Author Topic: Christians who make my skin crawl!  (Read 18663 times)

Gordon

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Re: Christians who make my skin crawl!
« Reply #25 on: February 12, 2018, 10:04:38 AM »
What is the point of the thread? There are people who call themselves Christians who behave badly. So what?

I was just thinking exactly the same as I read this thread (for the first time): there are also probably politicians, crown-green bowlers, lorry drivers, macrame enthusiasts and people who enjoy the music of Mozart who behave badly too - as you say, so what, and why Christians get a special mention in this regard in this OP beats me!
« Last Edit: February 12, 2018, 10:18:45 AM by Gordon »

Rhiannon

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Re: Christians who make my skin crawl!
« Reply #26 on: February 12, 2018, 10:22:40 AM »
Jacob Rees Mogg. I think some thing about him if I'm honest.

floo

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Re: Christians who make my skin crawl!
« Reply #27 on: February 12, 2018, 11:33:41 AM »
I was just thinking exactly the same as I read this thread (for the first time): there are also probably politicians, crown-green bowlers, lorry drivers, macrame enthusiasts and people who enjoy the music of Mozart who behave badly too - as you say, so what, and why Christians get a special mention in this regard in this OP beats me!

Because this is the Christian board!

Gordon

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Re: Christians who make my skin crawl!
« Reply #28 on: February 12, 2018, 11:46:56 AM »
Because this is the Christian board!

So it is, but it isn't an anti-Christian board: you expressed a personal point of view in relation to some Christians but you've haven't explained how your personal objections in relation to some Christians differs from any similar objections that might be applied to any other group by anyone else.

As such it seems like all you are really saying is that you personally find some Christians to be distasteful, which is no more than a Marmite observation.     

Nearly Sane

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Re: Christians who make my skin crawl!
« Reply #29 on: February 12, 2018, 12:01:21 PM »
The people across the pond seem to be much more tolerant of the extremes of Christianity than most of us would be here in the UK. ::) The Landover Baptist Church sewer rats, for instance.

Wasn't Hitler supposed to have been a Christian?


I think you mean Westboro


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Landover_Baptist_Church

floo

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Re: Christians who make my skin crawl!
« Reply #30 on: February 12, 2018, 12:07:19 PM »
So it is, but it isn't an anti-Christian board: you expressed a personal point of view in relation to some Christians but you've haven't explained how your personal objections in relation to some Christians differs from any similar objections that might be applied to any other group by anyone else.

As such it seems like all you are really saying is that you personally find some Christians to be distasteful, which is no more than a Marmite observation.   

I am NOT anti-Christian, even though I am an agnostic. As I have stated, of course not all Christians are bad people, there are quite a number for whom I have a lot of respect. As Christianity is supposed to stand for something good, I was pointing out that the Christians who try to force their faith down the throats of other people, whilst behaving in a reprehensible manner themselves, are bringing the whole faith into disrepute.

This is a particular beef of mine, sorry if I am getting up the noses of others. Please feel free to remove this thread.

Rhiannon

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Re: Christians who make my skin crawl!
« Reply #31 on: February 12, 2018, 12:14:16 PM »
I find describing people as sewer rats distasteful.

floo

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Re: Christians who make my skin crawl!
« Reply #32 on: February 12, 2018, 12:18:01 PM »
I find describing people as sewer rats distasteful.

Considering how the Landover Baptist mob have behaved, I think that description was polite.

Rhiannon

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Re: Christians who make my skin crawl!
« Reply #33 on: February 12, 2018, 12:22:08 PM »
Considering how the Landover Baptist mob have behaved, I think that description was polite.

You don’t mean Landover.

Nearly Sane

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Re: Christians who make my skin crawl!
« Reply #34 on: February 12, 2018, 12:25:02 PM »
Considering how the Landover Baptist mob have behaved, I think that description was polite.
As already pointed out I think you mean Westboro


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Landover_Baptist_Church


Gordon

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Re: Christians who make my skin crawl!
« Reply #35 on: February 12, 2018, 12:25:24 PM »
Considering how the Landover Baptist mob have behaved, I think that description was polite.

LR - the Landover Baptist Church is a spoof of fundamentalist Christianity.

Do you mean Westboro?

floo

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Re: Christians who make my skin crawl!
« Reply #36 on: February 12, 2018, 12:28:09 PM »
You don’t mean Landover.

Sorry I am more senile than I realised today, APOLOGIES. :o  :-[ I meant Westboro.

bluehillside Retd.

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Re: Christians who make my skin crawl!
« Reply #37 on: February 12, 2018, 01:15:50 PM »
Hi Gordon,

Quote
LR - the Landover Baptist Church is a spoof of fundamentalist Christianity.

How on earth would you go about spoofing something that's beyond parody?
"Don't make me come down there."

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Gordon

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Re: Christians who make my skin crawl!
« Reply #38 on: February 12, 2018, 01:26:33 PM »
Hi Gordon,

How on earth would you go about spoofing something that's beyond parody?

They've done quite a good job - some of it is hilarious.

They also offer useful advice: such as this for Christian men about to go on a date.

http://www.landoverbaptist.org/news0701/dating.html

jeremyp

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Re: Christians who make my skin crawl!
« Reply #39 on: February 12, 2018, 08:35:29 PM »
So no answer?
Does there have to be a point?
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SteveH

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Re: Christians who make my skin crawl!
« Reply #40 on: February 15, 2018, 01:54:43 PM »
You don’t mean Landover.
It's a spoof website. You've been had.
I have a pet termite. His name is Clint. Clint eats wood.

Nearly Sane

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Re: Christians who make my skin crawl!
« Reply #41 on: February 15, 2018, 01:56:31 PM »
It's a spoof website. You've been had.
Rhiannon hadn't been - that was why she was pointing out that LR didn't/shouldn't mean Landover

SteveH

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Re: Christians who make my skin crawl!
« Reply #42 on: February 15, 2018, 01:57:41 PM »
Rhiannon hadn't been - that was why she was pointing out that Floo didn't/shouldn't mean Landover
Oops! My mistake. I meant LR, but quoted Rhiannon instead. Sorry!
I have a pet termite. His name is Clint. Clint eats wood.

bluehillside Retd.

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Re: Christians who make my skin crawl!
« Reply #43 on: February 15, 2018, 04:32:50 PM »
Actually what makes my “skin crawl” is people who act from positions of certainty, about anything. As there’s no known logical path to it (because there’s no way to eliminate the possibility of an unknown unknown that would falsify you) certainty requires faith or dogma.

And the claims of faith/dogma aren’t investigable, so aren’t falsification apt. All they offer is, “take my word for it” which means that epistemically they’re no better than guessing.

And faith/dogma is often the province of religion (though by no means exclusively so).

And lots of religious people are Christians (though of course other religions are available).

And sometimes those Christians are fundamentalists (though by no means all of them).

And they’re the ones who make my skin crawl. Non-fundamentalists who privilege faith over guessing seem to me to provide cover for the fundies, but I just look askance at them rather than experience dermatological discomfort.   
« Last Edit: February 15, 2018, 04:45:11 PM by bluehillside Retd. »
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Walt Zingmatilder

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Re: Christians who make my skin crawl!
« Reply #44 on: February 15, 2018, 04:50:30 PM »
Actually what makes my “skin crawl” is people who act from positions of certainty, about anything. As there’s no logical path to it (because there’s no way to eliminate the possibility of an unknown unknown that would falsify you) certainty requires faith or dogma.

And the claims of faith/dogma aren’t investigable, so aren’t falsification apt. All they offer is, “take my word for it” which means that epistemically they’re no better than guessing.

And faith/dogma is often the province of religion (though by no means exclusively so).

And lots of religious people are Christians (though of course other religions are available).

And sometimes those Christians are fundamentalists (though by no means all of them).

And they’re the ones who make my skin crawl. Non-fundamentalists who privilege faith over guessing seem to me to provide cover for the fundies, but I just look askance at them rather than experience dermatological discomfort.   
Unknown unknowns? Isn't the term unknown sufficient here? I think you may have stumbled on something we have to take as seriously as say an atheist takes a possible God seriously.

Secondly. I don't think any Christian here would have you take their word for it rather than you seek and find for yourself. IMHO that's a strawman you have there

bluehillside Retd.

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Re: Christians who make my skin crawl!
« Reply #45 on: February 15, 2018, 05:46:24 PM »
"Don't make me come down there."

God

Rhiannon

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Re: Christians who make my skin crawl!
« Reply #46 on: February 15, 2018, 06:11:32 PM »
Certainty only bothers me when it’s judgemental and affects others. If I’m certain the earth is flat it hurts nobody. If I’m certain that I can judge people because I don’t like who they are or due to certain aspects of their lifestyle then I am polluting society with my bigotry. That’s not exclusively a religious thing.

bluehillside Retd.

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Re: Christians who make my skin crawl!
« Reply #47 on: February 15, 2018, 06:20:36 PM »
Hi Rhi,

Quote
Certainty only bothers me when it’s judgemental and affects others. If I’m certain the earth is flat it hurts nobody. If I’m certain that I can judge people because I don’t like who they are or due to certain aspects of their lifestyle then I am polluting society with my bigotry.

I agree. That's why I said, "people who act from positions of certainty...". It's the "act" bit that's the point.

Quote
That’s not exclusively a religious thing.

Indeed, as I said several times.
"Don't make me come down there."

God

Gordon

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Re: Christians who make my skin crawl!
« Reply #48 on: February 15, 2018, 06:29:17 PM »
Unknown unknowns? Isn't the term unknown sufficient here? I think you may have stumbled on something we have to take as seriously as say an atheist takes a possible God seriously.

Secondly. I don't think any Christian here would have you take their word for it rather than you seek and find for yourself. IMHO that's a strawman you have there

'Unknown unknowns' is a well-established expression, notably used by the US politician Donald Rumsfeld who said:

Quote
There are known knowns. These are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say, there are things that we know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know we don't know.

https://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/donald_rumsfeld_148142

bluehillside Retd.

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Re: Christians who make my skin crawl!
« Reply #49 on: February 15, 2018, 06:35:59 PM »
Hi Gordon,

Quote
'Unknown unknowns' is a well-established expression, notably used by the US politician Donald Rumsfeld who said:

It's just Vlad amusing himself as only he can. See my Reply 57.
"Don't make me come down there."

God