How The Modern World Makes Us Mentally Ill

[Walter]

I have one of those days where if I said look how green the grass is, people would arguing it wasn't green, it was hujok

maybe that's because you're just as much of  a twat as I am  or maybe  they have never been able to see the colours

[Nearly Sane]

maybe that's because you're just as much of  a twat as I am  or maybe  they have never been able to see the colours

Pretty much certainly as much of a twat. But today oh, the idiocy!!!! (And none of that, OK very very little of that was on here)

[Walter]

I can only say those posts where you appear to be not the character you have created are my favourites. Maybe you need to send more through the portal?

perhaps, but where's the fun in that , some folk on here think Walter is a real person , if I let more through the portal then people would begin to see the real me and I don't want that .

[Nearly Sane]

perhaps, but where's the fun in that , some folk on here think Walter is a real person , if I let more through the portal then people would begin to see the real me and I don't want that .

That's my favouritest post.

[Walter]

That's my favouritest post.

I know .

[Nearly Sane]

I know .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ZnQQF7ucdM

[Walter]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ZnQQF7ucdM

ahh , dental intervention at an early age is vital for adult appearances on TOTP

[Walt Zingmatilder]

if you'd read the Koran would you have become a Muslim?

I could read it all now and have read a fair bit of it. It doesn't do anything for me. That was the point though the OT and NT didn't use to do anything for me and then it started to.

As I had time as a theist without personal knowledge of Christ I wonder how that was essentially any different from Judaism or Islam.

[Walter]

I could read it all now and have read a fair bit of it. It doesn't do anything for me. That was the point though the OT and NT didn't use to do anything for me and then it started to.

As I had time as a theist without personal knowledge of Christ I wonder how that was essentially any different from Judaism or Islam.

'personal knowledge of Christ'  . Have you any idea how sad and ridiculous that sounds ? It's only because it's 'religious you can get away with saying it in public without being advised to seek psychiatric help.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

'personal knowledge of Christ'  . Have you any idea how sad and ridiculous that sounds ? It's only because it's 'religious you can get away with saying it in public without being advised to seek psychiatric help.

Stalinists saw religion as a psychiatric problem. Shouldn't you be out clog dancing?

[Stranger]

Stalinists saw religion as a psychiatric problem.

Now Vlad, you wouldn't be attempting an association fallacy, would you?

It's difficult to deny that many religious claims would be viewed very differently if seen in one, or a small number, of individuals - including your claim of "personal knowledge" of somebody who died 2000 years ago.

"This to me is the true horror of religion, it allows perfectly decent and sane people to believe by the billions what only lunatics could believe on their own. If you wake up tomorrow morning thinking that saying a few Latin words over your pancakes is going to turn them into the body of Elvis Presley - you have lost your mind. But if you think more or less the same thing about a cracker and the body of Jesus you're just a Catholic."

-- Sam Harris

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Now Vlad, you wouldn't be attempting an association fallacy, would you?

Are you thence saying that what motivated the Stalinists to suggest that religious people were mentally incapable cannot possibly be what motivates Walter to suggest it? or Sam Harris?

[wigginhall]

Now Vlad, you wouldn't be attempting an association fallacy, would you?

It's difficult to deny that many religious claims would be viewed very differently if seen in one, or a small number, of individuals - including your claim of "personal knowledge" of somebody who died 2000 years ago.

"This to me is the true horror of religion, it allows perfectly decent and sane people to believe by the billions what only lunatics could believe on their own. If you wake up tomorrow morning thinking that saying a few Latin words over your pancakes is going to turn them into the body of Elvis Presley - you have lost your mind. But if you think more or less the same thing about a cracker and the body of Jesus you're just a Catholic."

-- Sam Harris

It's an interesting point, and has been dealt with in psychiatry (to an extent), by citing cultural influence.   For example, in New Zealand, if a Maori patient tells a psychiatrist that he talks to his ancestors, the psychiatrist will take into account the traditional ancestor reverence practised by Maoris, (whakapapa). 

In fact, some psychiatric definitions of 'delusion' exempt traditional beliefs and practices.   So if a Western patient claims to have talked to the virgin Mary, this might be covered.   I suppose if they claim to be her, they might be concerned.

An example of psychiatric definitions:

A false personal belief that is not subject to reason or contradictory evidence and is not explained by a person's usual cultural and religious concepts (so that, for example, it is not an article of faith).

(from medicine.net).

[Stranger]

Are you thence saying that what motivated the Stalinists to suggest that religious people were mentally incapable cannot possibly be what motivates Walter to suggest it? or Sam Harris?

Neither Walter (in his post) nor Sam Harris (in the quote I posted) actually said that religious people are mentally incapable (neither did I).

Now go away and read about the association fallacy and explain why you brought up Stalinists...

[wigginhall]

In any case, the Soviets used psychiatry on quite a lot of people, if they were suspected of dissent.  Being anti-Soviet could be viewed both as a criminal act, and as 'sluggish schizophrenia', whatever that means.  Wiki calls the psychiatrists who did this 'the medical arm of the Gulag state'.   Whether they really saw religion as an illness, I don't know.

The Wiki article looks quite good.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_abuse_of_psychiatry_in_the_Soviet_Union

[Walter]

Are you thence saying that what motivated the Stalinists to suggest that religious people were mentally incapable cannot possibly be what motivates Walter to suggest it? or Sam Harris?

another example of why I rarely respond to your posts . What is wrong with you??

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Neither Walter (in his post) nor Sam Harris (in the quote I posted) actually said that religious people are mentally incapable (neither did I).

Now go away and read about the association fallacy and explain why you brought up Stalinists...

No but IMHO they suggest it and suggest was the word I used.

[Walter]

No but IMHO they suggest it and suggest was the word I used.

read the words I wrote , not what you think I wrote .

do you know what , I cant be bothered .

[Walt Zingmatilder]

It's an interesting point, and has been dealt with in psychiatry (to an extent), by citing cultural influence.   For example, in New Zealand, if a Maori patient tells a psychiatrist that he talks to his ancestors, the psychiatrist will take into account the traditional ancestor reverence practised by Maoris, (whakapapa). 

Couldn't the psychiatrist just whack it onto his fee?

[jeremyp]

yet again Ippy I am asking a question.

Once in a while you might try answering one. It would make debates with you more constructive.

[ippy]

Once in a while you might try answering one. It would make debates with you more constructive.

Hi there jeremyp, I've gone back to this post you've referred to and it's just another one of those posts that Vlad keeps on spewing out ad infinitum, no I didn't answer this specific post of Vlad's, but I've tried so many times to give him a full explanation of all he is asking for in that post, it has been like talking to a brick wall, a waste of time, so inevitably most of us would think much the same as myself, what's the point of going in again.

Regards ippy 

[jeremyp]

Hi there jeremyp, I've gone back to this post you've referred to and it's just another one of those posts that Vlad keeps on spewing out ad infinitum, no I didn't answer this specific post of Vlad's, but I've tried so many times to give him a full explanation of all he is asking for in that post, it has been like talking to a brick wall, a waste of time, so inevitably most of us would think much the same as myself, what's the point of going in again.

Regards ippy

Are you mistakenly thinking my post was addressed to you?

I was responding to Vlad who, by his own admission asks lots of questions, and yet the number of questions asked of him that he has failed to answer is astronomical.

[ippy]

Are you mistakenly thinking my post was addressed to you?

I was responding to Vlad who, by his own admission asks lots of questions, and yet the number of questions asked of him that he has failed to answer is astronomical.

Looks like I read you wrong, well there you go.

Regards ippy