

Yes I guess so.

[Sebastian Toe]

What about valets for men?

Maybe the valets stood behind their gentlemen when doing up the buttons?

[Outrider]

HH,

Just moving the conversation along a little if I may, I like the explanation for why men's shirts have the buttons on the right but women's shirts/blouses have them on the left.

As most people are right-handed it's easier to grip buttons with the right hand than with the left, so on men's shirt the buttons are on the right. Women though would traditionally have had maids to do up their buttons for them, so the maids facing their ladies would have wanted the buttons to be on their right.

And so it remains to this day even though, with the exceptions perhaps of Rhiannon and the Queen, almost no-one now has a maid.

I was under the impression that buttoning up left over right, initially, was to prevent snagging when drawing a weapon from the left hip (which is, ultimately, the convention because most people are right handed, but it's not the same mechanism as the buttons being easier from that side).

I'd heard the idea that women's fashions were reversed because of maids, as well.

O.

[Maeght]

I would imagine there isn't just one reason and its all lost in the mists of time.

[Sebastian Toe]

I would imagine there isn't just one reason and its all lost in the mists of time.

..or mist?
 

[Maeght]

No, mists.

[Walter]

Maybe the valets stood behind their gentlemen when doing up the buttons?

ooooh er , steady!

[SteveH]

Accents come under "linguistic peculiarity".
There was a wonderful documentary about Jacqueline Du Pre on BBC4 last night, with many interviews with classical music luminaries who know her, such as Itzhak Perlman, Dietrich Fischer-Dieskau, and Daniel Barenboim. There were also three black-and-white interviews, probably dating from the 60s, with William Pleeth, Sir John Barbirolli, and Jacqueline herself. All of the interviewees were highly-educated, upper-middle class types (upper-upper class in the case of the Duchess of Kent), and all sounded it, but what was very noticeable was how much more unashamedly posh Jacqueline, Pleeth and Barbirolli sounded in their archive interviews than the modern interviewees. This reduction in poshness has been ramarked by many commentators, but here was evidence. The voice-overs of old newsreels from the 40s and 50s are another example - no-one talks anything like that now. (I'm not sure that they did even then). It has been observed that the Queen's accent has changed over the decades, as well.

[SteveH]

Objects always referred to in the plural always consist of two more or less identical parts - scissors, trousers, binoculars, pants, glasses, etc. By that logic, a bra ought to be referred to as "a pair of bras", but that's just the vagaries of the language, I suppose.

[Nearly Sane]

Knickers have less obviously two parts than a jacket?

[SteveH]

Knickers have less obviously two parts than a jacket?

Another vagary of the language, although "knickers" consist mostly of holes for the legs, where as a jacket consists mainly of the single central portion for the torso.

[Nearly Sane]

Another vagary of the language, although "knickers" consist mostly of holes for the legs, where as a jacket consists mainly of the single central portion for the torso.

Which therefore makes knickers closer to a waistcoat and a jacket closer to trousers.

[Walter]

Which therefore makes knickers closer to a waistcoat and a jacket closer to trousers.

get your goat off my mountain

it's not a goat it's a jacket !