Driving Instructors

[Humph Warden Bennett]

From the Beeb

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/newsbeat-43096970

This does strike me as being OTT. Most of this article refers to inappropriate behaviour, and it is my understanding that most allegations against driving instructors involve bullying, rather than anything else. Also driving schools will happily change instructors on request so as to keep a customer. If you read an earlier article, it refers to one concerned parent.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-41751368

[jeremyp]

Surely the same rules should apply as in any student teacher relationship? A teacher having sexual relations with one of their seventeen year old pupils is likely to get fired. Why not apply the same standards here?

[Humph Warden Bennett]

A driving school student is a paying customer, quite unlike a school pupil.

[floo]

Surely the same rules should apply as in any student teacher relationship? A teacher having sexual relations with one of their seventeen year old pupils is likely to get fired. Why not apply the same standards here?

I agree.

[Nearly Sane]

A driving school student is a paying customer, quite unlike a school pupil.

Don't see how that changes things.

[Humph Warden Bennett]

Don't see how that changes things.
 

A driving school pupil is there because s/he wants to be there, not because s/he has to be there by law, and is a customer paying for a service.  What about a guitar teacher?

We are not talking about inappropriate behaviour, we are talking consensual relationships. Seventeen year olds are allowed to have consensual relationships.

[floo]

It is more than likely it is the parents who are paying for their 17 year old offspring to have driving lessons.

[jeremyp]

A driving school student is a paying customer, quite unlike a school pupil.

So you are saying that abusing a position of authority to gain sexual favours is acceptable if the victim is paying for your services.

What about students in independent schools? What about students at universities? They pay. Universities also have rules against student teacher relationships.

[Humph Warden Bennett]

So you are saying that abusing a position of authority to gain sexual favours is acceptable if the victim is paying for your services.

I am not saying that at all! I am saying that it is wrong to threaten driving instructors with the sack if they have a consensual relationship. As I mentioned in my OP the article is referring to inappropriate behaviour rather than the subject matter of the headline.

[floo]

I am not saying that at all! I am saying that it is wrong to threaten driving instructors with the sack if they have a consensual relationship. As I mentioned in my OP the article is referring to inappropriate behaviour rather than the subject matter of the headline.

When a person is in a position of authority, as when teaching someone to drive, it is wrong to have a sexual relationanship with them, consensual or otherwise. This is especially true if they are teaching a 17 year old to drive, as the instructor is likely to be a good few years older than the youngster.

[Robbie]

It's certainly unprofessional of the instructors to make any sort of advances towards young pupils even if only by innuendo. Nothing new about it though! Happened a lot when I & schoolfriends were learning to drive in late 1970s.

[Humph Warden Bennett]

When a person is in a position of authority, as when teaching someone to drive, it is wrong to have a sexual relationanship with them, consensual or otherwise. This is especially true if they are teaching a 17 year old to drive, as the instructor is likely to be a good few years older than the youngster.

What about a piano teacher? They are notoriously more bad tempered and prone to rage than are level headed driving instructors. Should a piano teacher be barred from a romantic relationship?

I remember a while ago I mentioned that I had worked for Wal Mart, who made everybody sign an agreement that they would not "date" an employee of inferior rank to themselves, and the general consensus was that the same interfered with individual liberty.

[floo]

What about a piano teacher? They are notoriously more bad tempered and prone to rage than are level headed driving instructors. Should a piano teacher be barred from a romantic relationship?

I remember a while ago I mentioned that I had worked for Wal Mart, who made everybody sign an agreement that they would not "date" an employee of inferior rank to themselves, and the general consensus was that the same interfered with individual liberty.

Teachers should not have romantic liaisons with their pupils. A university lecturer can be in the deep proverbial if they get romantically attached to a student, even though they are both adults. 

[Humph Warden Bennett]

It's certainly unprofessional of the instructors to make any sort of advances towards young pupils even if only by innuendo. Nothing new about it though! Happened a lot when I & schoolfriends were learning to drive in late 1970s.

I remember when I was learning to drive in the seventies, the young lady who lived :across the road from me told me:

"I took my driving test, I wore a skimpy top & the shortest skirt that I had, I looked as tarty as I could,,but he still failed me".

It was not, and is not, one way.

[Rhiannon]

I remember when I was learning to drive in the seventies, the young lady who lived :across the road from me told me:

"I took my driving test, I wore a skimpy top & the shortest skirt that I had, I looked as tarty as I could,,but he still failed me".

It was not, and is not, one way.

So wearing a short skirt etc is akin to sexually exploiting someone much younger who can be seen as vulnerable.

There’s a reason many women ask for female instructors when learning to drive. I did. Let’s see if you can guess why.

[Robbie]

HWB , doubt any girl would think let alone say something like that now.

You mentioned piano teachers, I knew a woman married to a music teacher who got into a couple of relationships with young pupils. The marriage didn't last, it was devastating for her; she had absolutely no idea and the lessons took place in a room in their house!

Same old story comes up in so many different circumstances.

Rhi - good idea to ask for a woman instructor, there are too few of them.

[Rhiannon]

HWB , doubt any girl would think let alone say something like that now.

You mentioned piano teachers, I knew a woman married to a music teacher who got into a couple of relationships with young pupils. The marriage didn't last, it was devastating for her; she had absolutely no idea and the lessons took place in a room in their house!

Same old story comes up in so many different circumstances.

Rhi - good idea to ask for a woman instructor, there are too few of them.

I wasn’t trying to strike a blow for equality. Good point though.

[Humph Warden Bennett]

So wearing a short skirt etc is akin to sexually exploiting someone much younger who can be seen as vulnerable.

There’s a reason many women ask for female instructors when learning to drive. I did. Let’s see if you can guess why.

Did you understand my post? I suspect not.

The young woman was trying to influence the Driving Examiner. He did his job properly. The young woman tried to influence him to do otherwise.

Now do you understand?

[Rhiannon]

Did you understand my post? I suspect not.

The young woman was trying to influence the Driving Examiner. He did his job properly. The young woman tried to influence him to do otherwise.

Now do you understand?

You don’t like women, do you?

I’ll ask you again. Why do you think I asked for a female driving instructor?

[Humph Warden Bennett]

You don’t like women, do you?

I’ll ask you again. Why do you think I asked for a female driving instructor?

Typical feminist response. A woman tries to influence a man to break his code of employment, he refuses, but it is still his fault.

Feminism is a joke.

[Robbie]

No Humph it isn't.

Obviously the girl was wrong to think she could use feminine wiles to influence the examiner's decision but he was a professional man who wasn't swayed. So that's a good story & no doubt the girl learned her lesson.

I've known of girls years ago who've tried the same for different things (one at a job interview  ) and it didn't work. They don't do it again. It's wrong but it happens because they hear stories about others who've tried it successfully, don't have enough confidence in their own abilities and personalities. Sad really.

[Rhiannon]

Typical feminist response. A woman tries to influence a man to break his code of employment, he refuses, but it is still his fault.

Feminism is a joke.

I was raped by a man whose car I was stupid enough to get into when I was 15. When I learned to drive I decided not to put myself in a situation where a man could get me to an isolated place and do it again.

Assuming your neighbour wasn’t being tongue in cheek, trying to influence an examiner us not the same thing as being in the receiving end of unwanted sexual attention, groping and predation.

But haters gonna hate and you do it magnificently.

[Gordon]

I remember when I was learning to drive in the seventies, the young lady who lived :across the road from me told me:

"I took my driving test, I wore a skimpy top & the shortest skirt that I had, I looked as tarty as I could,,but he still failed me".

It was not, and is not, one way.

How can you generalise from an isolated example? Even then, she might have failed her test simply due to having poor driving skills (irrespective of her clothing).

Both my daughters had male driving instructors and both passed their driving tests (one first time, and the other second time) and with no concerns about their (different) instructors. All this means is that, based on their experiences, these instructors were professional in their approach to teaching them to drive. 

There may be rogue driving instructors, but the assumption that young women can as a tactic charm their way to a pass seems speculative.

[Robbie]

I was raped by a man whose car I was stupid enough to get into when I was 15. When I learned to drive I decided not to put myself in a situation where a man could get me to an isolated place and do it again.

You poor thing Rhi, a horrible experience. Something similar happened to me but in a house where there was a party, he got me alone in a room, had told me he wanted me to see something. Sounds naive of me but I thought it was something interesting, maybe a painting. Oh I could laugh now but not with humour.

My motto afterwards - make sure you know the way out, ie can see a clear exit, and always have your fare home.

[Rhiannon]

You poor thing Rhi, a horrible experience. Something similar happened to me but in a house where there was a party, he got me alone in a room, had told me he wanted me to see something. Sounds naive of me but I thought it was something interesting, maybe a painting. Oh I could laugh now but not with humour.

My motto afterwards - make sure you know the way out, ie can see a clear exit, and always have your fare home.

I’m sorry, Robbie, and look at us, blaming ourselves for being stupid and naive, when it so wasn’t our fault in any way at all.