Author Topic: If god exists?  (Read 6806 times)

Walter

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Re: If god exists?
« Reply #25 on: November 13, 2017, 04:49:24 PM »
Walter,

Can you imagine Vlad the car park attendant?

VtCPA: “So, you think parking sideways across two spaces is correct do you?”

Me: “Er, that’s not what I did at all. Look, here’s a CCTV image that shows I was exactly between the lines.”

VtCPA: “Mere turd polishing. Now then, you do realise that using the half hour free option is a philosophical statement don’t you?

How do you defend that then smartarse?”

Me: “Um, it’s no such thing. I was just nipping to the corner shop for a box of liquorice allsorts. Where’s the philosophy in that?”

VtCPA: “Pah! I used to think they were allsorts too before I gained my detailed knowledge of confectionary manufacture. They’re actually treats made of scotch mist and unicorn tears you schmuck…”

Me: “So how does your detailed knowledge of confectionary tell you that exactly?”

VtCAP: Silence

Me: "Hello?"

VtCPA: "Category f***!"

etc
a red nose day sketch ? fabulous  ;D ;D ;D

laughable if it weren't true  :( :( :(

Walt Zingmatilder

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Re: If god exists?
« Reply #26 on: November 13, 2017, 07:24:35 PM »
Walter,

Can you imagine Vlad the car park attendant?

VtCPA: “So, you think parking sideways across two spaces is correct do you?”

Me: “Er, that’s not what I did at all. Look, here’s a CCTV image that shows I was exactly between the lines.”

VtCPA: “Mere turd polishing. Now then, you do realise that using the half hour free option is a philosophical statement don’t you?

How do you defend that then smartarse?”

Me: “Um, it’s no such thing. I was just nipping to the corner shop for a box of liquorice allsorts. Where’s the philosophy in that?”

VtCPA: “Pah! I used to think they were allsorts too before I gained my detailed knowledge of confectionary manufacture. They’re actually treats made of scotch mist and unicorn tears you schmuck…”

Me: “So how does your detailed knowledge of confectionary tell you that exactly?”

VtCAP: Silence

Me: "Hello?"

VtCPA: "Category f***!"

etc
Very good apart from the last sixteen lines.

Sebastian Toe

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Re: If god exists?
« Reply #27 on: November 13, 2017, 08:01:17 PM »
Very good apart from the last sixteen lines.
Category fuck.
"The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honourable, but still primitive legends.'
Albert Einstein

Walt Zingmatilder

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Re: If god exists?
« Reply #28 on: November 13, 2017, 10:09:37 PM »
Category fuck.
OK Seb but went rapidly downhill in the last line.

SteveH

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Re: If god exists?
« Reply #29 on: November 13, 2017, 10:15:48 PM »
Floo,

To be fair though, that's the closest he's come to an actual argument since he's been here.

Pity really. For all I know he may actually have something interesting to say, but so far he's shaping up as your standard smash and grab merchant - post something, get challenged on it, disappear.

Oh well.
I answered your adolescent sarcasm about omnipotence much more fully than it deserved, two or three times, but you were determined not to understand what I was saying, so I gave up.
I have a pet termite. His name is Clint. Clint eats wood.

Walter

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Re: If god exists?
« Reply #30 on: November 13, 2017, 10:57:51 PM »
I answered your adolescent sarcasm about omnipotence much more fully than it deserved, two or three times, but you were determined not to understand what I was saying, so I gave up.

c'mon Sailor Boy , that's not like you  ::)

Sebastian Toe

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Re: If god exists?
« Reply #31 on: November 13, 2017, 11:36:35 PM »
OK Seb but went rapidly downhill in the last line.
At least it had some altitude. Yours started in the Mariana Trench!
"The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honourable, but still primitive legends.'
Albert Einstein

Walt Zingmatilder

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Re: If god exists?
« Reply #32 on: November 13, 2017, 11:39:57 PM »
At least it had some altitude.
It certainly looks as though you were high when you wrote it.

Sebastian Toe

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Re: If god exists?
« Reply #33 on: November 14, 2017, 08:43:03 AM »
It certainly looks as though you were high when you wrote it.
I'm always high.
Don't you be judging people's life choices though!
"The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honourable, but still primitive legends.'
Albert Einstein

bluehillside Retd.

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Re: If god exists?
« Reply #34 on: November 14, 2017, 09:59:40 AM »
L’Eau,

Quote
I answered your adolescent sarcasm about omnipotence much more fully than it deserved, two or three times, but you were determined not to understand what I was saying, so I gave up.

Except of course none of that’s – ooh, what’s the word I’m trying to think of here? Oh yeah, true.

What actually happened was that you posited a notion that allows a space for “God” to co-exist with “evil” by suggesting that one of the “omnis” – omnipotence – was only theoretically rather than actually true.

I explained to you (neither adolescently nor sarcastically) that you’d fallen foul of two logical fallacies. First, the fallacy of special pleading: you took a specific claim (omnipotence) and diluted it to “theoretical” while ignoring the problem that you’d thereby fundamentally re-defined what “omnipotence” actually means.

Second, the fallacy of arbitrariness. You picked one of the omnis (apparently at random) to dilute, when you could equally have done the same with any of the others (or with a combination of them) and also created a space for evil to hide in.

Since then you’ve been entirely unwilling or unable to address the problems you’ve given yourself, preferring instead first silence and now insult.

Look, it’s simple enough. If you’re feeling upset that a cherished notion has been undone but so out of your depth that you can’t process it just say so. There are people here who readily will help you with the basics of how logic and argument work, and moreover you’ll be better equipped to deal with the world once you do grasp it.

Your actual response though does you no credit.

Coda: As this relates to a different discussion and it's not fair to derail this one, I'll post it on the Omnipotence thread too.         
« Last Edit: November 14, 2017, 10:04:46 AM by bluehillside »
"Don't make me come down there."

God

SteveH

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Re: If god exists?
« Reply #35 on: November 14, 2017, 05:22:59 PM »
And I've given it a much fuller and more polite answer than it deserves there.
I have a pet termite. His name is Clint. Clint eats wood.

floo

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Re: If god exists?
« Reply #36 on: November 14, 2017, 05:25:04 PM »
And I've given it a much fuller and more polite answer than it deserves there.

You polite?  ;D

SteveH

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Re: If god exists?
« Reply #37 on: November 14, 2017, 05:26:50 PM »
You polite?  ;D
Not very, but a damn sight politer than British Home Stores' patronising, self-satisfied bollocks deserved.
I have a pet termite. His name is Clint. Clint eats wood.

bluehillside Retd.

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Re: If god exists?
« Reply #38 on: November 14, 2017, 05:44:01 PM »
L'Eau,

Quote
And I've given it a much fuller and more polite answer than it deserves there.

That's not true.
"Don't make me come down there."

God

Nearly Sane

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Re: If god exists?
« Reply #39 on: November 14, 2017, 05:44:53 PM »
L'Eau,

That's not true.
Mmm seems like a matter of opinion rather than one of truth?

bluehillside Retd.

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Re: If god exists?
« Reply #40 on: November 14, 2017, 05:46:51 PM »
L'Eau,

Quote
Not very, but a damn sight politer than British Home Stores' patronising, self-satisfied bollocks deserved.

And nor's that.

Your response to calmly expressed reason and logic that undoes you is anger. By his words you shall know him and all that...
"Don't make me come down there."

God

bluehillside Retd.

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Re: If god exists?
« Reply #41 on: November 14, 2017, 07:07:36 PM »
NS,

Quote
Mmm seems like a matter of opinion rather than one of truth?

I made no claim to objectivity there but, either way, I'd have thought the differences in content and tone between L'Eau's posts and mine speak for themselves. 
"Don't make me come down there."

God

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Re: If god exists?
« Reply #42 on: November 14, 2017, 07:15:26 PM »
NS,

I made no claim to objectivity there but, either way, I'd have thought the differences in content and tone between L'Eau's posts and mine speak for themselves.

You said it wasn't true. Is that not a claim to objectivity?

bluehillside Retd.

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Re: If god exists?
« Reply #43 on: November 14, 2017, 07:19:09 PM »
NS,

Quote
You said it wasn't true. Is that not a claim to objectivity?

I love my wife too. Is that?

You seem to want to pick an argument for no good reason. If L'Eau thinks a post containing reasoned argument deserves the reply he gave it, that's a matter for him. Others I think may disagree. 
« Last Edit: November 14, 2017, 07:21:47 PM by bluehillside »
"Don't make me come down there."

God

Nearly Sane

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Re: If god exists?
« Reply #44 on: November 14, 2017, 07:30:24 PM »
NS,

I love my wife too. Is that?

You seem to want to pick an argument for no good reason. If L'Eau thinks a post containing reasoned argument deserves the reply he gave it, that's a matter for him. Others I think may disagree.

Poisoning the well? Really?

Is it a truth viable statement?

Rhiannon

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Re: If god exists?
« Reply #45 on: November 14, 2017, 08:35:29 PM »
If god existed I’d been seeking relationship, not worship.

ProfessorDavey

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Re: If god exists?
« Reply #46 on: November 14, 2017, 09:49:15 PM »

Would a god that expected worship deserve it?  (Note to be honest, I am struggling with what 'worship' never mind 'god' amounts to)
Possibly - point I was making in an offhand way is that too many theists have a very narrow impression of what a god (where he/she/it to actually exist) would be like. Effectively to superimpose a version of common purported gods that somehow require or expect worship.

To an extent that seems deeply anthropomorphic - effectively to impose on gods very human characteristics of needing acknowledgement. Why would an omnipotent god expect worship from people. It is a bit like thinking that humans expect worship from ants. It is bizarre. In effect what this is doing is turning things on their head - the very notion that a god would require us humans to worship it means that to an extent we humans are important in the eyes (again being anthropomorphic) of that god. It speaks to the notion of a god created by humans. Humans create a god and need to be important in the eyes of that created god, as it makes us feel important ourselves.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2017, 09:51:43 PM by ProfessorDavey »

ProfessorDavey

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Re: If god exists?
« Reply #47 on: November 14, 2017, 09:50:15 PM »
That's very magnanimous of you.
I am simply being truthful.